who is actually going to fall for obama care

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H20nly
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Re: who is actually going to fall for obama care

Post by H20nly » Sun Nov 10, 2013 3:19 am

andydes wrote:
john gordon wrote:Still didn't give In suckers !! Come find me USA govt u big pussys!!
:lol:

Somehow I'm picturing Tommy Lee Jones chasing you through pine forrests for evading your health insurance.
:lol:

beats me wrote:A coworker was telling he was watching Foxnews last night (DOH!) and there was a man with Cancer and his current insurance got cancelled because it doesn’t provide the basic coverage Obamacare demands. His monthly payment then went from $350 to $1,500 which he can’t afford so he’s just going to have to die. As sad and as true as that probably is, this is the Republican’s new Joe the Plumber.
I missed this initially... ^

This story doesn't cover what happens after he switches to an Obamacare plan... only that he had to ditch a plan that was probably being provided by a company that's been trying to figure out how to ditch him since the initial diagnosis.

I heard a woman speaking on NPR the other day. She and her husband are almost at retirement age... they were pissing away their savings dropping 1800 a month on health insurance. after the website shit storm finally ended... they were able to sign up. even with pre existing conditions (they're almost 65 ffs) they were able to get good coverage for 800 a month for both of them... Still WAY too pricey IMO, but at least it's doable. if it'll drop your costs to less than half and not ostracize you for ever having been seriously ill can it be all that bad?

Galt
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Re: who is actually going to fall for obama care

Post by Galt » Sun Nov 10, 2013 11:47 am

Kindly stop spamming this forum.

Machinesworking
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Re: who is actually going to fall for obama care

Post by Machinesworking » Sun Nov 10, 2013 5:28 pm

He's not going to. The point about the amount we in the US pay for health care already (you forgot to mention that) even before "obamacare" goes into effect is a good one. The list is pretty unreadable though. Basically twice as many of our tax dollars already go into medicare etc. than what the French pay for every citizen to get 100% coverage, and the french are just an average, some pay much less.

It's frustrating really the US medical industry is an overpriced already government funded whore, and could use to be bull whipped into submission. As it stands we're looking at them making nominal concessions and still they're trying to gut the process. :evil:

earthloop
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Re: who is actually going to fall for obama care

Post by earthloop » Sun Nov 10, 2013 9:27 pm

I truly feel sorry for the poor and lower income working people in The U.S.A. I have seen so many documentaries and heard first hand testimony from friends who have lived there about the low wages for people doing the lowest paid work (like from $5-$10 per hour)...people who once considered themselves middle class holding two FULL TIME jobs just to keep the house and the kids in school etc. I mean...people who work in retail...in super markets etc...here get $20 per hour !!!

No wonder people can't afford health insurance...or even proper medicine for serious illness in the U.S.A. In Australia, I pay no more than $6 for my prescriptions, and the whole point of the 'Obamacare' policy was to try to bring some justice and equality to the care of the health of the citizens who are most under pressure: those rediculously low paid workers. Unfortunately it was the pressure from Republicans who stripped the legislation of much of its effectiveness.

I actually originated my thread about Investor- State dispute settlement' rules as part of bilateral trade agreements because it is exactly this that large drug companies (many US based) will use to argue that they are being denied their right to make a reasonable profit from their patents and products because our Pharmaceutical benefits scheme forces any drug company to supply drugs in Australia at reduced cost so they can be affordably subsidised by the federal government here.

Under these trade rules they would be able to sue our federal government in offshore courts for hundreds of millions of dollars for laws we make to protect our citizens which they claim stops them from making reasonable profit from their products. This is why Americans pay so much for health services...not just the medicines but the whole system of service pricing.

