Using the Touch Strip to control Mod wheel in a synth?

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Upright
Posts: 315
Joined: Sun Nov 30, 2008 3:27 pm

Using the Touch Strip to control Mod wheel in a synth?

Post by Upright » Sun Apr 14, 2013 8:08 pm

Has anyone heard of a way to do this while in Note/Scale mode? The mod wheel is extremely important to have control over, hopefully Ableton opens up a way to do this.

featherodd
Posts: 46
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2006 12:35 am

Re: Using the Touch Strip to control Mod wheel in a synth?

Post by featherodd » Mon Apr 15, 2013 2:21 am

I believe Ableton is under the impression that no one uses VST synths anymore. And that we would be happy with the stock browsing experience with zero desire to customize categories, preview sounds, use third party libraries or scan through our VST plugs without having to put them in a rack first.

At the moment, there is no way to utilize the touchstrip as a modwheel without either editing the python scrips or mapping it in user mode. Hopefully Ableton will add a user pref in the future that will let us switch the touch strips functionality on the fly.

On some synths, like Sylenth, you can click "configure" and then spin the mod wheel on it's VST dialog to get this paramater to show up as accessible in Live. After, you can simply click the Device button on your Push and use the first encorder to access the modwheel.

On other Synths, like Diva, modwheel does not appear to a VST paramater. The temporary solution I'm using is to drop a simple M4L midi device that has a modwheel knob and buttons to inc/dec programs & banks. I then select this M4L device in Push to access the modewheel and switch VST patches.

The Push dev kit from Florian (viewtopic.php?f=55&t=192084A) looks like a very promising solutions for dynamically repurposing the Touchslider. Max for Live lets you temporarily override specific portions of Push's functionality and the dev kit makes this dead simple. Unfortunately the current rev is unable to write back values to the Touch-encoder and update the LED display. This is important to be able to use it as a modwheel. He is looking for a solution and once this is enabled, it should be easy to make an M4L midi device that could take control of the touchstrip on a per track basis and switch it to a modwheel. This would be an optimum solution as you could add this device to any Racks you've created for your VST.

Upright
Posts: 315
Joined: Sun Nov 30, 2008 3:27 pm

Re: Using the Touch Strip to control Mod wheel in a synth?

Post by Upright » Mon Apr 15, 2013 4:10 am

featherodd wrote:....once this is enabled, it should be easy to make an M4L midi device that could take control of the touchstrip on a per track basis and switch it to a modwheel. This would be an optimum solution as you could add this device to any Racks you've created for your VST.

Thanks for the info...this sounds very promising. In the mean time I guess I'll make due somehow. Thanks again.

mauronedj
Posts: 311
Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2012 3:20 pm

Re: Using the Touch Strip to control Mod wheel in a synth?

Post by mauronedj » Wed Apr 17, 2013 7:13 am

featherodd wrote: On other Synths, like Diva, modwheel does not appear to a VST paramater. The temporary solution I'm using is to drop a simple M4L midi device that has a modwheel knob and buttons to inc/dec programs & banks. I then select this M4L device in Push to access the modewheel and switch VST patches.
Can you please tell me a working patch for Program Changes in Live 64Bit? All the devices in the MaxForLive site does not work, and I don't know what to do because there are no errors in the debuc window!
Thanks,
Mauro.

featherodd
Posts: 46
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2006 12:35 am

Re: Using the Touch Strip to control Mod wheel in a synth?

Post by featherodd » Wed Apr 17, 2013 7:27 am

mauronedj wrote:Can you please tell me a working patch for Program Changes in Live 64Bit? All the devices in the MaxForLive site does not work, and I don't know what to do because there are no errors in the debuc window!
Thanks,
Mauro.
Here's is the M4L device I cobbled together from Jürgen Moßgraber's Program Change patch by simply adding a Modwheel knob (cc1):
http://rawcanvas.com/_/DialToProgramChange.amxd

I'm using the 32-bit version of Live. No idea if it run in the 64-bit version.

mauronedj
Posts: 311
Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2012 3:20 pm

Re: Using the Touch Strip to control Mod wheel in a synth?

Post by mauronedj » Wed Apr 17, 2013 7:45 am

featherodd wrote:
mauronedj wrote:Can you please tell me a working patch for Program Changes in Live 64Bit? All the devices in the MaxForLive site does not work, and I don't know what to do because there are no errors in the debuc window!
Thanks,
Mauro.
Here's is the M4L device I cobbled together from Jürgen Moßgraber's Program Change patch by simply adding a Modwheel knob (cc1):
http://rawcanvas.com/_/DialToProgramChange.amxd

I'm using the 32-bit version of Live. No idea if it run in the 64-bit version.
Sorry but I must do something wrong.
I put the Device at the left of a VST (like DIVA) than move the knob, that's all right?
I'm trying it right now but the program does not change!
Could you help me?

mothergarage
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Re: Using the Touch Strip to control Mod wheel in a synth?

Post by mothergarage » Wed Apr 17, 2013 8:17 am

Well, it depends on the VST, if it accepts program change messages. From DIVA's manual:
MIDI Programs folder
Local
also contains a special folder called
MIDI Programs
, which is initially empty. If you put a
bunch of patches (up to 128) in there, they are all loaded each time Diva starts.
Individual patches are selected via MIDI program change messages. As they are accessed in
alphabetical order, it is a good idea to put a number at the beginning of each name e.g. ‘000
rest-of-name’ to ‘127 rest-of-name’ or similar.
Banks: The MIDI Programs folder can contain up to 128 sub-folders (of 128 patches each), and
these are switchable via MIDI bank select messages
Have you set up Diva like this?
home | sound | twitter | m4l
Windows 10 64bit - Live 10.0.1 - M4L 8 - RME Babyface/iConnectAUDIO4+

featherodd
Posts: 46
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2006 12:35 am

Re: Using the Touch Strip to control Mod wheel in a synth?

