LIVE 10.1 New Delay Sounds Different - FIXED in Beta 10.1.2b3

[[jur]]

REPORT!!!

Do you mean post a bug report in the beta forum? Or "report" the issue to Abe support? Sorry a little unclear from your post

I think Angstrom's bug 6481 covers it, so I won't post a new one there.
I've emailed Support though, along with sent them the live Set.

It's all good then

[[jur]]

I did a similar test with Echo and I also get unexpected results:
- the modulations don't respect the waveforms shapes
- turning repitch off does still repitch, but in a slightly different way...

Angstrom & Pitch Black, you're welcome to add this info to your reports. I'm forwarding it on my side.

[[jur]]

There are some issues with the new delay interpolation.
I reported them in the beta but no response.

L10-BUG-6481

Yep, it looks like the behaviour you note would also be the cause of my woes. You're driving the problem by automating delay time with the LFO, I'm driving the problem by automating delay time using the 16th buttons.

The interpolation or "ramp speed" or "ballistics" between values/speeds as New Delay changes time values in Repitch mode is different.

This is a HUGE and stinky bug for me. It breaks a big part of how I perform live. (Squeltcy-squeltchy-dub-dub-dub as personal expression...)

The pic of the resulting pitch curve you posted in your bug report looks like what I'm hearing:
[Attribution: Angstrom]


I've emailed Support.

And now, turn freeze on... and you get a totally different result. Not sure what is expected, though.

[Pitch Black]

Cool, new behaviour and sounds are all fine, just as long as it doesnt destroy the old things.

Why couldn’t Simple Delay be kept around as a “classic” option. Lord knows Logic has some very ancient EQ options, going back to pre-Apple Emagic days!

[cotdagoo]

Why couldn’t Simple Delay be kept around as a “classic” option. Lord knows Logic has some very ancient EQ options, going back to pre-Apple Emagic days!

Yeah.. I even tried saving SimpleDelay from Live 9 and loading it into 10.1 similar to how people were using Live 8's old compressor after it was changed for Live 9... Doesn't work.

Seems like the entire Simple Delay framework has been removed in favour of this new device, so the old bits can't even be loaded when device saved from a previous version.

[[tow]]

Please report this directly to our Support (as 10.1 is released now), ideally with an example set, your steps to trigger the issue (expected vs. observed) and a recent status report. We would like to investigate this for sure.

[Pitch Black]

Please report this directly to our Support (as 10.1 is released now), ideally with an example set, your steps to trigger the issue (expected vs. observed) and a recent status report. We would like to investigate this for sure.

Already reported. Support ticket no. 2305443. Awaiting response.

[Pitch Black]

Support responded:

“I've attempted to reproduce this issue in-house, using your attached set, and can confirm that there is an audible difference in Delay output between Live 10.0.4 (10.0.6) and Live 10.1.

I've filed this issue as a bug and alerted our development team to the problem. I'll set your inquiry to 'On-Hold' and have attached your ticket to our tracking system so that you will be notified if and when we have an update regarding this issue.”

[Angstrom]

An update from the latest Beta changelog

Bugfixes:

• Live Sets created in versions of Live older than 10.1 that contain instances of Simple Delay or Ping Pong Delay devices with delay time automation now sound more consistent.

not tried it yet.

Unrelated but amusing, another bugfix is:

• Fixed a bug that caused the Wavetable device to output +100 dB when changing the range of a mapped Macro, under certain circumstances.

+100dB. wow. Thankfully I've not experienced that one.

Anyway. It looks like something is happening to the Delay to rectify the wrongs.

[[jur]]

Unrelated but amusing, another bugfix is:

• Fixed a bug that caused the Wavetable device to output +100 dB when changing the range of a mapped Macro, under certain circumstances.

+100dB. wow. Thankfully I've not experienced that one.

Your template has a Limiter on the Master anyway, no?
It makes me think that the default Live template should have one.

[pottering]

+ 100 db is not a big problem besides the obvious (clipping distortion), as no audio interface outputs more than 0 dBFS (so no need for limiters in the Master).

I mean, it is a problem, but not worse than those +5 dBFS presets you find in so many synths.

[Angstrom]

Your template has a Limiter on the Master anyway, no?
It makes me think that the default Live template should have one.

Have you been peeping in my window again?
Heh.

my default template (the one live loads automatically) doesn't have anything on the master. I have some other templates which are for other specific purposes and about a third of those have a limiter on the mains. Most explicably are those of my templates for jamming and performing live.

[Pitch Black]

An update from the latest Beta changelog

Bugfixes:

• Live Sets created in versions of Live older than 10.1 that contain instances of Simple Delay or Ping Pong Delay devices with delay time automation now sound more consistent.

Just tested, THIS FIXES IT!!! The old familliar squeltch is back!

[Tarekith]

Party time, celebrate!

[annadyne]

Thanks for posting about the anomaly with Delay - I just ran into this problem the other day.
Great to know it's been addressed!

You guys rock ~~~
~ Liz