Gay Forum Members

Discussion of anything not related to audio or music production
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leisuremuffin
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Re: Gay Forum Members

Post by leisuremuffin » Tue Jan 08, 2013 11:28 pm

and nathannn, i did say that you were probably just being ignorant and not intentionally hateful, but i won't back down from saying that your post was offensive and stupid. I understand that you think that it's just a joke about their musicianship, but the fact remains that you leveled the word fag at them as an insult. It's compounded by the fact that your targets were actually gay, but it wouldn't be somehow excused if they weren't.


.lm.
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nathannn
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Re: Gay Forum Members

Post by nathannn » Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:50 am

leisuremuffin wrote:and nathannn, i did say that you were probably just being ignorant and not intentionally hateful, but i won't back down from saying that your post was offensive and stupid. I understand that you think that it's just a joke about their musicianship, but the fact remains that you leveled the word fag at them as an insult. It's compounded by the fact that your targets were actually gay, but it wouldn't be somehow excused if they weren't.


.lm.
Here's the thing, once you get the ball rolling to take away one word from a group of people that may offend some people, you have to start taking away all offending words,even when the word is only used in the context of what they perceive as a joke. At that point it becomes ridiculous and censorship.
So in order for people never to use the word fag in a joke you have to take away all of these offending words (and combinations) that may offend people :

List of words you can not say anymore since you dont want to offend a single person:

fag
idiot
retard
uneducated
hillbilly
redneck
simpleton
imbecile
crazy
asshole
cracker
honkey
stupid
moron
hick
loser
jack ass
ass
gay
lesbian
lezbo
dyke
tranny
douche bag
shit head
hag
republican
old bag
old man
dumb fuck

ect ect ect.

So in order for you to practice what you are preaching you need to forbid yourself from using any of them words in a joke or directed at another human as an insult.

That said I dont like to purposely offend people but, I was trying to offend you when I told you to go fuck yourself so, I am apologizing for that... Unless you would literally like to go fuck yourself.
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leisuremuffin
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Re: Gay Forum Members

Post by leisuremuffin » Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:01 am

i don't think i have anything else to say on the matter. you don't understand and no one is going to make you understand. I think it's sad and unfortunate but i'm not surprised. good luck to you.
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nathannn
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Re: Gay Forum Members

Post by nathannn » Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:03 am

yeah same to you. :?
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Machinesworking
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Re: Gay Forum Members

Post by Machinesworking » Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:06 am

Skip to about 4:05, the beginning doesn't matter. Mint Invader posted this earlier.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v-55wC5dEnc

BTW Loops, I'm 100% certain that my lesbian roommate just doesn't give enough of a shit what some sausage party thinks one way or the other.
So getting her to read our nonsense? not gonna happen. If it had hot chicks, cute animals or gore pics then sure! :lol:

nathannn
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Re: Gay Forum Members

Post by nathannn » Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:18 am

Machinesworking wrote:Skip to about 4:05, the beginning doesn't matter. Mint Invader posted this earlier.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v-55wC5dEnc
Makes sense, but that really sounds like an urban legend to me.



I dont know how reliable this source is but this site also claims that it is an urban legend.
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=faggot
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leisuremuffin
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Re: Gay Forum Members

Post by leisuremuffin » Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:24 am

that is a scripted comedy bit, and that origin of the term faggot is not established as truth, but i think the important part of the clip to understand is where he explains that pretty much every gay man in america has had that word shouted at them during a very real threat of violence if not actual outright violence. That part is true.


.lm.
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nathannn
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Re: Gay Forum Members

Post by nathannn » Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:39 am

leisuremuffin wrote:that is a scripted comedy bit, and that origin of the term faggot is not established as truth, but i think the important part of the clip to understand is where he explains that pretty much every gay man in america has had that word shouted at them during a very real threat of violence if not actual outright violence. That part is true.


.lm.
Yeah that defiantly makes a lot of sense, I dont like apologizing for jokes, but I will try to wean myself from the word on the forum ( I rarely use it in real life anyways) if it happens to slip up in the future let me know and I will edit it.
As for the word gay, that may take another ten years.

btw the post you originally quoted me on is going on 5 years old, I feel in real life I have made some progress since then.
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leisuremuffin
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Re: Gay Forum Members

Post by leisuremuffin » Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:52 am

I actually really respect and appreciate that. And i understand, too, I honestly didn't think you were being intentionally hateful, but that is really the sort of thing that can bother people that have been on the wrong end of that word in a much worse situation.

as far as gay goes, i also understand how that word has come to be used to mean corny or stupid without any intended disrespect to the gay community. but it is still a little tough to have a word that describes a person's sexuality be used with such negative connotations. The idea might seem to equate actually being gay with being gay in the way you mean it when you don't mean gay. LOL! But honestly i find that far less offensive. In fact, i think someone would have to be really over sensitive to be offended by that in the absence of any other indicators of bad intent or underlying hate.



