That makes sense. So the level meter on Lives faders is kind of like the RMS of the frequencies?Forge. wrote:because -36 dB is only the level of certain frequencies. It all adds up together.
it is a SPECTRUM of many frequencies. "spectrum" is telling you what is going on for each frequency band.
Room Treatment
Re: Room Treatment
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Re: Room Treatment
ze2be wrote:OK, I tried the noise trick. In the picture here the dark line is the white noise before the room recording. The bright line is when the same audio is recorded with the NT3 microphone. The grid is in steps of 6db. Appears that from 100 Hz and down, I loose about 12db. There is also a dip around 10kHz. Is this OKish, or is it bad?
I wonder why 0db on Lives faders equal to -36db on the spectrum..
So at least, your room does no tseem to have any high resonant peaks. Thats good. Try again with a sine sweep, and see if you can hear what your measurements say.
My English is not perfect, I know... Sorry about that.
Greetings from Germany!
P.S. to wishlist forum users: Please search for former requests. Otherwise they will be splitted into many small ones and we are loosing impact!!!
Greetings from Germany!
P.S. to wishlist forum users: Please search for former requests. Otherwise they will be splitted into many small ones and we are loosing impact!!!
Re: Room Treatment
No Live's level meter is a "Peak meter" which means it really just shows the loudest sound at a given moment.ze2be wrote:That makes sense. So the level meter on Lives faders is kind of like the RMS of the frequencies?Forge. wrote:because -36 dB is only the level of certain frequencies. It all adds up together.
it is a SPECTRUM of many frequencies. "spectrum" is telling you what is going on for each frequency band.
If you extend the mixer upwards it shows the actual peak level above each fader.
Re: Room Treatment
I read about the piece but I never knew it had such a practical application. Would you not get a better result with something more full frequency than a voice? Edit- I just spotted uncloned's white noise example.punching_sandwiches wrote:The trick is to first record something (in the video it is a paragraph of text spoken) then to play that back into the same room it was recorded in and record that.
Do this a hand full of times (maybe even more) and what happens is that each recording amplifies the resonances in the room.
It's a great art piece but also fantastic for finding what frequencies your room resonates at.
In an ideal environment the sound should be pretty much dead.
In my case I get a HUGE peak at 133Hz after only a few rounds. This is telling me that that is a problematic frequency in my room.
I was wondering if this frequency constitutes bass traps or another type of room treatment.
Re: Room Treatment
Dam, I never knew that. Thanks for the heads upForge. wrote:If you extend the mixer upwards it shows the actual peak level above each fader.
Re: Room Treatment
I'm not so sure these methods are very accurate.
If you get the REW software, it gives you the instructions, compensates for your soundcard, and gives you waterfall so you can better see the modal ringing, etc. And it's free.
In general for home studios or smaller rooms the recommendation seems to be (in order of importance)
1) Speaker placement
2) Acoustic treatment including mostly bass traps to control the low end
3) EQ, etc to fix any small unresolved issues.
If you're serious about it there are some very helpful (professional) people in that gearslutz forum I mentioned. If you end up buying panels or bass traps from any of the retailers, they'll go even further to help get your room just right.
If you get the REW software, it gives you the instructions, compensates for your soundcard, and gives you waterfall so you can better see the modal ringing, etc. And it's free.
In general for home studios or smaller rooms the recommendation seems to be (in order of importance)
1) Speaker placement
2) Acoustic treatment including mostly bass traps to control the low end
3) EQ, etc to fix any small unresolved issues.
If you're serious about it there are some very helpful (professional) people in that gearslutz forum I mentioned. If you end up buying panels or bass traps from any of the retailers, they'll go even further to help get your room just right.
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Re: Room Treatment
OK, I will have a look at REW. Regarding 3. If you look at my graph just as an example, would you use an eq on the master, boosting the drop out frequencies from 100hz and down? Does that even work? I mean, if those frequencies already phaze them self out, would it really change to bring up the gain of those frequencies.tech44 wrote:I'm not so sure these methods are very accurate.
If you get the REW software, it gives you the instructions, compensates for your soundcard, and gives you waterfall so you can better see the modal ringing, etc. And it's free.
In general for home studios or smaller rooms the recommendation seems to be (in order of importance)
1) Speaker placement
2) Acoustic treatment including mostly bass traps to control the low end
3) EQ, etc to fix any small unresolved issues.
