Machinate wrote:herp derp - clearly you're just not professional enough to bitch about problems, Paddy!Pitch Black wrote:Have you guys tried using a common MIDI clock-master, and both instances of Live working as slaves? Such as a hardware drum mach, groovebox, master-keyboard clock, etc
That always worked well enough for me. Hows it been in your experience?
:bighug,bighug:
Thanks for the update, Ableton. I've got students on a locked image, lamenting the absence of amp models in Live, and then you go and do this shit. Lovely.
That is great for you guys that you can live with it ...
And that the students have a teacher that dont even gets that there are some glitches regarding the syncing..ok...too in depth stuff would be irritating and might make ableton live look bad.. We dont want that...
And maybe the times are over where live as clock slave jumps to the offbeat after 20 minutes.. So we had some little improovements in the past..But they never did it wright sofar, fixed it once and for all...
You still have tempo fluctuations as clock slave.. when you do goa trance like pitchblack that might be ok.. for breakbeat stuff it matters even less..
And pitchblack gets it done with an external hardware clock master. So no ableton internal solution..
No propper syncing between to ableton Live laptops without the aid of extra hard or software...
That is the problem.. When there wouldnt be workarounds Ableton would have got much more noise about the issue allready.
But are work arounds acceptable in a situation where they can sync to timecode records now but still not just with another ableton live instance?
Sorry.. the serato bridge release defently marks the point where users should act a bit more pissed off regarding the sync issues.
!
So live as clock slave is not very good working.. natives instrument reaktor in stand alone is much better for example...
Other daw´s dont care about beeing clocksynced.. but other daw´s dont try to replace our old stagehardware..
So it´s a special demand for propper clock slaving for a program like ableton live. You need it to hold the tempo and not fluctuate around the tempo.. when i want swing i program it. The wobbeling is unecessary and when doing recordings a source of brown henke dither.
When you have longer sections of string stuff in repitch mode you dont like the pitch modulation or when you do doublings on the bassdrum on house related stuff you dont like it..or when you just try to do the main beat with ableton live you might not like it when your 808 set sounds like beeing drunk.
Some very early versions of live behaved better than L8 now. And L8 behaves a bit better than some previous versions.. but no real fix.. the tempo is still fluctuating too much..should be at least the factor 10 better.. or in ideal 100% stable as we have it with native instruments reaktor...
and thats only the clock slave aspect of the sync misery...
As clock master we have the violation of the midi standard problem that causes glitches when you dont give live an exclusiv clockport... so you need external mergers and over complicated midi wiring on stage to overcome that..
in case you want to sync via timecode you need again another soft or hardware daw as timecode master .,because ableton choosed to be the only daw on the market that cant produce a midi timecode...
as timcode slave we have certain glitches.. so as timecode slave you better dont work in session mode..
and there are funny phenomens with certain offsets.. i reported that, but again it dont looks like that ableton has realized that as buggy behaviour...
And of cause we miss the function to lock events in arrange to the timecode position, what makes a lot of standard tc slave operations difficult or impossible.
Thats a bunch of little problems that stay there since years... and since years users wish improovements..
Thanks god, at one point came the dj nudge function..since than we can run in free sync ..so you just pitch in like a dj, and let it run..
The only convinient way to deal with the situation... Too bad that lives reaktion to start comands is buggy..so you allways need to nudge even when you have pressed start in the wright moment..Only working with user remote scripts gives slightly better results here.. In any case on stages with bad monitoring problematic and extra twiddeling that takes time and concentration from your main tasks like playing keyboard for example...
Its pretty funny that in a time where dj´s stop to beatmatch you start doing that as live act...
Sorry..thats rather weard considering that this all worked fine with hardware back in the late 80´s allready..
There is not much excuse to dont get that fixed except ignorance towards the problem.
The problem is that we have errors in all parts of the syncing mechanisms of Ableton Live.
Ableton is shifting this kind of detail problems allways to a later point in favor of sale argument features...
amp simulation.. pfff.. when i want a amp simulation on stage i use a little line 6 device or a boss fx board or have a varity of 3rd party plugs...
when i want to dj with timecode records i do that with serato or traktor alone... the ability to hook on with ableton live is a
"Ritchie Hawtin needs it" luxury function.. he is to lazy to do the beat matching with the nudge buttons.. so we have comfi time code record beat matching now.. whhooo.. thats the improovment the live act world needs..
Sorry.. i could be positive about this kind of news when the old dirt would have been cleaned out before that...
And the syncing department is not the only one where Ableton is missing the sense for important details..
APC support is another issue here..