TPP: Investor-state dispute settlements=corporate terrorism!

[earthloop]

This is something everyone should be very afraid of. And it is worth fighting against! It is a short article...one page...but is about possibly the biggest threat to our democratic rights ever! This is bigger (worse) than militant islamic terrorism (that should get the red flags flying at the NSA!!!!)

http://www.monbiot.com/2013/11/04/a-glo ... -politics/

[Galt]

I don't understand. A ban on leftwing politics is a ban on gov'ment. It makes no sense.

[earthloop]

Did you read the article referenced???

It is about corporations being able to sue governments for legislating against stuff they want to do...like fracking for shale gas in farmland...or Pharmaceutical companies demanding a government allow whatever drug they want to sell in a given country be allowed regardless of satisfactory testing being done...or a mining company suing a sovereign government for BILLIONS of dollars because that government put in place environmental protection laws which stop said mining company from doing whatever it damn well wants!!!

And here in Australia...Big tobacco is using a free trade agreement we have with Hong Kong to sue our government for loss due to interference with it's intellectual property rights!!

"But, using a trade agreement Australia struck with Hong Kong, the tobacco company Philip Morris has asked an offshore tribunal to award it a vast sum in compensation for the loss of what it calls its intellectual property(3)."
...And this is done in a tribunal 'off shore' by lawyers who have no requirement to justify their decisions made in private...with no outside scrutiny of their independence or otherwise!!!!!

The people of Australia demanded this...the government won in the high court against the tobacco companies...and now the tobacco companies (Philip Morris in this case) are using this to sue our government (and the people of Australia) for defending our right to make laws of our choosing in defence of the public health in accordance with the wishes of the public! And our government, under this provision in the free trade agreement, can't do a thing about it! They have abnegated our soverign right to our own independence to a global corporation!

That is corporate terrorism!!! And it is coming to you...

[Galt]

Big woop, this is just the EU, and the USA before it, on a larger scale. Leftwing cunts love their centralization, but fucking hell do they fail to realize what it implies. If you want to fight this sort of thing, and if you're American, you need nothing but a strict adherence to your constitution. Stop fapping about, trying to define 16 separate, self-selectable "genders". Be a conservative, not a progressive.

"Trade and friendship with all countries, entangling alliances with none".

9 instances of stereotyping are contained within this post.

Bloody fucking hell.

[beats me]

Is this something that could be resolved with an aircraft carrier because the US just gave birth to a new one. It’s quite nice and ready to roll.

[H20nly]

the U.S. could send in drones too.


just put one of these tracking devices in the lawyers brief case:

[TomViolenz]

I seriously don't understand how this (admittetly shitty development) could be even close to the worst and most dangerous thing happening to democracy right now? I'm trying not to be snarky here... hard....BUT Dude, have you been in a coma since June?! I mean before June I would have been up in arms with you about this, but now?! We have MUCH bigger problems...

I'm seriously speechless...

[TomViolenz]

Is this something that could be resolved with an aircraft carrier because the US just gave birth to a new one. It’s quite nice and ready to roll.

This is a joke right?!
You don't seriously think the US has anything against this development, do you?!

[TomViolenz]

Big woop, this is just the EU, and the USA before it, on a larger scale. Leftwing cunts love their centralization, but fucking hell do they fail to realize what it implies. If you want to fight this sort of thing, and if you're American, you need nothing but a strict adherence to your constitution. Stop fapping about, trying to define 16 separate, self-selectable "genders". Be a conservative, not a progressive.

"Trade and friendship with all countries, entangling alliances with none".

9 instances of stereotyping are contained within this post.

Bloody fucking hell.

Galt, I think you are really confused about what are actual left wing positions. You should really check your news sources. The risk is high that they don't aim to inform you but to indoctrinate you! I think for some of your positions you may even find allies among people from the left!
And btw. I have never heard centralization being framed as a specific left wing position.

[Galt]

Big woop, this is just the EU, and the USA before it, on a larger scale. Leftwing cunts love their centralization, but fucking hell do they fail to realize what it implies. If you want to fight this sort of thing, and if you're American, you need nothing but a strict adherence to your constitution. Stop fapping about, trying to define 16 separate, self-selectable "genders". Be a conservative, not a progressive.

"Trade and friendship with all countries, entangling alliances with none".

9 instances of stereotyping are contained within this post.

Bloody fucking hell.

Galt, I think you are really confused about what are actual left wing positions. You should really check your news sources. The risk is high that they don't aim to inform you but to indoctrinate you! I think for some of your positions you may even find allies among people from the left!
And btw. I have never heard centralization being framed as a specific left wing position.

