Push Knob Resolution (Feature Request)

Come here to discuss Push with other users.
For tech support, please head to http://www.ableton.com/help
BobTheDog
Posts: 126
Joined: Tue Oct 25, 2005 12:04 pm

Re: Push Knob Resolution (Feature Request)

Post by BobTheDog » Thu Jun 20, 2013 5:14 pm

fishmonkey wrote:
BobTheDog wrote:Well Ableton told me they couldn't, and I quote:

"The first one [my question about knob resolution] is due to the general MIDI data resolution of 128 steps. Also the Push knobs send regular MIDI CC to control parameters, which gives you those 128 steps. If your actual parameter has a smaller resolution, with every (MIDI) data increment/decrement sent in, the parameter changes several steps."
that is completely missing the point. i don't think people are talking about increasing the overall MIDI resolution, they are talking about how sensitive the knobs are. all it requires is changing how far you need to turn a knob per MIDI value.
Why is it missing the point. I asked Ableton if there was a way to control a parameter with 1280 steps range one step at a time and they told me no that is impossible as push will only control parameters divided into 128 steps, therefore the parameter would change in steps of 10.

Now this is obviously incorrect as this patch shows, but it is the info I got from Ableton!

fishmonkey
Posts: 4087
Joined: Wed Oct 24, 2007 4:50 am

Re: Push Knob Resolution (Feature Request)

Post by fishmonkey » Fri Jun 21, 2013 1:39 am

BobTheDog wrote:
fishmonkey wrote:
BobTheDog wrote:Well Ableton told me they couldn't, and I quote:

"The first one [my question about knob resolution] is due to the general MIDI data resolution of 128 steps. Also the Push knobs send regular MIDI CC to control parameters, which gives you those 128 steps. If your actual parameter has a smaller resolution, with every (MIDI) data increment/decrement sent in, the parameter changes several steps."
that is completely missing the point. i don't think people are talking about increasing the overall MIDI resolution, they are talking about how sensitive the knobs are. all it requires is changing how far you need to turn a knob per MIDI value.
Why is it missing the point. I asked Ableton if there was a way to control a parameter with 1280 steps range one step at a time and they told me no that is impossible as push will only control parameters divided into 128 steps, therefore the parameter would change in steps of 10.

Now this is obviously incorrect as this patch shows, but it is the info I got from Ableton!
sorry, i assumed you were talking about standard MIDI CC and Note values. i guess that's what the Abes assumed you were talking about too.

Push can send whatever values of course, as long as the receiving device is capable of interpreting them. Stray's Push code mods divide the number space between the minimum and maximum values into 1024 steps.

it would also be handy to be able to adjust the sensitivity of the knobs from the Push itself, i.e. how many turns it takes to cover the full parameter range...

ZALTA19900
Posts: 26
Joined: Sat Jun 22, 2013 5:29 pm

Re: Push Knob Resolution (Feature Request)

Post by ZALTA19900 » Mon Jun 24, 2013 1:36 pm

I spoke to ableton about the resolution, they said it was fixed to 128 values like all other midi controllers are when used with Live.

So don't hold your breath! :mrgreen:

BobTheDog
Posts: 126
Joined: Tue Oct 25, 2005 12:04 pm

Re: Push Knob Resolution (Feature Request)

Post by BobTheDog » Mon Jun 24, 2013 2:27 pm

fishmonkey wrote: sorry, i assumed you were talking about standard MIDI CC and Note values. i guess that's what the Abes assumed you were talking about too.

Push can send whatever values of course, as long as the receiving device is capable of interpreting them. Stray's Push code mods divide the number space between the minimum and maximum values into 1024 steps.

it would also be handy to be able to adjust the sensitivity of the knobs from the Push itself, i.e. how many turns it takes to cover the full parameter range...

A nice implementation would be based on the speed you turn the encoders, slow for very fine, fast for course.

BobTheDog
Posts: 126
Joined: Tue Oct 25, 2005 12:04 pm

Re: Push Knob Resolution (Feature Request)

Post by BobTheDog » Mon Jun 24, 2013 2:28 pm

ZALTA19900 wrote:I spoke to ableton about the resolution, they said it was fixed to 128 values like all other midi controllers are when used with Live.

So don't hold your breath! :mrgreen:
Yeah, I wont believe a word Ableton support tell me any more!

staplesyrup
Posts: 75
Joined: Thu Jul 05, 2007 9:56 am

Re: Push Knob Resolution (Feature Request)

Post by staplesyrup » Tue Sep 03, 2013 4:45 pm

I can change m4l parameters one step at a time even if they have 200 steps. my Apc by comparison does jump a few at a time like a 128 step controller would. So push clearly can do fine control, even without the modded script. You just have to turn the knob alot....

