Why isn't there a link to this forum on the Ableton site?

[Nokatus]

The forum is like hidden away or something.

You literally need to google Ableton and forum in order to find it , the community links on the Ableton site are for user groups and such.

[fishmonkey]

it's been that way since the redesign of the Ableton site a few years ago...

[Tarekith]

Because too many people were mistakenly thinking this was an official support outlet.

[slatepipe]

it would be nice if they would put it back. they could just put a big sign on the top of it or something, with a contact support link. it's nice to ask questions from the other users sometimes too

[Angstrom]

Because too many people were mistakenly thinking this was an official support outlet.

I'm REALLY not convinced this is truthful

Surely we all know that the true reason is: this forum became full of trolls who put up political rants, hate speech, and flew off the handle when they were asked to tone it down. It was an embarrassment to Ableton.

There was a time when the forum was 80% a fun place where the developers dropped by and chatted about stuff, 2005 - 2008 sort of time. Prehistory.
Unfortunately the forum was not moderated at that time. Ableton held to a sort of idealism that policing was bad, and so in this chaos the forum attracted some total idiots. In those days moderation was really, really light. too light..

Banned users would come back and ruin things. Example: once banned user came back multiple times to troll Dom as "Dum" and shitposted endlessly without any repercussions, as did many other users who all created alts to act like gibbons flinging shit. Most of it was intended as humour but it was all injokes, banner posts made by people from their IT cubicle jobs like a bald-man version of 4chan ... they liked it and wanted the shitstorm to continue forever. Those people had no interest in making music, only shitposting. Most people who said it was bad and needed resolving were harassed by these trolls, we got signed up to spam lists and they tried to hack our personal sites, and much worse.

The Lounge was created in 2010 as an attempt to partition off the shitposters, but unfortunately broken window syndrome had kicked in - the forum was now magnet for mentally health casualties.

So in 2013 Ableton quarantined the entire forum. and belatedly added some actual moderators who now delete and ban shitposters.
And here we are today. The forum is without shitposters, but it is also not exactly a vibrant community any more. Back in 2013 there was talk that the forum would be replaced by something better, but technical reasons mean this will probably happen around 2027

[jlgrimes]

The forum is like hidden away or something.

You literally need to google Ableton and forum in order to find it , the community links on the Ableton site are for user groups and such.

Good question.

[jlgrimes]

Because too many people were mistakenly thinking this was an official support outlet.

I'm REALLY not convinced this is truthful

Surely we all know that the true reason is: this forum became full of trolls who put up political rants, hate speech, and flew off the handle when they were asked to tone it down. It was an embarrassment to Ableton.

There was a time when the forum was 80% a fun place where the developers dropped by and chatted about stuff, 2005 - 2008 sort of time. Prehistory.
Unfortunately the forum was not moderated at that time. Ableton held to a sort of idealism that policing was bad, and so in this chaos the forum attracted some total idiots. In those days moderation was really, really light. too light..

Banned users would come back and ruin things. Example: once banned user came back multiple times to troll Dom as "Dum" and shitposted endlessly without any repercussions, as did many other users who all created alts to act like gibbons flinging shit. Most of it was intended as humour but it was all injokes, banner posts made by people from their IT cubicle jobs like a bald-man version of 4chan ... they liked it and wanted the shitstorm to continue forever. Those people had no interest in making music, only shitposting. Most people who said it was bad and needed resolving were harassed by these trolls, we got signed up to spam lists and they tried to hack our personal sites, and much worse.

The Lounge was created in 2010 as an attempt to partition off the shitposters, but unfortunately broken window syndrome had kicked in - the forum was now magnet for mentally health casualties.

So in 2013 Ableton quarantined the entire forum. and belatedly added some actual moderators who now delete and ban shitposters.
And here we are today. The forum is without shitposters, but it is also not exactly a vibrant community any more. Back in 2013 there was talk that the forum would be replaced by something better, but technical reasons mean this will probably happen around 2027

I never really thought the forums over here were that bad. I've been an Ableton user since 2007.

I remember the Propellerhead forums though used to be like a Gladiator ring. There were plenty of fights (I was in a few). If you say anything bad about the software, prepare to be slain.

I also used to visit the Sonar forums which was almost cultish. They didn't seem to get as mean as the Propellerhead forums but nonetheless if you got too critical on the program you would get jumped by multiple members.


Never got into many arguments here. People here usually state an opinion and either agree somewhat respectfully disagree or just don't chime in to stir up the fire.

I'd say Ableton, Reaper, and Studio One has pretty good forum members.

I mean disagreements happen here but I never seen it get ugly.

[Tarekith]

It's gotten pretty ugly here quite a few times, but we try and clean things up as soon as we can so most people don't see it all. Definitely a lot better the last couple years on that front.

[fishmonkey]

I never really thought the forums over here were that bad. I've been an Ableton user since 2007.

I mean disagreements happen here but I never seen it get ugly.

the exercise in free speech was at times entertaining and/or fascinating, however it most certainly used to get ugly sometimes. and almost all of the stuff that Angstrom is referring to had nothing to do with disagreements over music making tools.

[slatepipe]

nearly thirteen years i been reading this forum.
i still check it quite regularly but it's nowhere near as entertaining as it was since they put the lockdown on.

[nathannn]

total idiots.

mentally health casualties.

shitposters.

Did you call?