To be clear on my opinions:stringtapper wrote:Probably the one thing you and I completely agree on when it comes to M4L. The whole pairing of two separate apps with a bit of code that lets them talk to each other has always seemed a bit clunky to me. Of course integrating a special version of Max within Live's codebase might be monumental task and could even require a ground-up rewrite of Live.Angstrom wrote:Opinion: This software pairing does not feel robust and tightly integrated. quite the opposite.
But that's exactly what I expected when M4L was first announced and I still think it could be an amazing step if they decided to re-engineer the entire M4L environment so that it is native to Live and not dependent on installing the standalone Max app.
I think Max is a remarkable software environment in its breadth of scope, but that same scope opens the door to a myriad of integration issues, platform dependency issues, and 3rd party errors. The Ableton Live application's brand values have always been stability and an intuitive UI for music creation. Live 8 was notable for Gerhard's public Mea Culpa to the users (the codebase stability audit & hiatus) So the inclusion of an open door to 3rd party issues was an unusual decision.
API endpoints are fine, Ableton can police those easily but M4L is presented as an integrated product with Ableton Live. That raises expectations of the M4L devices - If the Live core application updates then we expect native devices to update and remain functional. Even 3rd party VSTs will likely have bugfixes included, but for M4L devices ... they appear native but are a gateway to future problems. here's a typical Non-functional Example . Alternatively : how up to date is your Convolution Reverb Device ?
I've always suspected the power of Max as a visual prototyping tool seduced the Ableton devs into opening Pandoras box. Extending the existing codebase seemed like a lot of work, while leveraging Max seemed easier and was more seductive to developers who create code. Max is great for prototyping software, but did Live users want to prototype software in their DAW? Or is that what software developers want. Are Live users naturally good coders? It makes the boom years of amateur VST creation seem well founded by comparison.
Again, I respect the power of Max as an application, and the integration has been a heroic task. But it was an odd choice in context.
Lastly to note: I'm fully capable of using it, but it feels a LOT like my day job - because I will write shitty badly conceived code in it, and it will all crash.