I dont like the feel of the knobs much. You have to turn them a long way to sweep a filter, compared to the APC. And i would prefer tapered knobs, they arent nice to hold on the edge, and ones that werent matt black and impossible to see. Might look for alternatives if i can find conductive ones.

My unit seems to flicker alot to the master volume when i touch any knob, some kind of static build up maybe...

marcoskohler
Posts: 333
Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2006 3:13 am

Re: Push Knob Resolution (Feature Request)

Post by marcoskohler » Fri Dec 27, 2013 6:48 pm

What's the story with this? You should totally be able to hold shift and turn a knob and have it move in tiny increments...right know if you edit the volume of something, for example, Push moves in arbitrary step sizes...if I want to set the send to be -17.5dB exactly, I should be able to...Instead I get -17.686,-17.373, etc...ridiculous.

Edit: solved by installing modified scripts...would be nice to have this included by default

TomViolenz
Posts: 6854
Joined: Mon Dec 13, 2010 6:19 pm

Re: Push Knob Resolution (Feature Request)

Post by TomViolenz » Sat Dec 28, 2013 5:29 pm

marcoskohler wrote:What's the story with this? You should totally be able to hold shift and turn a knob and have it move in tiny increments...right know if you edit the volume of something, for example, Push moves in arbitrary step sizes...if I want to set the send to be -17.5dB exactly, I should be able to...Instead I get -17.686,-17.373, etc...ridiculous.

Edit: solved by installing modified scripts...would be nice to have this included by default
Where did you find the script? The link on the last page seems to be dead :(

Logic8807
Posts: 169
Joined: Sat Dec 03, 2011 1:25 pm

Re: Push Knob Resolution (Feature Request)

Post by Logic8807 » Sun Dec 29, 2013 5:25 am

A repost for this mod would be awesome...and stickied.
https://soundcloud.com/thegraysmith/asp ... itch-remix

Check me out...let me know what ya'll think.

metastatik
Posts: 318
Joined: Tue Mar 13, 2007 3:28 pm

Re: Push Knob Resolution (Feature Request)

Post by metastatik » Sun Dec 29, 2013 12:36 pm

Sorry guys, this modification was merged with my other modifications and I forgot to update the link in this thread.

FYI, the modifications are strictly compatible with Live 9.1.0. I'll be updating for Live 9.1.1 as soon as I can.

TomViolenz
Posts: 6854
Joined: Mon Dec 13, 2010 6:19 pm

Re: Push Knob Resolution (Feature Request)

Post by TomViolenz » Sun Dec 29, 2013 6:36 pm

metastatik wrote:Sorry guys, this modification was merged with my other modifications and I forgot to update the link in this thread.

FYI, the modifications are strictly compatible with Live 9.1.0. I'll be updating for Live 9.1.1 as soon as I can.
Thanks! As usual, outstanding work!

ansolas
Posts: 379
Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2013 11:01 pm
Location: Earth ~ Europe ~ Germany ~ Cuxheaven

Re: Push Knob Resolution (Feature Request)

Post by ansolas » Wed Jan 01, 2014 11:08 am

That should be built in.

Cuv
Posts: 20
Joined: Tue May 27, 2014 9:32 am

Re: Push Knob Resolution (Feature Request)

Post by Cuv » Tue Jun 24, 2014 1:19 pm

In the Push script - could anyone please explain the 'Shift + Display Encoders to finely adjust parameter values' functionality a bit more clearly, or post a basic video to see it in operation?

I'm looking to verify it's exact definition before purchasing a Push.
MSI GE60 | Intel i7-3630QM @ 2.40GHz (3.40GHz turbo) | Windows 10 | Live 9.6.2 | Push 2

TomViolenz
Posts: 6854
Joined: Mon Dec 13, 2010 6:19 pm

Re: Push Knob Resolution (Feature Request)

Post by TomViolenz » Tue Jun 24, 2014 1:30 pm

Cuv wrote:In the Push script - could anyone please explain the 'Shift + Display Encoders to finely adjust parameter values' functionality a bit more clearly, or post a basic video to see it in operation?

I'm looking to verify it's exact definition before purchasing a Push.
If you have the mod installed (and only then) you press the Shift key on Push and turning the encoders will adjust the parameter with a finer resolution (I think by a factor of 10). Letting go of Shift and you will be back to the normal resolution. It works really well.

Cuv
Posts: 20
Joined: Tue May 27, 2014 9:32 am

Re: Push Knob Resolution (Feature Request)

Post by Cuv » Tue Jun 24, 2014 2:14 pm

Thx for the response.

When you say 'a factor of 10', do you mean it in/decreases the value in Live (the Push) by '10'.

If this is the case then with 1024 values, you would only have 102 (less than the original) discrete values, right?
MSI GE60 | Intel i7-3630QM @ 2.40GHz (3.40GHz turbo) | Windows 10 | Live 9.6.2 | Push 2

Post Reply