Virtual Analog vs Wavetable synthesis

[selthym]

A quick google search didn't explain it for me.

What is the difference between Virtual Analog Synthesis and Wavetable synthesis?

Are any particular sounds easier to create with one or the other?

[Tympanic]

?
?

[jonathan harker]

could help: http://www.tronaudio.com/home/item/74-c ... -synthesis
i have no clue! i´m trying to get my head around fm synthesis at the moment. there are tons of tutorials out there! just search on all available channels. cheers, alex

[supamonsta]

A quick google search didn't explain it for me.

well in that case, try a longer google search

=> substractive synthesis (analog, virtual analog)
=> Wavetable syntheses, FM synthesis

good reading time!

cheers

[DaffyDub]

A quick search on "quickipedia"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sound_synthesis

[selthym]

turns out a quick search for Virtual Analog vs Wavetable synthesis turns up bugger all.

A search for synthesis types turns up plenty of info...

Interstingly no-one summed it up in a sentence or 2!!!

[justin]

virtual analog synthesis attempts to emulate what happens in analog circuits (ie. oscillator drift, electronic interference)

wavetable synthesis (commonly used in waldorf and PPG synths), uses a waveform which is "read by the oscillator". in the waldorf days it was a strip of tape which had a series of waveforms one after the other, the user can modulate the tape position to create a shifting/morphing timbre. Nowadays this is done all in digital with a lookup table / buffer to emulate this.

[massenmedium]

Haha, Waldorf using strips of tape? What what.

Anyway, just to confuse the issue even further, in the early PPG days of wavetable synthesis quite a few of the wavetables they used were intended to emulate analogue synthesis techniques like PWM and resonant filter sweeps. Still are actually if you look at the PPG wavetables in the Waldorf Blofeld and Largo.

[leedsquietman]

The MELLOTRON had sounds stored on a tape head. Never heard of the PPG Wave 2.2 which was a computer based wavetable synth (mostly with 8 bit samples of waveforms from various sources) but with analogue filters.
http://www.synthmuseum.com/ppg/ppgwave01.html

Look up ANALOGUE SUBTRACTIVE synthesis i.e. as used on Moogs, Sequential Circuits and older Rolands and Korgs like the Jupiter 4/6/8 and MS20 and MonoPoly etc.
http://www.planetoftunes.com/synth/subtractive.htm

[justin]

Haha, Waldorf using strips of tape? What what.

Anyway, just to confuse the issue even further, in the early PPG days of wavetable synthesis quite a few of the wavetables they used were intended to emulate analogue synthesis techniques like PWM and resonant filter sweeps. Still are actually if you look at the PPG wavetables in the Waldorf Blofeld and Largo.

as always the emphasis is on what was "intended" rather than the actual outcome! but i guess its all quite subjective when saying something sounds more analog than xyz. from a technical point of view virtual analog should yield closer results to actual analog gear than wavetable synthesis. although u can apply virtual analog techniques to wavetable synthesis (ie. u-he zebra synth)

as if it wasnt confusing enough!

[massenmedium]

as always the emphasis is on what was "intended" rather than the actual outcome!

Yeah those wavetables have their own sound which is interesting and characteristic in itself.

To mention them again, the recent Waldorf synths completely blend wavetable synthesis with analogue modelling. You have modelled analogue oscillators and/or oscillators that use wavetables (which are basically a series of waveforms that can be scanned through in various ways), which can then be run through modelled analogue filters etc.

[selthym]

The above is pretty much getting to the point why I posted.

I understand subtractive synthesis, and when reading about wavetable synthesis and looking at some of the vst's I have that apparently use wavetable synthesis (waldorf ppg2 vst for example) it looks very similar to subtractive synthesis.

Sound Source (Oscillator or Wavetable) to filter to amp with a few envolpe generators and either wavetable modifiers or a pitch/detune control.

[massenmedium]

Putting things through filters is 'subtractive synthesis'.

That doesn't necessarily mean analogue or virtual analogue.

Analogue modelling implies that mathematical models of actual analogue circuits are being used.

[anybody human]

Wavetable synths have quite an aggresive sound, but the newer Waldorf Blofeld & Largo (softsynth) do the virtual analogue thing well also. I like to use wavetables for a part to really jump out, or to add a lot of movement by modulating 2 wavetable osc. and their filter panning etc. I've had Largo for awhile now, will get results as a VA also, I like the filters & their different types of drive and the modulation routings are setup well (some pre routed & then a mod matrix also).