I grew up in a Marxist household and majored in philosophy at university. I also have a masters in psychology.

I (probably) know more about leftwing politics than you do. I certainly know more than FnF, who seems to believe that no true socialists have ever, like, existed, like, ever.

[TomViolenz]

I grew up in a Marxist household and majored in philosophy at university. I also have a masters in psychology.

I (probably) know more about leftwing politics than you do. I certainly know more than FnF, who seems to believe that no true socialists have ever, like, existed, like, ever.

That's quite impressive, but most of your posts don't necessarily reflect that. And it's not just the tone you use, but also how you choose to misrepresent your political opponents positions. Why not try to be a good netizen and teach people about your position instead of denigrating the position of the other side. As a fellow academic, I would assume you also strive rather for truth than (virtual!) victory, no?! Just my opinion.

[Galt]

I grew up in a Marxist household and majored in philosophy at university. I also have a masters in psychology.

I (probably) know more about leftwing politics than you do. I certainly know more than FnF, who seems to believe that no true socialists have ever, like, existed, like, ever.

That's quite impressive, but most of your posts don't necessarily reflect that. And it's not just the tone you use, but also how you choose to misrepresent your political opponents positions. Why not try to be a good netizen and teach people about your position instead of denigrating the position of the other side. As a fellow academic, I would assume you also strive rather for truth than (virtual!) victory, no?! Just my opinion.

I'd be happy to have a friendly, open discussion that includes multiple, divergent opinions, but that is simply not why 80-90% of Americans... er... well, most people come here. I've tried—honestly and sincerely—but this is not what this forum is about. Thus, I must content myself with the unsubtle practice of mercilessly ridiculing the intellectual feebleness of our resident lefty ants.

That said, I don't believe the great majority of people—leftwing or rightwing—should even be considered self-aware, but that's another can of rancid asparagus.

Of course, you've more than demonstrated your ability to discuss intelligently, and I will continue to engage you civilly, provided that you continue to accord me the same courtesy.

[H20nly]

I'd be happy to have a friendly, open discussion that includes multiple, divergent opinions, but that is simply not why 80-90% of Americans... er... well, most people come here.

i loled

[Bagatell]

This is bigger (worse) than militant islamic terrorism (that should get the red flags flying at the NSA!!!!)

They are part and parcel of global fascism. If Monbiot is only now becoming aware of this, he is very late to the party. If he would only crawl out from under the left wing he would see that the political albatross has been shitting over everything for far too long. Time for the suits to stop feeding the bird, wring its neck and start the clean up.

[TomViolenz]

I grew up in a Marxist household and majored in philosophy at university. I also have a masters in psychology.

I (probably) know more about leftwing politics than you do. I certainly know more than FnF, who seems to believe that no true socialists have ever, like, existed, like, ever.

That's quite impressive, but most of your posts don't necessarily reflect that. And it's not just the tone you use, but also how you choose to misrepresent your political opponents positions. Why not try to be a good netizen and teach people about your position instead of denigrating the position of the other side. As a fellow academic, I would assume you also strive rather for truth than (virtual!) victory, no?! Just my opinion.

I'd be happy to have a friendly, open discussion that includes multiple, divergent opinions, but that is simply not why 80-90% of Americans... er... well, most people come here. I've tried—honestly and sincerely—but this is not what this forum is about. Thus, I must content myself with the unsubtle practice of mercilessly ridiculing the intellectual feebleness of our resident lefty ants.

That said, I don't believe the great majority of people—leftwing or rightwing—should even be considered self-aware, but that's another can of rancid asparagus.

Of course, you've more than demonstrated your ability to discuss intelligently, and I will continue to engage you civilly, provided that you continue to accord me the same courtesy.

Yeah things get heated in here, often uncomfortably so, and I have certainly contributed my share of vitriol in here...but why not be the change, you want to have?! (Besides, as I learned just recently, you can even tell people here outright that you despise them and still have a decent discussion if you just keep a respectful tone)
It just appears to me a lot of the regulars come here quite often (me included), so that the Lounge almost fullfils the function of a real Lounge.
So why shit in the living room, I ask myself...?!

The self-awareness thing you mentioned crosses my mind on occasion, but then I always consider that some other TomV might think the same way about me...
I guess we'll never know until mind-mind communication exists

And were you trying to channel myrnova with the 80-90% Americans remark? That shit was funny
BTW: Did he disappper or something? It has been so easy to stay on topic lately...