Lol, what are you on about?! Masochistic, patently insane. We are talking about the integration of software we use not my sex-life and you are not my ex last time I checked. So lay off the personal touch a bit.Machinesworking wrote:Again:TomKern wrote: Your assertion that this time it will all just work out and they finally:
a.) make M4L integrated enough that the issues I mentioned in a post above (which you also seem to have ignored) will all be solved.
b.) go back to developing Live on equal or greater footing
Are just that, assertions. Others might even call them fantasies based on naivety.
M4L is not going away.
It's obvious that some things you want will be implemented as M4L devices, despite your grievances on their public forum.
Deeper integration between M4L and Live would logically mean that bugs or issues have a better chance than they do right now of being solved.
In italics, I think you're missing my point over and over again.
I'm not living in some world where I believe that Ableton are going to make a native LFO, because so far they haven't, it's been years now.
If they do, I'll be happy, but in the mean time I will welcome changes that give the possibility of less bugs, deeper integration and better implementation.
My trajectory on M4L, thought it was a bad idea at the start, two separate code bases that entangled can lead to issues, which I noticed right away in the Live 8 beta. (they of course already had code in the beta related to M4L, they had announced the partnership etc.) I didn't buy 8 until I had heard it was stable for the most part about 9 months later. That was what? 4 years ago? It's obvious that M4l is going nowhere, I rarely use it myself, my Live needs are mostly live performance oriented, I'm not a tinkerer who comes up with things by accident so a lot of what Live and M4L offer isn't for me. All that said, it's obvious that Ableton are committed to M4L and integrating the experience even further. That can only lead to cleaner integration, since as of now it's got warts, it's what you and others are saying right?
You can worry about it of course, but what option is there besides deeper implementation that isn't you just wanting Live to not use M4L for various functions? It's obvious Ableton will use M4L to patch in things, that you won't be happy with that, so why are you using it? In all sincerity to be as negative as you are about the direction of a company and to still use that companies product is just masochistic.
And I'm only negative of this particular development and the slow progress we witnessed in the last years. Doesn't mean I'm not happy with Live. It's a great program I use every day for many hours. And I plan to do so for the forseeable future. I learned to live without a native LFO. I simply use Cableguys MIDI shaper. It's cumbersome because I have to route it out and then back in via MIDI loop back, but other than that it works great. Certainly much better than that hack job Ableton delivered.
The only negative reaction of mine as far as Ableton is concerned would be that I don't up-grade when Live 10 comes out. Which will happen anyways if they don't give Sampler time stretch capabilities.