This is a specific example of the difference between USA and countries like Australia where the fed. gov. can, through the law, control the excesses of global corporations wherein they drive the costs of medical services and insurance up. (lots of other facets to this of course but this is a specific example) Another example is big tobacco. Philip Morris has found a loophole through a trade agreement with these provisions we have with Hong Kong so they can sue our government for enforcing plain packaging of cigarettes here. No brand name or pretty pictures allowed. World first legislation upheld in our highest court. But it would stand for nothing under Investor- State dispute settlement' rules. THIS is why Obamacare is relentlessly attacked by vested interests through their representatives (mainly Republicans).

I would love to be more detailed and precise but I am tired, it is very late and I have to get to bed before it gets light. Just remember that we are all more connected in the world now, and when the USA does something it has a disproportionate effect in other places....especially when it comes to the interests of global corporations based in America. Another is Monsanto, but that is a story for another time! Good Night!

beats me
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Re: who is actually going to fall for obama care

Post by beats me » Mon Nov 11, 2013 5:50 pm

earthloop wrote:I truly feel sorry for the poor and lower income working people in The U.S.A. I have seen so many documentaries and heard first hand testimony from friends who have lived there about the low wages for people doing the lowest paid work (like from $5-$10 per hour)...people who once considered themselves middle class holding two FULL TIME jobs just to keep the house and the kids in school etc. I mean...people who work in retail...in super markets etc...here get $20 per hour !!!

No wonder people can't afford health insurance...or even proper medicine for serious illness in the U.S.A. In Australia, I pay no more than $6 for my prescriptions, and the whole point of the 'Obamacare' policy was to try to bring some justice and equality to the care of the health of the citizens who are most under pressure: those rediculously low paid workers. Unfortunately it was the pressure from Republicans who stripped the legislation of much of its effectiveness.

I actually originated my thread about Investor- State dispute settlement' rules as part of bilateral trade agreements because it is exactly this that large drug companies (many US based) will use to argue that they are being denied their right to make a reasonable profit from their patents and products because our Pharmaceutical benefits scheme forces any drug company to supply drugs in Australia at reduced cost so they can be affordably subsidised by the federal government here.

Under these trade rules they would be able to sue our federal government in offshore courts for hundreds of millions of dollars for laws we make to protect our citizens which they claim stops them from making reasonable profit from their products. This is why Americans pay so much for health services...not just the medicines but the whole system of service pricing.

This is a specific example of the difference between USA and countries like Australia where the fed. gov. can, through the law, control the excesses of global corporations wherein they drive the costs of medical services and insurance up. (lots of other facets to this of course but this is a specific example) Another example is big tobacco. Philip Morris has found a loophole through a trade agreement with these provisions we have with Hong Kong so they can sue our government for enforcing plain packaging of cigarettes here. No brand name or pretty pictures allowed. World first legislation upheld in our highest court. But it would stand for nothing under Investor- State dispute settlement' rules. THIS is why Obamacare is relentlessly attacked by vested interests through their representatives (mainly Republicans).

I would love to be more detailed and precise but I am tired, it is very late and I have to get to bed before it gets light. Just remember that we are all more connected in the world now, and when the USA does something it has a disproportionate effect in other places....especially when it comes to the interests of global corporations based in America. Another is Monsanto, but that is a story for another time! Good Night!


As long as everything is all about executive salaries and shareholder value there’s no such thing as a “reasonable” profit. I think it’s safe to say that 95% of the world (those not invested) doesn’t have any sympathy for the tobacco or pharmaceutical industries, but it points out how helpless we are to do anything about it when they can play the “we need to make a profit!” card without hesitation. They are both destroying lives in different ways. Corporations threw out of the court of public opinion a long time ago.

H20nly
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Re: who is actually going to fall for obama care

Post by H20nly » Mon Nov 11, 2013 5:57 pm

earthloop wrote:I truly feel sorry for the poor and lower income working people in The U.S.A. I have seen so many documentaries and heard first hand testimony from friends who have lived there about the low wages for people doing the lowest paid work (like from $5-$10 per hour)...people who once considered themselves middle class holding two FULL TIME jobs just to keep the house and the kids in school etc. I mean...people who work in retail...in super markets etc...here get $20 per hour !!!
at the end of the day the numbers are more like percentages than values. if minimum wage was set to $20 an hour in the US today... the price of a loaf of bread would be 11 bucks by the end of the year. every time the minimum wage goes up... so do the prices on the menus at McDonalds... and so does the price of gauze at the hospital.

