The goal of marxism is tyranny of the masses, the collective rule. It has been proven over and over that the collective are painfully dangerous and open to manipulation. The fact of the matter is Marxism wants a utopia through everyone working towards a common goal and no thought for the self, an idea completely at odds with thousands of years of human evolution. You believe in a civil religion made up by an intellectualist bookish middle class prophet, and the more you realise there is no logical argument to what you are stating the more you will use obfuscation and quotes from your prophet to prove a point. How do you expect to win an argument without any kind of axiomatic logic path?Funk N. Furter wrote:The goal though, the long term goal. It's the same for most Marxists and most anarchists. Yes they have different ideas about how to get there. The goal of Marxism ultimately is no government.Machinesworking wrote:Not necessarily IMO the libertarian political spectrum chart is a great example of a better understanding of the differences in thought:Funk N. Furter wrote:
"The goal of anarchists is communism."
Communism to a degree has an authoritarian side, so resides in it's best form somewhere far left and middle low. Stalin etc. was middle left top, Hitler middle right top. Anarchists would be far left bottom, libertarians far right bottom.
What is scary to everyone is how close all dictatorial systems are in this chart to the systems we have in place now.
"In common with the founders of Socialism, Anarchists demand the abolition of all economic monopolies and the common ownership of the soil and all other means of production, the use of which must be available to all without distinction; for personal and social freedom is conceivable only on the basis of equal economic advantages for everybody. Within the Socialist movement itself the Anarchists represent the viewpoint that the war against capitalism must be at the same time a war against all institutions of political power, for in history economic exploitation has always gone hand in hand with political and social oppression.”
Rudolf Rocker, Anarcho-Syndicalism, pp. 17-18
http://www.marxists.org/glossary/terms/ ... #anarchism
I will ask the question again.
Do you believe that the initiation or threat of force is immoral?
if you answer no then everyone here can see you for the tyrant you are. If you answer yes then we can quite easily lead you down a logic path that shows you that the state and therefore Marxism is immoral.
I'm guessing you wont use a yes or no answer and will rather obfuscate and quote passages from books (none of us have the time nor inclination to read because they are intellectual diarrhea), until you're blue in the face.