Apple break from Intel

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Pasha
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Apple break from Intel

Post by Pasha » Tue Jun 23, 2020 5:36 am

I look back in 2006 when I had my first black Macbook, Intel Based.
It took time to stabilize the ecosystem and now Apple announce it again yesterday at WWDC.
It seems the switch to ARM is imminent even though it was pointed out that Intel Macs will be around and supported for years to come and some 'exciting' Intel Macs to be announced.

So what's your take? Is this good for creatives? All of us run hardware, plugins along side Ableton and I am worried that a lot of those things will not run smoothly. MIDI and Audio should not be 'Rosetta 2' or 'Universal Binary 2'... latency awaits there I guess.

I am running from an old 2013 iMac, with the occasional use of a 2012 Macbook Pro and I really do not know at this point what to do. Invest in a discounted Intel iMac? ... Will Ableton made the move to ARM?

Have your say!
Cheers
Pasha
Apple iMac 2013 / Macbook Late 2012
Live 10 Suite,Zebra ,Guitar, Bass, VG99, JV1010 and some controllers
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cids
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Re: Apple break from Intel

Post by cids » Tue Jun 23, 2020 2:50 pm

I think Apple is pretty convinced about the power they're going to deliver with the new platform... of course there will be bumps along the way especially with plugins but there is a lot of cutting edge technology implemented to make sure the transition will be as smooth as possible... hopefully Apple will reach out to smaller developers to offer support and not only focus on MS and Adobe...

BTW Universal Binaries will only impact the Application file-size and will not have any impact on performance or latency... how well Rosetta will cope with Audio has to be seen, Apple did demonstrate Logic on their new platform so they will be aware of plug-ins where Rosetta has to do its binary translation magic... 😉
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TLW
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Re: Apple break from Intel

Post by TLW » Tue Jun 23, 2020 8:30 pm

iPads, especially the Pros, are already capable of some pretty good audio latency (and have good graphics as well), so I don't see a reason to worry regarding the chips that may end up in Macs eventually.

Breaking with Intel has been a thing hardware manufacturers - including Microsoft - have been trying to work out how to do for quite a long time. The problem has been that Intel are good and already established, cpu design and manufacture requires a lot of investment and the time needed to set up assembly lines isn't short. Plus software compatibility. Apple are showing signs that they have learned from their PPC -> Intel switch back in 2007(?) and intend to make the change as seamless as possible for coders and users.

It's a wait and see thing, but personally I have no intention of panicking just yet. I remember the hysteria over Windows Vista before it was released when a lot of people tried the early betas and misunderstood (a) what "beta" means and (b) what many of the new functions, such as "readyboost" actually did. Vista turned out to be pretty solid in the end, though it's still the OS everyone is supposed to hate.

Nor do I intend to hold off getting a new Intel Mac and wait fir whatever comes next - there's no "right time" to buy a computer because something better/more powerful is almost always available a few months down the road.
Live 10 Suite, 2020 27" iMac, 3.6 GHz i9, MacOS Catalina, RME UFX, assorted synths, guitars and stuff.

jonljacobi
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Re: Apple break from Intel

Post by jonljacobi » Tue Jun 23, 2020 10:12 pm

Anyone notice that Apple not once mentioned ARM? Yet everyone knows that ARM is the core of the new architecture.

cids
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Re: Apple break from Intel

Post by cids » Tue Jun 23, 2020 11:39 pm

It’s not so much about ARM, it’s about all the other chipsets that Apple provides to create a SoC, like the Neural Engine for machine learning, this is what makes the platform so powerful...
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Pasha
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Re: Apple break from Intel

Post by Pasha » Wed Jun 24, 2020 6:56 pm

Thanks for points of view! my old iMac is still good enough. I saw some of you with 6 core Intel Mac Mini. How does it work? Is Ableton multi core Multi Thread engine jumping around cores or all is smooth?
Thanks as Mac Mini is one of my choice now to bridge the change especially now that has been reshaped with a 512GB SDD as default.

Cheers
Pasha
Apple iMac 2013 / Macbook Late 2012
Live 10 Suite,Zebra ,Guitar, Bass, VG99, JV1010 and some controllers
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Seta666
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Re: Apple break from Intel

Post by Seta666 » Thu Jul 02, 2020 10:27 am

This apple arm news are really exciting, best thing that has happen in the last 20 years running ableton on the ipad and mac computer and IOS apps on a Mac can become a reality.
I wanted to update my computer ( windows 10 i7 3770k) and maybe get a laptop but I am going to wait for that and see what happens. If a future mac mini A14 performs like my pc I may get a Mac mini/iPad/iPhone combo instead... My first mac computer since a macbook G3

Pasha
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Re: Apple break from Intel

Post by Pasha » Thu Jul 02, 2020 11:32 am

Seta666 wrote:
Thu Jul 02, 2020 10:27 am
This apple arm news are really exciting, best thing that has happen in the last 20 years running ableton on the ipad and mac computer and IOS apps on a Mac can become a reality.
I wanted to update my computer ( windows 10 i7 3770k) and maybe get a laptop but I am going to wait for that and see what happens. If a future mac mini A14 performs like my pc I may get a Mac mini/iPad/iPhone combo instead... My first mac computer since a macbook G3
I agree it's exciting!
Apple iMac 2013 / Macbook Late 2012
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TLW
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Re: Apple break from Intel

Post by TLW » Fri Jul 03, 2020 7:27 pm

Seta666 wrote:
Thu Jul 02, 2020 10:27 am
running ableton on the ipad
I think we're a long way from running full-blown DAWs like Live on an iPad. Garageband, Cubasis etc. do work but it's not as pleasant or flexible a user environment as a laptop of desktop, likewise Adobe's mobile versions of Photoshop and Lightroom can do a lot but the "computer" versions still have them beat in many ways.

