Sick of hearing about M4L

[Warrior Bob]

It's the same thing in terms of sound design I think. Consider something like Robert Henke's granulator. It's really great but it's hard to imagine that Ableton could anticipate every such device and build a native version or a bunch of native modules that would exhaust the possibilities. Sometimes you have an idea for a sound-making thing and you just have to program it because it doesn't exist.

Oh, I was just talking about the most common things that people ask for; I should've been a bit clearer. I don't think anyone honestly expects Henke's granulator to be a basic Live feature, but lots of people seem to expect, say, LFOs for modulating arbitrary parameters. I would think Ableton would want to put features like that in, to make their product that much more attractive.

But I agree, for the majority of creative M4L devices, best to leave those with M4L; that's what it's there for.

[hoffman2k]

It's the same thing in terms of sound design I think. Consider something like Robert Henke's granulator. It's really great but it's hard to imagine that Ableton could anticipate every such device and build a native version or a bunch of native modules that would exhaust the possibilities. Sometimes you have an idea for a sound-making thing and you just have to program it because it doesn't exist.

Oh, I was just talking about the most common things that people ask for; I should've been a bit clearer. I don't think anyone honestly expects Henke's granulator to be a basic Live feature, but lots of people seem to expect, say, LFOs for modulating arbitrary parameters. I would think Ableton would want to put features like that in, to make their product that much more attractive.

But I agree, for the majority of creative M4L devices, best to leave those with M4L; that's what it's there for.

There is another way of looking at it. I'm paraphrasing here, but Robert Henke once said that LFO's in Live would require a rewrite. This is a long time ago.
As MFL progressed, so did the Live API. Its only as off Live 8.2.2 that all features are in place for Ableton to implement Native LFO's that can control anything in Live. So it literally became possible to implement a couple of months ago.

While Live almost always looks the same and has so for over 2 years, Live is still constantly evolving. MFL is only helping it evolve quicker.
Hell, it sends out proper sync to drum machines now. I think that was one of my first bug reports. Only took about 7-8 years to see that change. Some of us still had hair then...
Ableton... Slow and Steady wins the race. They nailed the slow, lets hope they nail the steady.

[3dot...]

It's the same thing in terms of sound design I think. Consider something like Robert Henke's granulator. It's really great but it's hard to imagine that Ableton could anticipate every such device and build a native version or a bunch of native modules that would exhaust the possibilities. Sometimes you have an idea for a sound-making thing and you just have to program it because it doesn't exist.

Oh, I was just talking about the most common things that people ask for; I should've been a bit clearer. I don't think anyone honestly expects Henke's granulator to be a basic Live feature, but lots of people seem to expect, say, LFOs for modulating arbitrary parameters. I would think Ableton would want to put features like that in, to make their product that much more attractive.

But I agree, for the majority of creative M4L devices, best to leave those with M4L; that's what it's there for.

There is another way of looking at it. I'm paraphrasing here, but Robert Henke once said that LFO's in Live would require a rewrite. This is a long time ago.
As MFL progressed, so did the Live API. Its only as off Live 8.2.2 that all features are in place for Ableton to implement Native LFO's that can control anything in Live. So it literally became possible to implement a couple of months ago.

While Live almost always looks the same and has so for over 2 years, Live is still constantly evolving. MFL is only helping it evolve quicker.
Hell, it sends out proper sync to drum machines now. I think that was one of my first bug reports. Only took about 7-8 years to see that change. Some of us still had hair then...
Ableton... Slow and Steady wins the race. They nailed the slow, lets hope they nail the steady.

I completely agree!

first off..
Live8 is a huge jump forward (comparing to 5->6 and 6->7)..
when I saw the feature list in the L8 announcement...my jaw literally dropped..
from there it only took them about a year to get it to act straight ..(8.2)

Live now acts better for me than the latest v7..
the midi-sync issue would be a great example..

m4l implementation is still a bit rough.. and still requires the use of 3rd party "workarounds"..
but what it DOES deliver.. (Max/Msp inside Live increases it's power tenfold).it's insane !!