Just getting started! New toys?
Just getting started! New toys?
Hi everyone thanks for taking time to read this, I am practically brand new to all of this, I have been listening to edm since high school, and since I have been to events and festivals music has changed my life, I love the energy and positivity I can feel through the music, anyways.. I finally made the leap to attempt to produce music and I have a buddy who plays local shows around my state in Washington, he suggested ableton live with a MacBook, not too sure if I was even going to be able to somewhat make a song that sounded nice, I bought the MacBook, and an m-audio oxygen49 midi keyboard that came with lite live. I am obsessed, I have been watching many videos on YouTube when I get stumped on something and I can seem to move past it without wasting too much time, this being said I'm fully convinced on upgrading to suite within the next week, question is, what other toys should I consider buying? I have the keyboard and it has some bells and whistles but I was looking at some of the push pads, does anyone recommend the next step after my basic midi keyboard? I want to produce trap, the sound of nghtmres dum dum keys n krates remix is what I strive to produce. Any input is great thank you!
Re: Just getting started! New toys?
Are you a musician or not? Know anything about music theory or song structure?
Certainly an Ableton Push 2 controller will make it very easy for you to get things going. To make drum patterns and find chords and melodies. It adds things to Live that other external hardware does not. It gives Live new functionality.
After reading your post, that's what I'd recommend for you.
Certainly an Ableton Push 2 controller will make it very easy for you to get things going. To make drum patterns and find chords and melodies. It adds things to Live that other external hardware does not. It gives Live new functionality.
After reading your post, that's what I'd recommend for you.
Last edited by 102455 on Sat Oct 15, 2016 8:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Just getting started! New toys?
I am not a musician no, I played the saxophone for 5 years growing up but that is as extensive as it got, music is in my blood though, my sister mastered in viola and got an associate for violin all on a full scholarship, I chose a different path of life, enjoyed going out and partying etc, I do not know jack about music theory, like I stated before I'm coming into this blind, but very motivated.. so I have been looking at the push as well, is there a significant difference between that specific one and one of the other novation launchpads?
Re: Just getting started! New toys?
FWIW, here are my recommendations:
1. Yes, by all means, buy Live Suite.
2. Buy a Push 2. If you are going to buy into the Ableton ecosystem, do it the right way. At this point I do 90% of my music production directly on the Push, without even looking at my MacBook screen.
3. Read the Live/Push manual. Really. It is not only well written, it is often humorous as well. A lot of the questions on these forums are about things that are answered in the manual.
4. Consider buying a good audio interface. I won't go into the many options available as these are discussed in many threads on this and other forums.
5. Buy a copy of Curtis Roads's The Computer Music Tutorial. Then read it. It is expensive, but it is also 1200+ pages of completeness. If you want to understand what that knob does and why you might want to change it, there is no better place to learn. You will also come to appreciate that, despite what the respective marketing departments tell you, all of the plugins and toys are essentially the same inside. (I say this as a plugin developer, effectively shooting myself in the foot.)
6. Above all else, dive deep and learn to use the instruments and effects that come with Live Suite. You will be able to do 99.9% of what you want if you do so. Learn to use the Spectrum effect. It doesn't affect the sound, it merely enlightens you, the producer, in ways that staring at waveforms never will. Learn especially about Live's instrument and effect racks, and make them your friends. For example, instead of buying yet another 'analogue' synth (that is in fact digital—you really do have to love those marketing departments) just because it has four oscillators instead of the two in Analog, combine two Analog synths in parallel in an instrument rack. Similarly, instead of buying a synth with a built-in delay and reverb, build your own effect rack with exactly what you want.
7. When you find that 0.01% case when the tools aren't quite what you want, turn to Max for Live (which comes with Live Suite). As far as I am concerned, Max for Live is the best thing about Live, and the best way that I know of to learn Max is a series of books called Electronic Music and Sound Design. Should you want to play with modular synthesis, consider buying OSCiLLOT by Max for Cats, available as a factory pack from Ableton.
8. When you feel the need for some outside-the-box inspiration, look into (and buy!) Diego Stocco's Rhythmic Convolutions. Watch some of the videos on his YouTube channel. No one will ever call your work 'derivative' after that...
