FIFA World Cup

[derzai]

To beat Germany? you will have to "neutralize" Lahm. All the "Aufbau" starts with him. Lahm is the keyplayer.

[TomViolenz]

So it's OK for Argentina to play defensively, but not for the Netherlands?

Either way, to the major football nations, the bronze final really doesn't matter, and van Gaal has been quite vocal that it shouldn't even be played. To me, though, it seemed as though the Dutch were genuinely happy when they scored and won.

Netherlands against Argentinia for entering the finals - defensive?! Sure, whatever it takes!

Against a defense that can be outplayed by the team from the next village in a game that they themselves professed doesn't matter? Hell no! I mean there were scenes where they were almost alone with 3 people running up to Brazils penalty zone and only two totally confused Brazilian defenders between them and the next goal. And what do they do?! Pass back to the midfield...
There is defensive and then their is refusal to play the game. The game last night was the latter.

[TomViolenz]

Als Rudi Völler im Trainingsanzug zum Interview mit Waldemar Hartmann im Fernsehstudio der ARD aufschlägt, wenige Meter von der Kabine entfernt, ist er ohnehin nicht amüsiert. "Das Spiel war sicher alles andere als gut," sagte er dem Magazin "Rund" drei Jahre danach. "Aber wir brauchten diesen Punkt, um Gruppensieger zu werden. Und dann musst du auch mal mit einem 0:0 in Island zufrieden sein." Als er dann mitbekommt, dass Experte Günter Netzer und Moderator Gerhard Delling von einem Tiefpunkt sprechen und mit ironischem Unterton eine Krise der Fernsehunterhaltung am heiligen Samstagabend ausrufen, verliert Rudi Völler die Fassung und die Druckreife.


Die erste Frage beantwortet er noch einigermaßen ruhig, doch dann legt er los: "Immer diese Geschichte mit dem Tiefpunkt und noch 'nem Tiefpunkt, dann gibt's noch mal 'nen niedrigeren Tiefpunkt. Ich kann diesen Scheißdreck nicht mehr hören." Hartmann versucht zu erklären: "Was er sagen wollte ..." Aber Rudi Völler ist nicht mehr aufzuhalten. "So ein Käse, ich lass mir das nicht mehr bieten. Solche Sachen wie die vom Delling." Hartmann verweist darauf, dass das Spiel nun wirklich nicht gut war. Vergeblich. Nun geht es Schlag auf Schlag. "Käse. So einen Käse will ich nicht mehr hören. So'n Scheiß! Das ist das Allerletzte."

Hartmann will beschwichtigen: "Für die Kritik ist doch ihre Mannschaft der eigentliche Ansprechpartner." Völler räumt ein, dass sein Team zu wenig geboten hat. "Aber der Scheiß, der da immer gelabert wird. Da sollten sich wirklich alle mal Gedanken machen, ob wir in Zukunft so weitermachen können. Immer diese Geschichte. Alles in den Dreck ziehen, alles runterziehen. Ich halte das nicht mehr aus. Ihr müsst doch mal endlich vom hohen Ross runterkommen, was ihr euch immer alle einbildet, was wir für einen Fußball in Deutschland spielen müssen. Was hat denn der Günter früher für einen Scheiß gespielt? Standfußball war das doch früher. Alles in den Dreck zu ziehen ist für mich unterste Schublade."

While the football in Völlers times, was certainly nothing to write home about, he has a point: The constant nonsense that football commentators on German TV are blabbering is nothing but aggrevating!

[TomViolenz]

To beat Germany? you will have to "neutralize" Lahm. All the "Aufbau" starts with him. Lahm is the keyplayer.

How do you suggest to neutralize a right forward defender?
Or did you forget that he was (luckily!!!) moved from the center position back into the defense?!

If anyone you would have to neutralize Schweinsteiger.
But I doubt that neutralizing single players is an approach the Argentinians will choose. (and they shouldn't IMO)

I think the Germans will try to somewhat neutralize Messi, but I don't think this will be done to the extend that the Dutch have done it.
It also breaks the whole concept of attacking and defending as a whole team somewhat, which is arguably one of our strength (on good days anyways)

[derzai]

How do you suggest to neutralize a right forward defender?

put a guy on him that follows him all the time. wherever he may be.