.lm.
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leisuremuffin
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Re: Gay Forum Members

Post by leisuremuffin » Wed Jan 09, 2013 2:00 am

also, yeah, i know it was a long time ago and i do believe that people change and grow up. I just remember being really pissed off about that thread because to me it was pretty obvious that those guys were actually gay and people were calling them fags and saying they were "anti-gay" and shit like that.

anyway, thanks, i do really appreciate you softening your position a bit.

.lm.
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Machinesworking
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Re: Gay Forum Members

Post by Machinesworking » Wed Jan 09, 2013 2:00 am

leisuremuffin wrote: as far as gay goes, i also understand how that word has come to be used to mean corny or stupid without any intended disrespect to the gay community. but it is still a little tough to have a word that describes a person's sexuality be used with such negative connotations. The idea might seem to equate actually being gay with being gay in the way you mean it when you don't mean gay. LOL! But honestly i find that far less offensive. In fact, i think someone would have to be really over sensitive to be offended by that in the absence of any other indicators of bad intent or underlying hate.
I think of it in terms of "white bread", "country" or "ghetto". It originally had racial or cultural bias as a focal point, but has moved on to mean a specific thing outside it's beginnings.

Machinesworking
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Re: Gay Forum Members

Post by Machinesworking » Wed Jan 09, 2013 7:06 am

funken wrote: The use of the word
Gay to mean weak, rubbish etc is not completely separate from the meaning homosexual. This use has therefore been strongly criticised by sections of the gay community.

Gays have had to put up with discrimination and abuse forever. The finally accepted the term gay. To then appropriate the word to mean rubbish is not helpful or progressive. You should not use it this way, just because it is an in word. The word might be meant innocently by a 12 year-old, but it has no place in that context in adult language.

Using gay to mean a situation you have no control over is a different matter, and is acceptable. Gay people do not choose to be gay. However not many people use this.
Gay as a negative slang for something doesn't mean rubbish or weak. It's specific, just like white bread, or ghetto or country.

I'm not going to use the Urban dictionary or any other source, so forgive the fact this is west coast dialect oriented, but here's a pretty good run down of the basic terms I mentioned:

white bread- heavily conformist, without style or substance, culturally inept.

gay - garish or awkward style, too much emphasis on style and not enough on substance, too insulated culturally. Can mean an overt dumbing down and emphasis on fun and hedonistic archetypes.

Ghetto- Cheap, old, or about to fail mechanically.

Country- hacked together quickly, repurposed awkwardly (the famous toilet as flower pot idea!), sloppy.

I do think this word should be used, if the others are OK then why should gay hold a higher place?


I get the argument that it's closer to say the way people will use jew, but I don't buy that it's at that same level in terms of hatefulness.
I certainly use it like my gay roommate does, to mean what I described above.

Machinesworking
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Re: Gay Forum Members

Post by Machinesworking » Wed Jan 09, 2013 7:50 am

funken wrote:Definition of gay
adjective (gayer, gayest),, blah blah
You unstoppable pedant you!

Like I said "west coast definition".
Plus, I would never rely on a stodgy institution to describe a slang term, period.

The point I was making is it's slowly but surely becoming a word that means something different in the context of slang, not in the context of it's original meaning, or even it's original use as an insult. "White bread" is a great example, in the 70's it was an insult directed towards all white people, then it became about the annoying part about white people, and now any race could be accused of doing something white bread. Hell I've used it to describe upper class suburbs here that have no substance or style.

Conversely the term gay in every day use as slang, not as a way to describe homosexuals, in my area refers almost exclusively to an awkward or overtly flashy style with no substance. To put it this way Blood on the Dance Floor's music is gay, Queen's music is not.

I realize it's at the point where it's still not kosher, but mark my words, in another ten years it will be common. To the point to where it's not just my more brazen gay friends who use it like that, but all of them.

docprosper
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Re: Gay Forum Members

Post by docprosper » Wed Jan 09, 2013 4:48 pm

funken wrote:I've started my own thread, I don't wanna get too serious in the Lounge. I can discuss hedgehogs though. I like hedgehogs.
http://www.seriousstuff.org/post/Totall ... trail=15#3
:roll:
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LoopStationZebra
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Re: Gay Forum Members

Post by LoopStationZebra » Wed Jan 09, 2013 5:00 pm

Comparing my thread to that thread is ridiculous.


omfg.


:roll:
I came for the :lol:
But stayed for the :x

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