The Push section of the Live Manual is rubbish!

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SuburbanThug
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Re: The Push section of the Live Manual is rubbish!

Post by SuburbanThug » Sat May 11, 2013 5:47 am

I don't mean to be one of "those guys" but, jeez, this sure makes the Push look more and more pushed out the door. Having a sustain pedal work properly with a Push is fairly integral to it's status as an instrument. Lucky for me it hasn't been a priority yet and this issue should be pretty well addressed by the time I get one.

Dennis DeSantis
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Re: The Push section of the Live Manual is rubbish!

Post by Dennis DeSantis » Sat May 11, 2013 6:11 pm

SuburbanThug wrote:I don't mean to be one of "those guys" but, jeez, this sure makes the Push look more and more pushed out the door. Having a sustain pedal work properly with a Push is fairly integral to it's status as an instrument. Lucky for me it hasn't been a priority yet and this issue should be pretty well addressed by the time I get one.
For what it's worth, this doesn't seem to be related to Push. This behavior seems to occur when Yamaha pedals are connected to anything. I can reproduce this non-invertible polarity when the pedal is attached to a variety of MIDI controller keyboards as well.

fishmonkey
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Re: The Push section of the Live Manual is rubbish!

Post by fishmonkey » Sun May 12, 2013 1:07 am

Dennis DeSantis wrote:
SuburbanThug wrote:I don't mean to be one of "those guys" but, jeez, this sure makes the Push look more and more pushed out the door. Having a sustain pedal work properly with a Push is fairly integral to it's status as an instrument. Lucky for me it hasn't been a priority yet and this issue should be pretty well addressed by the time I get one.
For what it's worth, this doesn't seem to be related to Push. This behavior seems to occur when Yamaha pedals are connected to anything. I can reproduce this non-invertible polarity when the pedal is attached to a variety of MIDI controller keyboards as well.
it is only a feature of some MIDI keyboards to auto-sense footswitch state on startup, most keyboards don't do it.

if the Yamaha pedal you are referring to is a simple switch on/off model, then your testing indicates that the Push currently doesn't have 'polarity' auto-sensing.

i will test it with a basic Roland footswitch in the next day or two and report back...

Dennis DeSantis
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Re: The Push section of the Live Manual is rubbish!

Post by Dennis DeSantis » Sun May 12, 2013 1:48 am

fishmonkey wrote:
it is only a feature of some MIDI keyboards to auto-sense footswitch state on startup, most keyboards don't do it.

if the Yamaha pedal you are referring to is a simple switch on/off model, then your testing indicates that the Push currently doesn't have 'polarity' auto-sensing.

i will test it with a basic Roland footswitch in the next day or two and report back...
It's not just that there's no auto-sensing, but rather that the polarity can't seem to be switched at all when using these Yamaha pedals - with Push, or with any number of MIDI keyboard controllers that I've tried.

None of the controllers I've tested have polarity auto-sensing either. But for other makes of pedal, I can still flip the polarity by depressing the pedal prior to connecting it. With the Yamaha pedals, this doesn't seem to work, and I'm still trying to figure out why.

fishmonkey
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Re: The Push section of the Live Manual is rubbish!

Post by fishmonkey » Sun May 12, 2013 1:56 am

which Yamaha pedals are you testing? are they pure on/off types (like the FC4 or FC5), or the FC3 type, which has a pot in it?

by 'auto-sensing' what i am talking about is the keyboard flipping which switch state is on or off. on some keyboards, if the footswitch is circuit-closed on startup then that is assumed to be 'off', but if the circuit is open then that is assumed to be 'off' instead.

fishmonkey
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Re: The Push section of the Live Manual is rubbish!

Post by fishmonkey » Sun May 12, 2013 3:43 am

so i just did a quick test with my Roland DP-2 pedal, which is a simple on/off footswitch.

the DP-2 is wired so that the pedal up is switch closed, pedal down is switch open. this is the opposite to what the Push expects, so the MIDI CC values generated are the wrong way around (pedal down is value 0, pedal up is value 127).

nothing i tried got the Push to treat the pedal any different. this should be a pretty easy function for the Push devs to add to the firmware though.

SuburbanThug
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Re: The Push section of the Live Manual is rubbish!

Post by SuburbanThug » Sun May 12, 2013 5:11 am

Dennis DeSantis wrote:
SuburbanThug wrote:I don't mean to be one of "those guys" but, jeez, this sure makes the Push look more and more pushed out the door. Having a sustain pedal work properly with a Push is fairly integral to it's status as an instrument. Lucky for me it hasn't been a priority yet and this issue should be pretty well addressed by the time I get one.
For what it's worth, this doesn't seem to be related to Push. This behavior seems to occur when Yamaha pedals are connected to anything. I can reproduce this non-invertible polarity when the pedal is attached to a variety of MIDI controller keyboards as well.
Ahhh. I misunderstood. I've just seen some confusion over this and was worried. I'm happy you guys are working on it. Thanks!

Blendton
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Re: The Push section of the Live Manual is rubbish!