9. Did I mention that you should just get the Push 2? It will not only allow you to do pretty much everything that any other controller can do, but it will also change the way you think about (and use) Live itself.
1. Yes, by all means, buy Live Suite.
2. Buy a Push 2. If you are going to buy into the Ableton ecosystem, do it the right way. At this point I do 90% of my music production directly on the Push, without even looking at my MacBook screen.
3. Read the Live/Push manual. Really. It is not only well written, it is often humorous as well. A lot of the questions on these forums are about things that are answered in the manual.
4. Consider buying a good audio interface. I won't go into the many options available as these are discussed in many threads on this and other forums.
5. Buy a copy of Curtis Roads's The Computer Music Tutorial. Then read it. It is expensive, but it is also 1200+ pages of completeness. If you want to understand what that knob does and why you might want to change it, there is no better place to learn. You will also come to appreciate that, despite what the respective marketing departments tell you, all of the plugins and toys are essentially the same inside. (I say this as a plugin developer, effectively shooting myself in the foot.)
6. Above all else, dive deep and learn to use the instruments and effects that come with Live Suite. You will be able to do 99.9% of what you want if you do so. Learn to use the Spectrum effect. It doesn't affect the sound, it merely enlightens you, the producer, in ways that staring at waveforms never will. Learn especially about Live's instrument and effect racks, and make them your friends. For example, instead of buying yet another 'analogue' synth (that is in fact digital—you really do have to love those marketing departments) just because it has four oscillators instead of the two in Analog, combine two Analog synths in parallel in an instrument rack. Similarly, instead of buying a synth with a built-in delay and reverb, build your own effect rack with exactly what you want.
7. When you find that 0.01% case when the tools aren't quite what you want, turn to Max for Live (which comes with Live Suite). As far as I am concerned, Max for Live is the best thing about Live, and the best way that I know of to learn Max is a series of books called Electronic Music and Sound Design. Should you want to play with modular synthesis, consider buying OSCiLLOT by Max for Cats, available as a factory pack from Ableton.
8. When you feel the need for some outside-the-box inspiration, look into (and buy!) Diego Stocco's Rhythmic Convolutions. Watch some of the videos on his YouTube channel. No one will ever call your work 'derivative' after that...
9. Did I mention that you should just get the Push 2? It will not only allow you to do pretty much everything that any other controller can do, but it will also change the way you think about (and use) Live itself.
Last edited by ecuk on Sat Oct 15, 2016 9:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Just getting started! New toys?
Yes. Push 2 is an Ableton product. It's designed purely for Live. It enhances Live. The integration between the software and hardware is fantastic.bfukai253 wrote:is there a significant difference between that specific one and one of the other novation launchpads?
Watch a bunch of videos on how composition works via Push 2, then go and buy one. I doubt you'll regret it.
Re: Just getting started! New toys?
Amazing, thank you so much, I will definitely be investing in the suite and push 2 within the next month, it's good to know that I don't have to go to a bunch of other software to pair with it, I will also look into the educational books, I need to work on my vocab that's for sure, I appreciate you guys!
Re: Just getting started! New toys?
I was given the opportunity to purchase suite and a push (1st gen) for 550$ only concern I have is, is the second generation of push much more versatile? I would be able to buy this now, where as I would have to wait a couple paychecks to get push2, but if it's worth it I'd rather wait.. also is there ever usually a cyber Monday or Black Friday deal for any of this??
Re: Just getting started! New toys?
I have Push 1, I bought for around $300 on eBay. It is one of the best gear purchases I've ever made.
Provided the seller is on the up and you can verify there will be no problem transferring the Suite license to your account then that's a steal. I think Push 1 will be plenty to get you up and running. It's extremely capable and still very relevant. If you find you're feeling like you've got to have a Push 2 then just put the gen 1 on eBay.
Key thing is, just make sure the Suite license is going to be transferred to your name and that it's a full license, not an upgrade.
Provided the seller is on the up and you can verify there will be no problem transferring the Suite license to your account then that's a steal. I think Push 1 will be plenty to get you up and running. It's extremely capable and still very relevant. If you find you're feeling like you've got to have a Push 2 then just put the gen 1 on eBay.
