ableton says no to selling operator

pulsoc · Post by **pulsoc** » Wed Sep 13, 2006 8:16 pm

john gordon wrote:they really do listen.......
Hello John,

Never mind. I can understand that our license policy can be slightly
confusing.

A little explanation:

A Live license consists of the first version you purchase and all
further version upgrades. As I explained yesterday and as it can also be
seen in our FAQ, a license may only be transferred as a whole. This way we
can secure that a Live serial number is upgraded only once.

Operator is also an upgrade and thus connected to a Live license, and
is not a separate license. But we can understand that regarding
transfers it should be allowed to be handled differently.

So we are going to change our license policy regarding Operator within
the next days. I cannot tell you exactly any details yet, since you
just called our attention to this issue.

We will let you know about our decision as soon as we made it.

Best regards,

Robert

Props, that looks like VERY good customer support. Just curious tho, why was Adonis able to sell his a few months ago if this is just now coming to their attention?

djadonis206 · Post by **djadonis206** » Wed Sep 13, 2006 8:17 pm

That's a good question - but I don't think I'm the only one who has sold a operator license...know what I mean

peace

A

DeadlyKungFu · Post by **DeadlyKungFu** » Wed Sep 13, 2006 8:20 pm

Adonis - did you buy your operator with 5.2 or as an add-on?

Props to the Abes for being outspoken and straightforward.

I wouldn't be so hard on John, the dude's stressed out, he's trying to move, looking for some cash AND he really wants to get Sampler. We were both really suprised at it all, it takes some time to come down from the disappointment.

john gordon · Post by **john gordon** » Wed Sep 13, 2006 8:44 pm

yeah.im sorry for being such a twat though.the ableton guys are just tryin to run a business.

frisbeedisk · Post by **frisbeedisk** » Wed Sep 13, 2006 8:48 pm

john gordon wrote:thats what i thought as well.i bought them seperately,but robert is trying to tell me that if i sell operator i must do it as a live/operator deal.its not even the stupid fucking 99 dolllars that concerns me,its the fact that this company is turning into capalist pigs.no problem.im out.

So we wont be seeing you round the forum anymore then!!...take care!!

djadonis206 · Post by **djadonis206** » Wed Sep 13, 2006 8:59 pm

DeadlyKungFu wrote:Adonis - did you buy your operator with 5.2 or as an add-on?

Props to the Abes for being outspoken and straightforward.

I wouldn't be so hard on John, the dude's stressed out, he's trying to move, looking for some cash AND he really wants to get Sampler. We were both really suprised at it all, it takes some time to come down from the disappointment.

Nah I bought it version 4

I'd be pissed to so Im right ther Doctor Gordon <-- don't ask me why I said that

I'm trying to figure out how I'm going to get my new crib pimped out so I'm all over the place

anywayz

peace

A

b0unce · Post by **b0unce** » Wed Sep 13, 2006 9:48 pm

john gordon wrote:yeah.im sorry for being such a twat though.the ableton guys are just tryin to run a business.

dont feel guilty man, we expressed our disgust and they listened. sometimes, nay, most of the time a catalyst is required. Now everyone is playing nice - so lets all coalesce in one big circle-jerk.

kennerb · Post by **kennerb** » Wed Sep 13, 2006 9:54 pm

b0unce wrote:so lets all coalesce in one big circle-jerk.

YAY!!!

Angstrom · Post by **Angstrom** » Wed Sep 13, 2006 10:00 pm

I have never been so glad to see an Angelfire "no hotlinking" image !

noisetonepause · Post by **noisetonepause** » Wed Sep 13, 2006 10:10 pm

I'm a little late to the party but I just want to say that it is utterly beyond me how anyone can think it is 'OK' for a company to sell you a software license that they have the right to revoke, but you have no option of selling on. That is far beyond just taking the piss - if it's not a crime then it bloody well should be.

I'd like to congratulate Ableton on their sensible approach to this subject... now, if only they'd switch to come up with an open and backwards compatibility fileformat for Live...

-Paws

kennerb · Post by **kennerb** » Wed Sep 13, 2006 10:20 pm

Angstrom wrote:I have never been so glad to see an Angelfire "no hotlinking" image !