My 9.7" iPad Pro can do some impressive things and if I just wanted to use the web, email, facebook, word process etc. and do basic image editing it might be all I'd need but for "big" applications the computing resources required are rather greater than can be squeezed into a tablet at the moment. For a start, a tablet shell puts a restriction on how powerful the silicon can be because it can only dump so much heat. I see tablets as doing one job, which include easy portability, and full-on laptops and desktops as doing another rather like a motorbike will do a great job of getting you from A to B fast but I wouldn't want to haul a PA or a new bed or cooker around on one.

Having said that, I've been wrong about the future of computing before, and the combination of a Mac and an iPad now do make a very useful pairing.

The future certainly looks interesting.
Live 10 Suite, 2020 27" iMac, 3.6 GHz i9, MacOS Catalina, RME UFX, assorted synths, guitars and stuff.

Seta666
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Re: Apple break from Intel

Post by Seta666 » Fri Jul 03, 2020 8:28 pm

Maybe not right away but if mac desktops share processors with tablets and phones apps could be ported, at least to some extent. I would be more than happy if I could run Ableton live Suite at home and Ableton live Intro or even Lite on the iPad, also would love to run iPad or iPhone apps on the desktop. It will take sometime, maybe few years but I think it is more than possible. If logic snd photoshop was running on a A12Z it can run on a A13 or A14 gor sure..

Maybe ableton won't run on a iPhone because of screen size, but it could work when conected to a ext display via a Dock....

If iPhones and iPads moved to a usb-C/TB3 port instead of lighting it would be pretty easy to use those docks made for mac minis...

Apple can unite portable and desktop ecosystems, I hope they do not miss this oportunity.

Tone Deft
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Re: Apple break from Intel

Post by Tone Deft » Fri Jul 03, 2020 9:01 pm

Ableton Live on an iOS device??? have you no respect??

look at all the apps already made for a DAW-like experience on iToys. they pretty much suck, so would any dumbed down version of Live made for them. oh, I'm sorry, is there an app that doesn't suck? just use that FFS. the WORLD has had YEARS to solve this and make some money while they're at it, professionals and amateurs alike. your little iToy is just a dumb little iToy no matter what you try to run on it. just above that price point is a cheap ass laptop THAT ALREADY SUPPORTS LIVE to replace your iToys.

I really hope there aren't Apple fan boys at Ableton. Apple constantly causes problems, so many threads about their devices and OSes, we don't need more.

your only problem is that you have too much money to spend. :lol:
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Seta666
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Re: Apple break from Intel

Post by Seta666 » Sat Jul 04, 2020 7:24 am

I am not an apple fanboy, in fact I do not own any of their products.. :)

Budget for updating my desktop plus getting a laptop would be almost the same as getting an ipad plus mac mini.

I did own an ipad mini few years ago and there are some really nice apps for, something can not be said about android. KORG Gadget is a really fun app to use, and there are lots of great sounding individual instruments in the app store

When my samsung S7 dies ( it replaced an S4 that died too) I will either get a cheap android or an iphone, never again an expenssive android. Apps for android mainly suck, as does audio drivers, latency etc..

I do not have that much money, I update my hardware when I need too and hope it lasts for year. My computer is 7 years old and works rock solid and will for few more years, but one day it will not be able to cope with new software requisites and I will need to update...I will just wait and see before making my decision..

Tone Deft
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Re: Apple break from Intel

Post by Tone Deft » Sat Jul 04, 2020 2:39 pm

Seta666 wrote:
Sat Jul 04, 2020 7:24 am
Budget for updating my desktop plus getting a laptop would be almost the same as getting an ipad plus mac mini.

I did own...

When my...

I do not have that much money...
my apologies if my rant came off as personal towards you, that shouldn't happen here.


the point is
desktop plus getting a laptop would be almost the same as getting an ipad plus mac mini.
this statement is absolutely wrong.
In my life
Why do I smile
At people who I'd much rather kick in the eye?
-Moz

Seta666
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Re: Apple break from Intel

Post by Seta666 » Sat Jul 04, 2020 8:48 pm

desktop plus getting a laptop would be almost the same as getting an ipad plus mac mini.
this statement is absolutely wrong.
[/quote]

I mean it would cost wise, not saying which one would be better or more powerful....nowadays I am more inclined towards convenience than RAW power

My 3770k is still good for my needs and I can probably still use it for few more years if I want to...

I love the modularity of windows computers, same modularity Mac Pros and Hackintosh have..but Hackintosh computers will be dead in 6/7 years...

So when the day I have to upgrade comes I will have to choose, either a Mac mini or a PC...I hate iMac, a computer atached to a 1000€ display that will be usless the day I have to upgrade. I am using 2x 27" display, one cheap FullHd LG and a 2K dell U2711 which shares panel with the old apple cinema display..I have been using for 7 year and will use it 7 more unless it dies, perfect for photography

Tone Deft
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Re: Apple break from Intel

Post by Tone Deft » Thu Jul 23, 2020 2:16 am

really good writeup on the Apple migration to Arm and how that all fits into the larger Processor market in general:

https://www.zdnet.com/article/introduci ... ut-it-now/
In my life
Why do I smile
At people who I'd much rather kick in the eye?
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