Post by featherodd » Wed Apr 17, 2013 8:19 am

mauronedj wrote:Sorry but I must do something wrong.
I put the Device at the left of a VST (like DIVA) than move the knob, that's all right?
I'm trying it right now but the program does not change!
Could you help me?
Goto the patches section in Diva. Any patches that you add to the MIDI Programs sub group will be selectable via midi program change messages. Patches are listed alphabetical so the first patch will be 00, second 01, and so on. After adding and organizing your patches in the MIDI Programs sub group, you will need to remove and re-add Diva for this to take effect. The preset drop down list will also be populated with these patches in Live. Most of this is also explained in the Diva manual.

mauronedj
Posts: 311
Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2012 3:20 pm

Re: Using the Touch Strip to control Mod wheel in a synth?

Post by mauronedj » Wed Apr 17, 2013 8:29 am

Thanks man, My fault, I was thinking that Diva changes the patch in the Root directory!
Thanks for the patch,
Mauro.

featherodd
Posts: 46
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2006 12:35 am

Re: Using the Touch Strip to control Mod wheel in a synth?

Post by featherodd » Wed Apr 17, 2013 8:40 am

mauronedj wrote:Thanks man, My fault, I was thinking that Diva changes the patch in the Root directory!
Thanks for the patch,
Mauro.
No prob.

adamj
Posts: 48
Joined: Fri Mar 20, 2009 5:09 pm

Re: Using the Touch Strip to control Mod wheel in a synth?

Post by adamj » Fri May 03, 2013 5:33 am

Here's a simple M4L device I was using tonight to use the pitch bend strip as mod wheel for DIVA:

Code: Select all

----------begin_max5_patcher----------
472.3ocyVF0SCBCDG+Y3SQSiOhKq.CV7M8qgwX5FcZMPKosaNcwu61d.Smht
51D8gQo2cz6+8C50sIL.OStlownKPWiBB1DFD.lbFBZmGfqnqmWR0PX3JlVS
uigiZ7YXqMfcB5LRmQdAXRN6gym1YagTXDzJF34REmVhtRVVz4VtzTxLlmpY
MhAiQ2z5RrrhKrNg7G2ZrlZleOWb2sJ1bSyiPH4iFGgxybWShGMIBQr2uccb
JPyeFR.YrMnsKeSxg0m3L9RXn6RjmHQvdzVpehHU7B9BophZ5gKoGJW3ByWf
l7uAMtx0BnlgI.gHS+iYSMUoY8fljC9Sln294vTuC8yNx9XWxjiBc4mVzYW4
d.Wrmf6mU4jThaHM+vp7wm1JmK5ovIm9MS6EKSAnL932IAOItjK9XeXH0N66
RJsboZdWAz1hE8V9KXZCWPMbo3cwXa2fh2Fy87hBF3tSdEbMcVIq3qei4qZR
8PMw6DyuoZr8RPS1iZlNnpwm2TCmZHdnFxfol3+MeE6TShGpIYvTSpGpIcvT
SlGpIaPTCwi8TIG3dplVyz55ULktcIAgXOt5AoxMMKBlxEMSgiMvJ1JdW7ve
XESU1SQL1iPVpZNbZcVJNzkmWBeELgdnOC
-----------end_max5_patcher-----------
(just paste that into a new M4L MIDI effect in front of DIVA or any instrument)

Problem is, the pitch bend wheel resets to the center as soon as you let go. This works ok with some presets, where maybe you want the filter half-open most of the time, and you can open it or close it by sliding up or down. But I think for mod wheel it would be better if it stayed where you lift your finger, just like a regular mod wheel on a keyboard. One way to do this might be to ignore pitch bend value 64 (the center pitch bend value that Push sends when you lift your finger), but then the lights on the Push would be misleading.

I've also thought of having it send one MIDI CC control value when you slide upwards from the center, and a different CC when you slide down. That might have some interesting possibilities.

But really, I wish the Push could just have a "mod wheel mode" under the user settings.
Adam Murray
Live 9 + Push on OS X 10.10

philipc
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Location: Bristol, UK.
Contact:

Re: Using the Touch Strip to control Mod wheel in a synth?

Post by philipc » Wed Jul 17, 2013 11:25 am

I wish the Push could just have a "mod wheel mode" under the user settings.
Me too. This seems to be a 'no brainer,' as they say.

Upright
Posts: 315
Joined: Sun Nov 30, 2008 3:27 pm

Re: Using the Touch Strip to control Mod wheel in a synth?

Post by Upright » Wed Jul 17, 2013 12:09 pm

philipc wrote:
I wish the Push could just have a "mod wheel mode" under the user settings.
Me too. This seems to be a 'no brainer,' as they say.
Yes sir....hopefully Abes will add this....While I think it awesome that folks love to change the scripts and programing in Ableton to make this sort of thing work for Push, I'm not into going into Ableton and doing all that, I just want to make music. :D

Miq
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Joined: Mon Apr 22, 2013 12:44 pm

Re: Using the Touch Strip to control Mod wheel in a synth?

Post by Miq » Wed Jul 24, 2013 11:57 am

+1

I rather am using the mod wheel, and seldomly the pitch bend.

daichtrax
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Joined: Sat May 26, 2012 12:06 pm

Re: Using the Touch Strip to control Mod wheel in a synth?

Post by daichtrax » Sat Jul 27, 2013 1:42 pm

i agree it seems like touch strip midi mapping should be part of push setup screen (if it is not already)

check box: map push touch strip to

drop down:
pitch bend
mod wheel
cc

then for cc a text box to type in the cc value

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