Galt
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Re: who is actually going to fall for obama care

Post by Galt » Mon Nov 11, 2013 6:12 pm

H20nly wrote:
earthloop wrote:I truly feel sorry for the poor and lower income working people in The U.S.A. I have seen so many documentaries and heard first hand testimony from friends who have lived there about the low wages for people doing the lowest paid work (like from $5-$10 per hour)...people who once considered themselves middle class holding two FULL TIME jobs just to keep the house and the kids in school etc. I mean...people who work in retail...in super markets etc...here get $20 per hour !!!
at the end of the day the numbers are more like percentages than values. if minimum wage was set to $20 an hour in the US today... the price of a loaf of bread would be 11 bucks by the end of the year. every time the minimum wage goes up... so do the prices on the menus at McDonalds... and so does the price of gauze at the hospital.
Hmpf. Looks like someone's been studying :D

Minimum wage laws don't miraculously create additional wealth to be selflessly handed over to a company's least useful employees; at best they make those least useful employees redundant. At worst, you're looking at a system wide clusterfuck.

But you all know this already. I don't see anyone here arguing to raise the minimum wage to $1'000'000'000 an hour. Lolz and poop.

beats me
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Re: who is actually going to fall for obama care

Post by beats me » Mon Nov 11, 2013 7:49 pm

Funk N. Furter wrote:
beats me wrote:
earthloop wrote:I truly feel sorry for the poor and lower income working people in The U.S.A. I have seen so many documentaries and heard first hand testimony from friends who have lived there about the low wages for people doing the lowest paid work (like from $5-$10 per hour)...people who once considered themselves middle class holding two FULL TIME jobs just to keep the house and the kids in school etc. I mean...people who work in retail...in super markets etc...here get $20 per hour !!!

No wonder people can't afford health insurance...or even proper medicine for serious illness in the U.S.A. In Australia, I pay no more than $6 for my prescriptions, and the whole point of the 'Obamacare' policy was to try to bring some justice and equality to the care of the health of the citizens who are most under pressure: those rediculously low paid workers. Unfortunately it was the pressure from Republicans who stripped the legislation of much of its effectiveness.

I actually originated my thread about Investor- State dispute settlement' rules as part of bilateral trade agreements because it is exactly this that large drug companies (many US based) will use to argue that they are being denied their right to make a reasonable profit from their patents and products because our Pharmaceutical benefits scheme forces any drug company to supply drugs in Australia at reduced cost so they can be affordably subsidised by the federal government here.

Under these trade rules they would be able to sue our federal government in offshore courts for hundreds of millions of dollars for laws we make to protect our citizens which they claim stops them from making reasonable profit from their products. This is why Americans pay so much for health services...not just the medicines but the whole system of service pricing.

This is a specific example of the difference between USA and countries like Australia where the fed. gov. can, through the law, control the excesses of global corporations wherein they drive the costs of medical services and insurance up. (lots of other facets to this of course but this is a specific example) Another example is big tobacco. Philip Morris has found a loophole through a trade agreement with these provisions we have with Hong Kong so they can sue our government for enforcing plain packaging of cigarettes here. No brand name or pretty pictures allowed. World first legislation upheld in our highest court. But it would stand for nothing under Investor- State dispute settlement' rules. THIS is why Obamacare is relentlessly attacked by vested interests through their representatives (mainly Republicans).

I would love to be more detailed and precise but I am tired, it is very late and I have to get to bed before it gets light. Just remember that we are all more connected in the world now, and when the USA does something it has a disproportionate effect in other places....especially when it comes to the interests of global corporations based in America. Another is Monsanto, but that is a story for another time! Good Night!