No Worries it was just a link to one of my favorite bands from the 80's

forge · Post by **forge** » Wed Sep 13, 2006 11:54 pm

djadonis206 wrote:
john gordon wrote: they must like you more than they like me.
That's a fair assumption

maybe they just know what a big mouth adonis has!

forge · Post by **forge** » Wed Sep 13, 2006 11:58 pm

Angstrom wrote:I have never been so glad to see an Angelfire "no hotlinking" image !

franknputer · Post by **franknputer** » Thu Sep 14, 2006 12:31 am

DeadlyKungFu wrote:
franknputer wrote:
DeadlyKungFu wrote: I agree with your sentiment, but it's still a fact that licenses can no longer be transfered. This is a change in policy that wasn't announced.
Not really - if you read the last "official" post about this, a) it's in the current EULA, and b) they are trying to figure out a way to accomodate changing it, which is more than you can say for a LOT of software companies.
"Not really" what? It's in the current EULA that you can't sell it, this was not always the case. They are trying to change it, but it's setup so you can't sell it.

I suggest everyone lighten up a bit & see what develops. Be glad that they are listening, but let them decide how to best run their company, and live with it or don't. I really don't think they are plotting against their customers, but are just trying to keep their company afloat in a tough market.
Again, not really, it's part of the lock/unlock scheme, it's less about money and more about protecting their IP, which ultimately IS money. They are not just trying to get another $150 from me, they just don't want Operator copies to proliferate unnecessarily.

Regarding some of what I've read here: how would you feel in a year or two if Ableton closed up shop tomorrow?
...
So consider this - if Live is teh shizz in your musical life - would you want to be forced to change, simply because they couldn't make ends meet financially? If not, then supporting them is the best defense - and that includes your input on their public forum.
Wow. Do you see how often I post, how much I get involved in tech discussions with Live and helping newbies out? I've been a user and Live evanglelist since ver. 3. I bought the $80 sweatshirt and will buy more bling. I've been vocal about buying ver 6 and I've convinced a lot of people to purchase Live. Sorry to say this, but you're pretty new and probably shouldn't judge me like that. You're asking me if Live is the shizzle?? That's funny.

To many peoples' suprise there was a change in policy. Is it unfair? No, it's in the EULA and it's not all that common to resell software. We're simply suprised, there have been quite a few software resells on this very board, you'd know that if you'd been around before June. I'm bummed because I want the damn Operator, John wants the money to help him buy Sampler!!

I'm not real hip to a thread with a negative slant either. The fact of the matter is that once again the Abes have been direct in dealing with customers, they look good in this case. This is a big change, there's sales, marketing, the VPs, engineering, the board of directors (or whatever 'suits with attitudes' that have to approve such things), all have to agree on this policy change. Not to mention Live 6 is about to launch.

Not to be a dick, you're a nice guy with a polite writing style.

blah blah blah blah

Reading your post, I really don't understand why you're arguing with me. [EDIT - I guess starting off with 'Regarding some of what I've read here: wasn't clear enough of a break. Sorry 'bout that.] I wasn't casting Ableton (or you) in a bad light - just the opposite. You basically agree with pretty much everything I was trying to say, other than you don't think that the apparent change of EULA constitutes an annoucement. (Maybe not, but I'd wager that there's a clause in any of them that says they can change it any time, so it's not like they did anything more than being a little inconsiderate about it, if that.)[EDIT: Not that you don't already know this anyways...]

Most of my statement was directed at others who, during 7 pages (!) of this discussion, were bitching about Teh Evil Dollr-Grubbing Corp, without any regard to their position of just trying to do business & sell some cool software. Having been on both sides of that equation I've heard quite a bit, and was just trying to share some perspective. I was not trying to judge you, or anyone else.

anonymouse · Post by **anonymouse** » Thu Sep 14, 2006 1:04 am

john gordon wrote:they really do listen.......
Hello John,

Never mind. I can understand that our license policy can be slightly
confusing.

A little explanation:

A Live license consists of the first version you purchase and all
further version upgrades. As I explained yesterday and as it can also be
seen in our FAQ, a license may only be transferred as a whole. This way we
can secure that a Live serial number is upgraded only once.

Operator is also an upgrade and thus connected to a Live license, and
is not a separate license. But we can understand that regarding
transfers it should be allowed to be handled differently.

So we are going to change our license policy regarding Operator within
the next days. I cannot tell you exactly any details yet, since you
just called our attention to this issue.

We will let you know about our decision as soon as we made it.

Best regards,

Robert

So much more than you deserved having launched your shitty thread and attitude.
"what a crock of shit.they just lost a customer.assholes"

- I'd freeze out a customer from my company if they were being such a negative dickhead. Life is too short to be pleasant to people like you.