Key thing is, just make sure the Suite license is going to be transferred to your name and that it's a full license, not an upgrade.
Re: Just getting started! New toys?
Perfect, I will make sure it's a full transfer, the guy is on offerup so I will be meeting him in person as well, really excited. And I found that tutorial book for 40 as well and that will be in the mail soon.. appreciate the help buddy
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jestermgee
- Posts: 4500
- Joined: Mon Apr 26, 2010 6:38 am
Re: Just getting started! New toys?
My suggestion with beginners is "less is more"
It is very easy nowadays to get stuck in a track which makes you feel that new plugin or discounted package will help you get to the "next level" but if anything most times it does the opposite and simply gets in the way.
Suite is a good start because it does have a lot of good content to get ideas going, is all "in the box" without external instruments to learn and honestly, if you cannot create your first dozen tracks with what is included with Suit then you probably will not get benefit from spending more cash on more instruments.
Push is probably a very good first option as a controller, it's plug and play and P1 works very well.
As has been mentioned, a good audio interface is probably the next thing along with at least a good pair of monitoring headphones.
I would suggest to also keep in mind that you will not be creating top hit bangers within the first week (or even year). Be realistic and expect to learn new things every day/week for the rest of your time doing it and just have some fun.
It is very easy nowadays to get stuck in a track which makes you feel that new plugin or discounted package will help you get to the "next level" but if anything most times it does the opposite and simply gets in the way.
Suite is a good start because it does have a lot of good content to get ideas going, is all "in the box" without external instruments to learn and honestly, if you cannot create your first dozen tracks with what is included with Suit then you probably will not get benefit from spending more cash on more instruments.
Push is probably a very good first option as a controller, it's plug and play and P1 works very well.
As has been mentioned, a good audio interface is probably the next thing along with at least a good pair of monitoring headphones.
I would suggest to also keep in mind that you will not be creating top hit bangers within the first week (or even year). Be realistic and expect to learn new things every day/week for the rest of your time doing it and just have some fun.
Re: Just getting started! New toys?
Very good advice, I have seen some plugins on some videos where I'm thinking wow that makes that easy, but i figure this is 2016, there's other ways to do it. I am enjoying everything ableton has to offer itself, I am learning more and more every hour. I mainly picked this up not for fame but to get a new motivation for myself and it is working therapeutically. If it ends up making me rich and famous, hey I will never stop being humble haha, I am convinced to get this push and suite deal.. I know all of this is taking time and I just want to actually know what I'm talking about when someone asks me how I did something instead of making myself sound like an uneducated fool haha. Thank you for your input!
Re: Just getting started! New toys?
Regarding the deal which includes a Push 1....
It might be too early to ask you this, but are you more likely to be using MIDI and synth stuff in your music, or audio (samples etc)?
One of the major differences between the Pushes is that v1 doesn't do audio/sample stuff, and Push 2 does.
I always held off getting a mk1 Push because of the inability to work with audio clips and samples - which for me is a big part of Live and of my productions.
It might be too early to ask you this, but are you more likely to be using MIDI and synth stuff in your music, or audio (samples etc)?
One of the major differences between the Pushes is that v1 doesn't do audio/sample stuff, and Push 2 does.
I always held off getting a mk1 Push because of the inability to work with audio clips and samples - which for me is a big part of Live and of my productions.
Re: Just getting started! New toys?
As of recently I have been using more samples and clips, I am still learning how to make certain sounds, sound the way I want them too, once I learn more bells and whistles I see myself using my midi controller, I am very interested in music theory now that I've delved into it a little, so I have no idea what I will use more once I learn more tricks haha
Re: Just getting started! New toys?
As of recently I have been using more samples and clips, I am still learning how to make certain sounds, sound the way I want them too, once I learn more bells and whistles I see myself using my midi controller, I am very interested in music theory now that I've delved into it a little, so I have no idea what I will use more once I learn more tricks haha
Re: Just getting started! New toys?
jestermgee wrote:My suggestion with beginners is "less is more"
It is very easy nowadays to get stuck in a track which makes you feel that new plugin or discounted package will help you get to the "next level" but if anything most times it does the opposite and simply gets in the way.
this...