Ableton Forum

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JUMP

It's the same old shit, after all. Third World's people still dying of hunger and diseases thanks to the U.S. policy. People (workers) of the west with no rights anymore and jobs like this thanks to the U.S. policy. The rest of the world is poor, thanks to the U.S. policy. In a nutshell: U.S. criminal policy. In egypt, too (just wait an see... )

"coca cola, sometimes war"

myrnova wrote:
In which world you live?!

Most of people ARE workers. Only, they have no rights anymore thanks to U.S. so-called "globalization" policy. For instance, here we have only part-time jobs, monthly contracts, etc. We call it "the new slavery". It's like coming back to 1800. Thank you, yankees!

In the world of doing techy shit for a huge multinational. Not too evil a multinational, mind you, but I'm fully aware that shareholders interests are the priority. Probably more than many here. I could tell you some stories about that.

The point is that although we still have most of the population working to make a few rich, the dynamics have changed. Some people could do well to address the way society has changed.

andydes wrote:

myrnova wrote:
In which world you live?!

Most of people ARE workers. Only, they have no rights anymore thanks to U.S. so-called "globalization" policy. For instance, here we have only part-time jobs, monthly contracts, etc. We call it "the new slavery". It's like coming back to 1800. Thank you, yankees!

In the world of doing techy shit for a huge multinational. Not too evil a multinational, mind you, but I'm fully aware that shareholders interests are the priority. Probably more than many here. I could tell you some stories about that.

The point is that although we still have most of the population working to make a few rich, the dynamics have changed. Some people could do well to address the way society has changed.

If you mean "there are less slaves in factories because the new slaves now work in call-center" I agree with you. Apart of the fact the same kind of 1800 slavery nowadays is called "employee" or smth

U.S. criminal policy. In egypt, too (just wait an see... )

I don't doubt your claim that US Criminal policy will enter into Egypt.
So, I don't need to wait and see just so you can say "I told you so" because I never disagreed in the first place.

Also, I'm a Pepsi/Mtn Dew guy. I used to only use Coke as an alternative drain cleaner and for mixed drinks but I switched to club soda and seltzer for mixed drinks awhile ago.

If you mean "there are less slaves in factories because the new slaves now work in call-center" I agree with you. Apart of the fact the same kind of 1800 slavery nowadays is called "employee" or smth

Maybe I'm ignorant but I don't think there's much keeping a person (here, in the US) from starting their own business if they want. Keeping it afloat and successful otoh I think has a lot to do with the owner themselves, if they've already made sound choices in location and logistics, etc. But the majority of people don't consider it or know what they would do, hence the term "sheeple". Now corporations may be making it a lot harder for small businesses in a lot of areas, but there's still technically the ability to not be a "slave". Also, that doesn't have anything to do with being

myrnova wrote:
If you mean "there are less slaves in factories because the new slaves now work in call-center" I agree with you. Apart of the fact the same kind of 1800 slavery nowadays is called "employee" or smth

I just mean the world has changed. If you want to get people on board for some kind of socialist revolution, you need to put it in terms that people relate to instead of making it sound like the 19 century.

That's all.

Although I did find the alternative classifications of social class interesting.

shadx312 wrote: Also, I'm a Pepsi/Mtn Dew guy. I used to only use Coke as an alternative drain cleaner and for mixed drinks but I switched to club soda and seltzer for mixed drinks awhile ago.

Good for you! The world is a better place for that!

Because it's the right thing to do.

Some info from the front row that may clear some things up: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XKWxLlC ... 4-overview

Funken: Reads 3 books over and over and thinks the entire world, past present and future, fits within their context :cry:

Funk N. Furter wrote:
You do not understand the concept of worker because you are not one.

ha ha.. wait, what? So now I don't even understand what worker means because I'm now self employed?

Aren't you unemployed?

so what about all that time I did work for an employer in my life?

And what about when I was freelancing and still working for big companies like investment banks doing exactly the same job all the full time permanent employees did but freelance, so basically self employed, but working full time for more money but less security? Or when I did a shit job for a multinational but I was classed as "casual". Or when I worked in disability in a small private group home, still casual?

I just don't think these kind of things existed in 1848

But even if it's just down to the terminology you use — how do you think your socialist revolution could ever happen if you use language that is totally meaningless to anybody in 2013? I just don't think anybody sees themselves as "workers", everybody has to work and you work to live, you don't live to work.

In Italy people like Forge are considered workers, actually. Does not mean if they don't work in a factory, they remain a sort of "slaves". The others who call themselves "self employed" are usually people who cannot find a work, so they start a shop, try to sell objects, teach disciplines etc. Very dangerous, because most of the time they fail.

no funken, it's got nothing to do with "grasping" anything, I am actually disagreeing with you.

I don't care in the slightest if you or anybody else wants to call me a worker or anything else, and I dare say neither do most other people in 2013.

Most people don't like "consumer" or "useless eater" either.

Funk N. Furter wrote:an employee is an employee and therefore most likely working class even if he is under the illusion that he is santa claus.

BTW you have just undermined your own point — this is basically saying that the middle class and peasants can't exist because they are working for employers.