Lady Gaga Judas uses synth-riff loop from Vengeance

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ikeaboy
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Re: Lady Gaga Judas uses synth-riff loop from Vengeance

Post by ikeaboy » Thu Jun 09, 2011 10:40 am

cmcpress wrote:yyeeeeeaaah.

But i tell you what's more outrageous. There's this group called the sugarhill gang. All they did was take a Chic look and talk over the top! How mad is that? What about that group NWA, takes a break by the band the Winstons and don't even pay to use it???

Outrageous. No talent hacks.
The Sugar Hill Gang were first to the idea they deserve the credit. The Amen is vital strand of musical DNA. There's recontextualising found sounds and sources on one hand and passing off someone else's efforts as your own on the other, as in the Vengence loop example. That quote from the producer :lol:

drewbixcube
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Re: Lady Gaga Judas uses synth-riff loop from Vengeance

Post by drewbixcube » Fri Jul 01, 2011 5:39 pm

Where do you draw the line? Were people getting mad at Beethoven because the C# minor scale had been used before? I can almost hear that conversation... "C# minor? Man, my piano's had that scale for years. Beethoven's a hack for using it." Granted, this analogy is a bit of a stretch in terms of technological advances and Beethoven's sheer genius. However, as mentioned before, I think the haters hate because A) they didn't think to use it, or B) they weren't paid to use it.

Anyone remember Steve Angello's Knas track?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ktbR66gMRrw - check out 1:22

Here's a challenge for the board: If you own the sample pack in question, use the riff in question in your own song and make big money off of it. There's no way you can get sued for using the riff as you bought the license to use it with the sample pack. It's the ultimate finger to these big time lazy producers.

On a side note, in regards to the amen break, if you haven't seen this video it's a good watch:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5SaFTm2bcac

H20nly
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Re: Lady Gaga Judas uses synth-riff loop from Vengeance

Post by H20nly » Fri Jul 01, 2011 6:58 pm

^ nice.

regretfullySaid
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Re: Lady Gaga Judas uses synth-riff loop from Vengeance

Post by regretfullySaid » Fri Jul 01, 2011 7:40 pm

This made me think about the similar thing with Usher using stock Garageband loops.

I think there's a message we're missing here. It isn't that they're obviously ripped, it's the fact that they're still hits, because there's a rehashed frontperson singing to the rehashed music. Sort of liek the old "My kid could do that" argument when a painting of a red square sells for 11 million gummy bears.
It's like "well yeah, but they didn't"
Besides, I'm pretty sure at least 90% of Usher and Gaga fans don't really care that much about music or hear it the way we do.
Another thing is, if some kid has garageband and notices that a star is using the same program or samples he is, it gives them the hope that they, too, can write a hit. As long as they follow the right formula and have a semi-attractive and talented singer.

Wait has this been said already? Haven't read the thread in awhile...

This part, though...
"Finding the right sounds, we make sure not to use pre processed sounds, like the sounds you get off whatever sample cd's or software synthesizers or stock sounds we found, because we wanted to make sure the album sounded differently, sonically, and everything about it, just the way we put it together."
Either he's completely full of shit or there's so many people with their hands in the pot they decided to keep that Vengeance track that was first intended as a place-holder.
Either way, it's Lady Fucking Gaga, why bother wasting breath on her?

Is that sample like the main hook of the song or something?
My habitual environments don't usually have that shit playing so I wouldn't know, even if it's on the radio 5 times an hour.
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LoopStationZebra
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Re: Lady Gaga Judas uses synth-riff loop from Vengeance

Post by LoopStationZebra » Fri Jul 01, 2011 8:14 pm

shadx312 wrote: why bother wasting breath on her?

Because she's insanely fucking talented?

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Re: Lady Gaga Judas uses synth-riff loop from Vengeance

Post by LoopStationZebra » Fri Jul 01, 2011 8:20 pm

I mean, I don't mean to be a dick or anything but 99% of her detractors on this forum don't even fucking play a kazoo; let alone the piano.

Don't like her music? Fine. Don't like that one of her programmers or whatever used a Vengeance riff? Whatever.

Only the supremely ignorant - musicianship wise, anyway - wouldn't at least give her enormous props for musical, vocal, and songwriting ability.

Ahh, well. I suppose:

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Re: Lady Gaga Judas uses synth-riff loop from Vengeance

Post by LoopStationZebra » Fri Jul 01, 2011 8:24 pm

Shit...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lvib07TvJ1w

Okay, so she's no Aretha Franklin. But how anyone can watch that clip and say she doesn't have talent is just fucked.

No FX. No Studio. No AutoTune. Just a live mic. Christ.

Oh...and the lyrics are pretty kick ass as well. You know, as long as I'm shilling for Lady Gaga and all...

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H20nly
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Re: Lady Gaga Judas uses synth-riff loop from Vengeance

Post by H20nly » Fri Jul 01, 2011 8:38 pm

LoopStationZebra wrote:I mean, I don't mean to be a dick or anything but 99% of her detractors on this forum don't even fucking play a kazoo; let alone the piano.
:lol: hee hee...

they can play the shit out of the QWERTY keyboard though! have mercy!

regretfullySaid
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Re: Lady Gaga Judas uses synth-riff loop from Vengeance

Post by regretfullySaid » Fri Jul 01, 2011 8:59 pm

I can't check the youtube clip since I'm still at work.