Post by Blendton » Sun May 12, 2013 2:52 pm

SuburbanThug wrote:
Dennis DeSantis wrote:
SuburbanThug wrote:I don't mean to be one of "those guys" but, jeez, this sure makes the Push look more and more pushed out the door. Having a sustain pedal work properly with a Push is fairly integral to it's status as an instrument. Lucky for me it hasn't been a priority yet and this issue should be pretty well addressed by the time I get one.
For what it's worth, this doesn't seem to be related to Push. This behavior seems to occur when Yamaha pedals are connected to anything. I can reproduce this non-invertible polarity when the pedal is attached to a variety of MIDI controller keyboards as well.
Ahhh. I misunderstood. I've just seen some confusion over this and was worried. I'm happy you guys are working on it. Thanks!
USeless and not at all my kind of reaction but since sundat's calm, my only post today is :

>>> WTF, after watching everything he says, unlike me with a sketchy and direct manner, I like this huy ;)

He may be or not some kind of evil minded bastard, at least, all his posts are right or constructive for the discussion to evelve,

and weonr or inaccurate stuff is always replied after correvtion by modesty souneding apologizes with all pre excuses "aknowledgement and not a shame to be wrong" stuff above.

We need more mates as SuburbanThug, IMO bu the way, don't ask for ass licking is you thought spojntaneous recognizing interesting people make you feel like you are, some clone or I won't care...)

Thank you.

(but wwarning, it could be the only clear + kind thing I could write here for a long time, rare thing, re-thanks) :D
Antoine, aka Blendton.

OS : Windows 8 Professional with Media Center - x64
Ableton Live 9 Suite (64-bit) & Ableton Suite 8 + Max for Live (32-bit)
Toshiba Qosmio F750 + lenticular glasses-free 3D
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SuburbanThug
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Re: The Push section of the Live Manual is rubbish!

Post by SuburbanThug » Sun May 12, 2013 8:53 pm

Hey, thanks. It's good to hear that someone finds some of my contributions to this forum worthwhile.

Dennis DeSantis
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Re: The Push section of the Live Manual is rubbish!

Post by Dennis DeSantis » Fri May 17, 2013 3:08 am

Hi folks,

We're still looking into whether or not footswitch polarity is something that can be adjusted from Push itself.

In the meantime, if you happen to have a pedal whose polarity cannot otherwise be switched, I've made a small Max for Live device that will do this.

http://www.maxforlive.com/library/devic ... ip-sustain

Best,

agent314
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Re: The Push section of the Live Manual is rubbish!

Post by agent314 » Tue May 21, 2013 4:44 pm

Thanks for the update Dennis. It's nice to get info/response right from the (figurative) horse's mouth.

Flolive
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Re: The Push section of the Live Manual is rubbish!

Post by Flolive » Wed Apr 23, 2014 3:09 am

Thank you DENNIS !!

I have a midi keyboard Roland A-300 PRO, and i tried a lot of things to change polarity of sustain pedal, without success of course.

I bought a new sustain pedal with polarity switch, but the opposite polarity didn't work ( no sustain in any position.. )

So, i just found this post on the forum and trust me i'm so happy even i would like it works normaly.

Again, thank you very much Dennis, you just saved my life ^^

Cheers!

am is are
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Re: Push-compatible footswitches as of July 2015 Live 9.2

Post by am is are » Mon Jul 13, 2015 4:16 pm

and latest Push firmware update - 1.16

i'm about to buy a momentary footswitch to use with Port 2, for turning on and cycling recording/overdub

reading this thread, it seems that neither Yamaha FC-5 or Roland DP-2 pedals work properly as of last notice.

any update? i'd rather get a footswitch that works proper right off than have to make a couple of trips to find the "right" one

What pedals are you using that work? thanks
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yur2die4
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Re: The Push section of the Live Manual is rubbish!

Post by yur2die4 » Mon Jul 13, 2015 5:34 pm

viewtopic.php?f=55&t=199947

Make sure that you also keep the behavior of Push in mind. If you use the built-in functionality, it is sometimes hesitant on reactivness. If you plan to Map the footswitvh to something, you have to switch to User mode (the mode where all the Ableton functionality is not showing).

If you can work around those two behaviors, you should be good to go.

Another option is using a pedal with a standard midi keyboard. Or, some have even made pedals out of Qwerty keyboards which can really get indepth for specific commands.

am is are
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yur2die4 pedal info

Post by am is are » Tue Jul 14, 2015 7:43 pm

thanks for the post link. i tested the functionality of both inputs last nite with an m-audio SP-2 sustain pedal. pedal 2/record function works with a little delay, but no real issue if yer quantization is set to a bar since you can hit the record footswitch anytime in the previous bar and it'll be ready when you get to the next bar.

i noticed on an Ableton live web page discussing footswitch use with Push that they have a foto of m-audio's sp-1 footswitch, which i guess is a hint.

i have an akai lpd8 that i put on the floor & use to control Looper sometimes so i'll see if mapping one pad to the session record button is more useful, but since it only takes half a second to reach over and hit the record/overdub button on Push, i'm not sure using a pedal is terribly useful or necessary (unless yer playing guitar, or drumpads as well. i do, but i want a Push-only performance setup for some situations)

i really really wish you could plug in a CC controller (it could automatically take command of Macro 1 in whatever rack yer using to keep things super simple, though being able to assign the pedal inputs in the Push user preference would be better). CC pedal controller strikes me as a LOT more useful if performing with Push as an instrument (and i already have a CC pedal laying around)
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