I updated to Preditor 2 and apparently shared my story

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mikb
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I updated to Preditor 2 and apparently shared my story

Post by mikb » Sun Jul 22, 2018 4:39 pm

In case you missed it the Push automapping editor Preditor 2 updates are currently half price. Update if you want advanced mapping for your Push done fast.
Last edited by mikb on Mon Jul 23, 2018 3:05 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Basic gear info: Macbook Pro with macOS 10.12, Ableton Live Suite version 9 (64bit) with Ozone, Push and APC20 as controllers.

jestermgee
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Re: Preditor 2 half price currently

Post by jestermgee » Sun Jul 22, 2018 10:50 pm

I just visited the site and it went from 48 euro on initial page load up to 54 euro on the end of the page load and converted to AUD that is $84.

As much as I would love to have better organized mappings on Push for VSTs, it seems very expensive for a basic function that Live should already be offering (IMO) and if that is actually half price then I think I will manage just fine as is.

mikb
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Re: Preditor 2 half price currently

Post by mikb » Mon Jul 23, 2018 12:32 am

It must have ended shortly thereafter. I paid half that, in British £ though. My apologies for getting your hopes up.

It's not part of owning a Push unfortunately. I find it vital for Push setup, especially with plug-ins.
Basic gear info: Macbook Pro with macOS 10.12, Ableton Live Suite version 9 (64bit) with Ozone, Push and APC20 as controllers.

jestermgee
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Re: Preditor 2 half price (it's over now)

Post by jestermgee » Mon Jul 23, 2018 12:45 am

Yeah I use Komplete Kontrol for VST plugin automation which is far better with plugins/automapping than Live and Push. I'm really hopeful that one day we will be able to edit labels for parameters and easily create pages for Push (including blank slots). PReditor seems to tick the boxes but for a very specific feature which is "nice" to have it's certainly not a requirement (for me anyway) and I have been managing fine for 5 years so far.

S4racen
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Re: Preditor 2 half price (it's over now)

Post by S4racen » Mon Jul 23, 2018 6:47 am

Half price was for existing owners of PrEditor as an upgrade path, PrEditor 2 has not been on sale.

Cheers
D

mikb
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Re: Preditor 2 half price (it's over now)

Post by mikb » Mon Jul 23, 2018 3:02 pm

S4racen wrote:Half price was for existing owners of PrEditor as an upgrade path, PrEditor 2 has not been on sale.

Cheers
D
OK

I edited the subject and first post to reflect this.
Basic gear info: Macbook Pro with macOS 10.12, Ableton Live Suite version 9 (64bit) with Ozone, Push and APC20 as controllers.

cskracer
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Re: I updated to Preditor 2 and apparently shared my story

Post by cskracer » Fri Jul 27, 2018 11:23 pm

I've given up asking Ableton for what should be standard functionality. I had a request in Centrecode, but I was told by support it wasn't something they'd ever likely do - the guy I was dealing with seemed surprised I was upset....

PrEditor is ok - I have it the original version but you shouldn't need Max to do something as basic as changing the labels on banks or ordering controls, leaving spaces in banks etc. I struggle to believe that Ableton is not doing it on purpose to try and keep everyone in their ecosystem - ie make then buy Suite instead of Standard to get some synths. I really can't understand why else they haven't done it.

I've come to believe that whilst VSTs are great in terms of price and integration inside DAWs, hardware is a better approach from the point of view of control - simply because of the interface. Push is good for controlling Live, but not for controlling synths. 8 knobs isn't enough. Even my KK S61 suffers from the same issue really. I intend to transition out of using VSTs plus midi controllers back to a few selected pieces of hardware.

Stromkraft
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Re: I updated to Preditor 2 and apparently shared my story

Post by Stromkraft » Sun Jul 29, 2018 9:05 am

There's also another kind of hardware route to go: dedicated controllers such as those from Soundforce.
Make some music!

blof_eld
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Re: I updated to Preditor 2 and apparently shared my story

Post by blof_eld » Sun Jul 29, 2018 11:21 pm

cskracer wrote:8 knobs isn't enough.
Can't you do 8 banks of 8, ie 64?