I know she's talented and smart. I know she can play, write and sing and I know she's talented at wearing stuff people think is wack and she's "controversial" but the media and the masses go apeshit over the stupidest little things it's all hyperbole to me. I've already been through all that in the 80's and 90's with Madonna.
I'm not really hating on her, it's more that she's such a big deal.
Anyone who upsets the Catholic church gets a +1 in my book. But like that's hard, either.
I just don't see or hear enough substance to delve deeper, compared to say, the heyday of Bjork with her 2nd and 3rd albums.

I'll admit it's pretty douchy of me to not giver her more credit without hearing all her stuff, though. Just don't care:)

And I sure as hell wouldn't use someones star status as a gauge to their talent, either. There's plenty of unnoticed talents out all over the world. there's some that choose to not be in the limelight because they don't want to have to deal with all the bullshit that comes with it ie Kate Bush. And I'm sure most of the "stars" who use Live don't spend much time on the forums either and I don't think I need to explain why.

Insanely fucking talented, though? Really? Have I been missing out?

I'm sure I'll have a few hour window this weekend for someone to school me with Gagas albums to find out.

Out of curiosity on a different tangent; would you see her the same way if she played her songs on guitar(fingerpicked if appropriate) as far as talent ability?
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Donnie
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Re: Lady Gaga Judas uses synth-riff loop from Vengeance

Post by Donnie » Fri Jul 01, 2011 11:54 pm

Shes definitely talented, she just doesn't use that talent in a way I can appreciate.

I feel the exact same way about other commercial dance artists like Deadmau5 or Skrillex (for example)

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Re: Lady Gaga Judas uses synth-riff loop from Vengeance

Post by LoopStationZebra » Sat Jul 02, 2011 1:25 am

@shadx312
Well, Gaga mostly operates in the dance genre, so right away that's an easy target. I get that. Yet...even then...I think even something as simple as many of her arrangements are far more creative than the paint-by-numbers crap from 99% of other dance genre related artists.

She's also well known for completely - and fairly spontaneously - doing different versions of songs in a live setting. Check out live versions of Born This Way on YouTube when you get a chance: You will absolutely never see the same version twice. In fact, sometimes they are radically different. I've read that she will often decide just before a performance how it will go. That's fucking cool and gets an A+ in my book. Jesus, there's so called 'respected' artists who fucking can't help themselves and play the same shit the same way every night. lol. :x

You've mentioned Bjork and Kate Bush - two artists that are easily in my top 20 favs list. The creativity present in those 2 is beyond reproach, but I think Gaga is right up there..just in a very different medium = pop dance music.

She's also a huge synth fan. There's some interviews out there in which it's quite evident that she's a fan of vintage gear and synths in general. Vengeance nonsense aside, she actually programs quite a bit of her live sounds. She also loves the Roland AX keytar and has used it often in shows. Another A+ :lol:

Not sure what you were getting at with the guitar and talent thing.....??

One more thing and then I'll stop: Unlike an enormous amount of twat pop stars who think that the Universe began with them, she has quite publically given full credit to her influences such as Madonna (of course), Bowie, Queen, etc. She even mentioned some fairly obscure Ramones tracks in one interview, lol. Another A+

What can I say? I'm a fan. And she's got a nice pooper.

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Machinesworking
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Re: Lady Gaga Judas uses synth-riff loop from Vengeance

Post by Machinesworking » Sat Jul 02, 2011 3:32 am

On LSZs side on this one.

Though I think it's lazy to use loops, why wouldn't they show up sometimes in pop music? The other side of the coin is that maybe the loop inspired the rest of the song, so is it less disingenuous to hide the loop after the song is finished?

...of course the third side is that it's not something I would do, because the kind of music I do relies more on 'honest' creativity than solid polished beats and grooves.

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Re: Lady Gaga Judas uses synth-riff loop from Vengeance

Post by nathannn » Sun Jul 03, 2011 3:54 am

why would some one make a song about how much they love judas? i could care less about the synth but judas went down in history as being the biggest back stabber on the face of the planet. he kissed the governments butt and snitched on his friend.
she is a mental case.
oh and the song sucks. its boring been done, sound like everything else club dance crap thats been going on since the late 90's.
also she is not talented. she is just so mental that she does not even know that she sounds just like every one else.
thats all it takes. if you are mental then its easy for you to get up on stage and look like a idiot and sing crap that will sell air time to commercials. you are too mental to know any better and to care. you would think some one playing a wash board and farting into a mic sounded good if you where as mental as her.
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Re: Lady Gaga Judas uses synth-riff loop from Vengeance

Post by Machinesworking » Sun Jul 03, 2011 4:52 am

@nathannn, I think it's best to look at musicians like Gaga in the context of their format. Gaga is a musician, she used to write this type of shameless pop for Britiny, Timberlake etc. She loves gay club music, go to any dance night at a gay club and you'll see. Me, I can't stand this stuff, but at least Gaga mostly writes the crap, and that IMO is a HUGE step up from all the ex Micky Mouse Club plastic Barbie and Ken doll types that usually end up fronting this type of pop. I'll never buy her stuff, not my thing, but I think she has potential to be more of a Elton John type pop star than most, which is OK comparitively.

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