[derzai]

just checking if you are still there, or already in the pub.

have a good match. may the best win.

[TomViolenz]

How do you suggest to neutralize a right forward defender?

put a guy on him that follows him all the time. wherever he may be.

Well, but that would have to be someone of Argentinas offense then. I don't think that's a common thing for an offensive player or even striker to do man-on man cover for the defense of the other team.
I mean weirder things have happened, but I don't think Lahm is that good.

BTW: The whole game yesterday the twelve year old in me wished for your guy Blind to be on our team to play alongside Lahm

I'm off to the pub as soon as the rain stops.

[re:dream]

Eish. Felt sad for Messi. But Germany deserved the win.

[TomViolenz]

This was a worthy world cup final and both teams proved that they belonged there!
The first half was very equal and quite instense. Good defense on both sides! Good offense out of the general game from us and great counter offensive moves from the Argentinians. We got quite lucky in a few situations.
The second half was also equal in power, but technically not as good. But it stayed intense the whole match.

Then in extra time it was about who had still the most energy left, and it turns out that it was us
Götze made a beautiful goal.

Funny that one of the most useless players for our team so far, made the deciding, oh so important goal!
Also this was the first game that Özil decided to show up and play. Everybody was on their best, and it was absolutely needed. This titel has been a long thing coming for many in the team. I'm happy for them

Messi, while certainly the best player in the world right now, should not have won player of the tournament though.
It was an undeserved condolence price, that he quite visibly didn't give a shit about (not having won the titel). Well maybe next time, Messi, three is the charm, just as it was for our guys

[sporkles]

So, what should we talk about now?

[TomViolenz]

So, what should we talk about now?

Good question. I feel so empty now

[TomViolenz]

So apparently there is a so called internet shitstorm on its way (aka storm in a tea cup )
Because the German players were making fun of the Argentinians during the victory celebrations. (If I undertood correctly then they were first dancing upright and singing "that's how the Germans dance, lalala" and then bowing down and singing "this is how the Argentinians dance.....".)

So online media (mostly German) is up in arms talking about discraceful winners, some even used the term racism...

What are the thoughts on this here?

Normal behavior of a winning sports team rubbing it into the defeated team some more, or a disgraceful return of the Arian beast?!

Discuss!

[regretfullySaid]

If a winner is rubbing it into the loser, then yes, it is bad sportsmanship, unless it's like a couple friends playing for fun. But what if in fact that is how Argentinians actually dance?
Srsly though if you won the world cup it would be pretty bad to be knocking the loser, even if it was a year later.

[TomViolenz]

If a winner is rubbing it into the loser, then yes, it is bad sportsmanship, unless it's like a couple friends playing for fun. But what if in fact that is how Argentinians actually dance?
Srsly though if you won the world cup it would be pretty bad to be knocking the loser, even if it was a year later.

Interesting. Never really having been a fan of a sports team, I just took it as a given that these sorts of antics are just part of the whole thing.

I was actually rolling my eyes at the media for wanting to make it a big deal.

For me it feels different saying: "Ah, the Argentinians sucked, and we were so awesome" or just "Ha ha, we won and you lost"

But if it is indeed uncommon to do this, then I guess it does stick out as bad behaviour.

[rikhyray]

it's like a couple friends playing for fun. .

And that was all to it. The German team stayed in cottages - couple of rooms/players in each and on the welcome event in Berlin each of those groups 3 or 4 of them entered the stage with some silly choreographies, some did rock style air guitars, other di that gaucho dance, all that Mallorca/Ibiza meets US spring break - drunken (harmless) non-sense.
Couple of journalists- the hardcore old media- tried to generate what Germans like to call shit storm, to catch the attention in the battle with Twitter, Facebook, YouTube. It seems to accelerate the realisation that they already lost the public under 40 years of age and keep loosing the elder public as well. It totally backfired and those journalists are perceived, on a massive scale, as attention whores and fools.