the topic of topics: MIDI vs AUDIO ("what is music"?)

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9V
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the topic of topics: MIDI vs AUDIO ("what is music"?)

Post by 9V » Fri Aug 12, 2011 5:22 pm

IMO only MIDI tracks can be considered "music" in a sequencer. Audio tracks are not music, but sound. Scenario:

A class of children sits in an auditorium. On stage is a pianist playing a piano and singing. She (the pianist) is being accompanied by a man playing a VST on his laptop via a midi controller, he is playing a bassline. Next to them is young woman triggering drum loops on an old akai sampler. Next to *her* is a tape recorder playing back a collection of children's songs. Everyone on stage is performing in time with the tape.

Now, answer these:

1) Are the children in the audience listening to music?
2) The sounds the children are hearing, is it all music, or only partly?
3) Which of the four sound generating things on stage are musicians? Instruments?
4) Where is the music in this scenario?
5) Where in this scene does music stop being music?

beats me
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Re: the topic of topics: MIDI vs AUDIO ("what is music"?)

Post by beats me » Fri Aug 12, 2011 5:34 pm

I think you and my roommate would get along great.

http://forum.ableton.com/viewtopic.php?f=40&t=168268

pulsoc
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Re: the topic of topics: MIDI vs AUDIO ("what is music"?)

Post by pulsoc » Fri Aug 12, 2011 5:51 pm

9V wrote:IMO only MIDI tracks can be considered "music" in a sequencer. Audio tracks are not music, but sound. Scenario:

A class of children sits in an auditorium. On stage is a pianist playing a piano and singing. She (the pianist) is being accompanied by a man playing a VST on his laptop via a midi controller, he is playing a bassline. Next to them is young woman triggering drum loops on an old akai sampler. Next to *her* is a tape recorder playing back a collection of children's songs. Everyone on stage is performing in time with the tape.

Now, answer these:

1) Are the children in the audience listening to music?
2) The sounds the children are hearing, is it all music, or only partly?
3) Which of the four sound generating things on stage are musicians? Instruments?
4) Where is the music in this scenario?
5) Where in this scene does music stop being music?
1. No. The children are hearing music.
2. Some of the sounds are music.
3. Who started the tape recorder?
4. In the minds ear.
5. When they start playing Rebecca Black's Friday.

crofter
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Re: the topic of topics: MIDI vs AUDIO ("what is music"?)

Post by crofter » Fri Aug 12, 2011 5:58 pm

Has the pianist got nice tits? (could be relevant)
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9V
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Re: the topic of topics: MIDI vs AUDIO ("what is music"?)

Post by 9V » Fri Aug 12, 2011 6:27 pm

crofter wrote:Has the pianist got nice tits? (could be relevant)
i don't know, the question is not mine, a guy on PH forum asked that, because i think only midi tracks are music in a sequencer.

evaodland
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Re: the topic of topics: MIDI vs AUDIO ("what is music"?)

Post by evaodland » Fri Aug 12, 2011 6:43 pm

Music like time does not really exist...it is just a interpretation by our brain of vibrating atoms to keep us from dissolving.

9V
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Re: the topic of topics: MIDI vs AUDIO ("what is music"?)

Post by 9V » Fri Aug 12, 2011 7:21 pm

by the way, the question is not philosophical. It is technical. Because technically speaking (in a musical perspective) MIDI is still music, AUDIO is only sound.

crofter
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Re: the topic of topics: MIDI vs AUDIO ("what is music"?)

Post by crofter » Fri Aug 12, 2011 7:29 pm

Midi is control information and not music in itself, the sounds produced by such information controlling a midi sound device are no different to the same sounds recorded and played back as an audio file.
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9V
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Re: the topic of topics: MIDI vs AUDIO ("what is music"?)

Post by 9V » Fri Aug 12, 2011 7:35 pm

crofter wrote:Midi is control information and not music in itself, the sounds produced by such information controlling a midi sound device are no different to the same sounds recorded and played back as an audio file.
midi and music (the code) are in corrispondence. If you change a note, or a pause, or something musically related, midi parameters change and viceversa. You cannot do that with audio. So, midi is still music, audio is just sound: you can change audio parameters (the sound) in an audio track, but you cannot change musical elements (the music). Because audio is not music.

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Re: the topic of topics: MIDI vs AUDIO ("what is music"?)

Post by trevox » Fri Aug 12, 2011 7:41 pm

9V wrote:by the way, the question is not philosophical. It is technical. Because technically speaking (in a musical perspective) MIDI is still music, AUDIO is only sound.
Technically, Midi is a series of number lists. Saying midi is music is like saying the person playing an instrument is music. I think this topic is a bit silly. Music is simply a means of expressing oneself using sound, whether that be played Live or sequenced in some manner. And that level of expression is not (well should not be) limited to anything.

9V
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Re: the topic of topics: MIDI vs AUDIO ("what is music"?)

Post by 9V » Fri Aug 12, 2011 8:04 pm

technically, midi is a music interpreter, since music is a language. So MIDI is music, because you can compose music with midi. Audio is not music, audio is sound (something for sound engineers). Musicians write, read, edit music (score notes and/or MIDI events). So: midi tracks are still music (like score sheets); audio tracks are not music, but sound. Music is a language, sound is just a phisical phenomenon. IMO the ones who consider audio "music" don't understand what music is.

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Re: the topic of topics: MIDI vs AUDIO ("what is music"?)

Post by pulsoc » Fri Aug 12, 2011 8:14 pm

9V wrote:technically, midi is a music interpreter, since music is a language. So MIDI is music, because you can compose music with midi. .


I can compose music with a pen. I don't think that makes the pen music.

Are you saying a printed sheet of notation IS music? Clearly it is not, it is a map of the music.

rote fahne
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Re: the topic of topics: MIDI vs AUDIO ("what is music"?)

Post by rote fahne » Fri Aug 12, 2011 8:18 pm

Beethoven wrote music even after he had become deaf.

Its a matter of definition. For me a score is also music.

An audio file contains all the information of the music it represents, even more than a midi file or a score could do.

rote fahne
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Re: the topic of topics: MIDI vs AUDIO ("what is music"?)

Post by rote fahne » Fri Aug 12, 2011 8:21 pm

9V wrote:a guy on PH forum asked that, because i think only midi tracks are music in a sequencer.
Then why didnt you answer him there. :mrgreen:

9V
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Re: the topic of topics: MIDI vs AUDIO ("what is music"?)

Post by 9V » Fri Aug 12, 2011 8:23 pm

a pen is not music, but score sheet is music, because music is the language. You can EDIT music with the pen, or with an instrument (which are musical TOOLS). You cannot do that with audio signals. So midi is music, the score is music, the sound made with music (the so-called "music") is not music (unless played IN REAL TIME).
Last edited by 9V on Fri Aug 12, 2011 8:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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