I have a Behringer BCR2000 that I haven't even set up yet, so maybe only 8 is enough for me... :lol:

mikb
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Re: I updated to Preditor 2 and apparently shared my story

Post by mikb » Mon Jul 30, 2018 11:28 am

blof_eld wrote:
cskracer wrote:8 knobs isn't enough.
Can't you do 8 banks of 8, ie 64?
You can do 16 banks as there are pages. The limit of 128 parameters is only there because Ableton apparently have decided not to lift it.
Basic gear info: Macbook Pro with macOS 10.12, Ableton Live Suite version 9 (64bit) with Ozone, Push and APC20 as controllers.

cskracer
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Re: I updated to Preditor 2 and apparently shared my story

Post by cskracer » Mon Jul 30, 2018 11:53 am

blof_eld wrote:
cskracer wrote:8 knobs isn't enough.
Can't you do 8 banks of 8, ie 64?

I have a Behringer BCR2000 that I haven't even set up yet, so maybe only 8 is enough for me... :lol:
You can - however I've found that I prefer having a hardware interface where you have closer to knob per function rather than paging through banks of 8 knobs at a time.

When I am using a VST I find it quicker to alter patches using a mouse than I do with Push.

I find myself using Push mainly as a controller for Live rather than VSTs. It's still useful for that.

scheffkoch
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Re: I updated to Preditor 2 and apparently shared my story

Post by scheffkoch » Wed Aug 01, 2018 8:11 am

...i also don't like paging through banks but the nice thing with preditor is that you can set up the "most important" parameters to appear on bank 1 so that they're always present...
macbook pro late 2016, osx 10.13.6, rme multiface via sonnet thunderbolt expresscard adapter + thunderbolt to usb-c adapter, ableton live 10.0.1, push 2, komplete 9, maschine 2.7.6, touchable

doghouse
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Re: I updated to Preditor 2 and apparently shared my story

Post by doghouse » Wed Aug 01, 2018 1:18 pm

cskracer wrote:I've given up asking Ableton for what should be standard functionality. I had a request in Centrecode, but I was told by support it wasn't something they'd ever likely do
I've often wondered why dedicated control of plugins was so complicated, after using both Automap and the Nektar Panorama. What I discovered is that each DAW "reads" plugin parameters in different orders! There is no standard. I saw one example where the same plugin in Reaper showed a different order of parameters when instantiated as AU instead of VST. I also discovered there is nothing in the VST/AU protocols that lets the plugin designer control this behavior.

You can see this in Live easily enough, just instantiate any third party plugin and hit the unfold button (the triangle) to see the first 64 parameters. If there are more than 64, you have to add them manually with the Configure mechanism. You might be surprised to see the order that is presented. For synths, you will seldom see filter, oscillator and envelope controls at the top of the list. Often, it's lesser used things like global settings and the order seems very much random. Automap and the Panormama see the same lists and assigns controls to them but not in a rational way. Parameters that should be on buttons may end up on sliders/encoders and those that should be on variable controls may end up on buttons. I have spent hours editing files for both systems to get parameters ordered in a useful way. I have also discovered that some plugins do not expose all their parameters anyway. Absynth 5 for example has hundreds of parameters but only shows 12 to the DAW!!!!

That is probably why NI made NKS available to third parties, it helps them sell controllers. NKS bypasses the AU and VST mechanisms so the plugins report parameters the way that NI wants to see them. They let the mfrs do the mapping work. It also requires running the plugins inside the NI Komplete Kontrol host. Novation has pretty much abandoned Automap (although it does work well if you are willing to deal with wrapers and editing the files yourself). Nektar has just announced a new plugin host called Nektarine, which works much like Komplete Kontrol. It's unclear how the mapping will work. Other mfrs have adopted the host concept, Akai, Alesis and M-Audio all support VIP.

I'm not sure Ableton could/would ever license NKS or VIP, if not they would have to design yet another standard and then try to get plugin mfrs to adopt it. Good luck when even VST3 support from mfrs is sparse. Just an extension of the rack macro concept with more knobs and paging would be good enough for me.

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