As long as everything is all about executive salaries and shareholder value there’s no such thing as a “reasonable” profit. I think it’s safe to say that 95% of the world (those not invested) doesn’t have any sympathy for the tobacco or pharmaceutical industries, but it points out how helpless we are to do anything about it when they can play the “we need to make a profit!” card without hesitation. They are both destroying lives in different ways. Corporations threw out of the court of public opinion a long time ago.
There is no 'need' for profit whatsoever. In fact profit is a hindrance rather than a help on most things these days when compared to other possibilities. Profit only played a progressive role in the early days of modern industrial production. And it came with a terrible cost.

Nevertheless that is what is at play here.

It’s sad that what the military pays for a hammer and what a hospital charges a patient for a single tissue gets little mention beyond the punch line of a joke. It’s appalling that the people who are essentially saying “fuck the poor!” on health coverage also don’t see these charges as outrageous. It’s all about the poor being a leech.

earthloop
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Re: who is actually going to fall for obama care

Post by earthloop » Mon Nov 11, 2013 8:04 pm

Galt wrote: Hmpf. Looks like someone's been studying :D
You bet (if that was directed at me???) Plenty of quals in this area! ;-)

Galt
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Re: who is actually going to fall for obama care

Post by Galt » Mon Nov 11, 2013 8:22 pm

earthloop wrote:
Galt wrote: Hmpf. Looks like someone's been studying :D
You bet (if that was directed at me???) Plenty of quals in this area! ;-)
It wasn't :lol:

earthloop
Posts: 580
Joined: Sun Sep 03, 2006 5:58 pm

Re: who is actually going to fall for obama care

Post by earthloop » Mon Nov 11, 2013 8:32 pm

Galt wrote:
earthloop wrote:
Galt wrote: Hmpf. Looks like someone's been studying :D
You bet (if that was directed at me???) Plenty of quals in this area! ;-)
It wasn't :lol:
Ah! these stacked quotes can be confusing! :lol:

beats me
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Re: who is actually going to fall for obama care

Post by beats me » Thu Nov 14, 2013 10:43 pm

So far only 106,185 people have signed up for Obamacare.

35,364 of those are just in the state of California. 8O California once again leading the rest of the nation (except on pot and gay rights :x )

H20nly
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Re: who is actually going to fall for obama care

Post by H20nly » Fri Nov 15, 2013 3:03 am

I heard a story on NPR tonight... Oregon is knocking it out of the park... they were at the next level before there was a next level.

Oregon is dope.* 8)


*health care excluded

murgatroid
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Re: who is actually going to fall for obama care

Post by murgatroid » Sat Nov 16, 2013 1:07 am

The way the ACA was handled in terms of educating the public was abysmal and only further exacerbated by rightwing bullshit.
Having said that, I'd say that once the website enrolling problems get sorted out, it'll get much better. Unfortunately I over hear conversations out in public and people have no idea whats going on and how they benefit.... only a lot of misinformation passed back and forth.

I'm one of those individually insured thats getting their policy canceled. Didn't freak me out and I was glad for it because now I can get better coverage for less cost. I'm not one of those idiots crying, 'I wanna keep my $50 month garbage policy... why is the government making me get something better for a bit more money so when I land in the hospital I don't go bankrupt as well as having everybody else's premiums go up to defray my costs...waaaaaaah"

bodhi71
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Re: who is actually going to fall for obama care

Post by bodhi71 » Sun Nov 17, 2013 3:53 am

I signed up early, when it was called HillaryCare from way back.

I've been paying in for years now, so hopefully with the new name it will be accepted at my doctor's office.

I have this cool rice sized implant in mah hand too, I'm what they call an early adopter. I like being taken care by a big mother figure as opposed to a father figure.

I'm hoping since I can't find work, food will be considered essential to my healthy lifestyle and I can use it at the grocery store too.

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