Re: Room Treatment
do you have a sub?ze2be wrote:OK, I will have a look at REW. Regarding 3. If you look at my graph just as an example, would you use an eq on the master, boosting the drop out frequencies from 100hz and down? Does that even work? I mean, if those frequencies already phaze them self out, would it really change to bring up the gain of those frequencies.tech44 wrote:I'm not so sure these methods are very accurate.
If you get the REW software, it gives you the instructions, compensates for your soundcard, and gives you waterfall so you can better see the modal ringing, etc. And it's free.
In general for home studios or smaller rooms the recommendation seems to be (in order of importance)
1) Speaker placement
2) Acoustic treatment including mostly bass traps to control the low end
3) EQ, etc to fix any small unresolved issues.
Re: Room Treatment
Yes, but I dont use it. Room is L shaped, 3x5x3m. Genelec 1030A with a 6.5" bass. Monitors in the corner of the L shape. Long side is the living room, short side is the kitchen.Forge. wrote:do you have a sub?
Im currently reading the 29 page thread about KRK Ergo. And ive seen all the videos of REW - Room EQ Wizard. I dont have real bass traps, but ive filled the 2 closest corners with thick foam, and defuser foam in the roof and on the 2 closest walls.
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- Posts: 377
- Joined: Tue Nov 15, 2005 11:06 am
Re: Room Treatment
And the result is...?ze2be wrote:I dont have real bass traps, but ive filled the 2 closest corners with thick foam, and defuser foam in the roof and on the 2 closest walls.
My English is not perfect, I know... Sorry about that.
Greetings from Germany!
P.S. to wishlist forum users: Please search for former requests. Otherwise they will be splitted into many small ones and we are loosing impact!!!
Greetings from Germany!
P.S. to wishlist forum users: Please search for former requests. Otherwise they will be splitted into many small ones and we are loosing impact!!!
Re: Room Treatment
So far ist whats on the Spectrum picture I posted above. Im currently looking into if I need a better measure mic then my rode nt3. Behringer ecm8000? If I should get either a KRK Ergo or JBL MSC1 room correction system, or spend the money on better bass traps.Der_Makrophag wrote:And the result is...?ze2be wrote:I dont have real bass traps, but ive filled the 2 closest corners with thick foam, and defuser foam in the roof and on the 2 closest walls.
Re: Room Treatment
Well, I wouldn't go by that graph TBH. But, even if you use the REW, the eq is a last resort for minor corrections that can't be addressed any other way. Speaker placement and traps are going to get you much better results.ze2be wrote:OK, I will have a look at REW. Regarding 3. If you look at my graph just as an example, would you use an eq on the master, boosting the drop out frequencies from 100hz and down? Does that even work? I mean, if those frequencies already phaze them self out, would it really change to bring up the gain of those frequencies.tech44 wrote:I'm not so sure these methods are very accurate.
If you get the REW software, it gives you the instructions, compensates for your soundcard, and gives you waterfall so you can better see the modal ringing, etc. And it's free.
In general for home studios or smaller rooms the recommendation seems to be (in order of importance)
1) Speaker placement
2) Acoustic treatment including mostly bass traps to control the low end
3) EQ, etc to fix any small unresolved issues.
Having said that, every graph is going to roll off on the low end regardless. You're not going to get it completely flat.
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Re: Room Treatment
You can get a cheap spl meter and get good results:ze2be wrote:So far ist whats on the Spectrum picture I posted above. Im currently looking into if I need a better measure mic then my rode nt3. Behringer ecm8000? If I should get either a KRK Ergo or JBL MSC1 room correction system, or spend the money on better bass traps.Der_Makrophag wrote:And the result is...?ze2be wrote:I dont have real bass traps, but ive filled the 2 closest corners with thick foam, and defuser foam in the roof and on the 2 closest walls.
http://www.realtraps.com/art_microphones.htm
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Re: Room Treatment
I spent days with speaker placement, moving and measuring each time. Tedious as hell but managed to reduce the common 100hz null that is common in smaller studios. Adding traps afterwards flattened the response even further. Tiny adjustments even within 1" have an affect on the measurement. Even went as far as vnc'ing into my iMac via my phone to take the measurements without being in the room.