Free documentary, America freedom to fascism.

Tweaking Knobs · Post by **Tweaking Knobs** » Thu Nov 06, 2008 10:52 pm

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... 6580235299

Interesting

dj superflat · Post by **dj superflat** » Thu Nov 06, 2008 11:15 pm

so you're calling obama a fascist?

hacktheplanet · Post by **hacktheplanet** » Fri Nov 07, 2008 2:19 am

Oh, this video again?

The concept of income tax has been around since the year 10 in China. It's been a part of modern civilization for thousands of years. Taxes pay for things like roads, parks, public transportation, city beautification, recreational facilities, social programs, health care... You name it.

Then this video goes on to discuss conspiracy theories and mind control. Hahaha. I will pay $1,000 and give my Mac Book with the latest version of Live to the fist person who can provide unrequited proof that Americans live in a fascist nation and are under mind control. George Bush is certainly a douchebag, but he is no Mussolini. It's not as bad as you might think. We Americans have it pretty damn good.

However, I will agree that consumerism generally has a negative effect on society.

dubpixel · Post by **dubpixel** » Fri Nov 07, 2008 2:24 am

here's another take on fascism in the us:
http://www.linktv.org/programs/warning
(how shameless of me... they used my music as the sound track)

smutek · Post by **smutek** » Fri Nov 07, 2008 3:54 am

dubpixel wrote:(how shameless of me... they used my music as the sound track)

sweet! Good stuff man.

I love link, one of the few tv stations worth watching in my opinion, and the sole reason my wife and I continue to pay for direct tv (satellite television).

Going to watch this now, thanks for the link, and looking forward to hearing your sound track.

*edit - didn't realize it's just a preview, but I'll keep an eye for it on Link.

dubpixel · Post by **dubpixel** » Fri Nov 07, 2008 4:59 am

thanks, i know it was running from the 29th through the election on the 4th...
it is truly a great station.
they did a bit of slice and dice on their own to the music, but it's all good,
i plan on releasing it early next year.
it should be showing up on youtube here soon...
cheers

Tweaking Knobs · Post by **Tweaking Knobs** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 1:50 pm

dj superflat wrote:so you're calling obama a fascist?

are you stupid ?

glitchrock-buddha · Post by **glitchrock-buddha** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 4:17 pm

the_planet wrote: Then this video goes on to discuss conspiracy theories and mind control. Hahaha. I will pay $1,000 and give my Mac Book with the latest version of Live to the fist person who can provide unrequited proof that Americans live in a fascist nation and are under mind control. George Bush is certainly a douchebag, but he is no Mussolini.

Mussolini, a well known fascist, himself defined fascism as the unification of corporate and government. He said it could as well be called corporatism - Where private interests are embedded in the governance. This is in fact exactly what you have in the United States and indeed many other countries as well. The term fascism can have many definitions, but is often confused with simply a dictatorship or Nazism, which it need not be, but may also be. Fascism often exists in a republic, and can also mean a political system where a certain class has not the full rights of another class. By this you could also view the denial of marriage to gay people as a form of fascism or unequal access to health care as fascism. Of course these are more loosely fascist but it really depends on how you are defining it. I think Mussolini's definition is widely accepted and is in full effect in the United States. Even though people aren't being lined up to be executed or anything.

May I have your Macbook?

nathannn · Post by **nathannn** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 5:39 pm

here is one everyone will enjoy.
panning for gold.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2lPYg5U4P6s

thesmallisbeautiful · Post by **thesmallisbeautiful** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 6:28 pm

glitchrock-buddha wrote:
the_planet wrote: Then this video goes on to discuss conspiracy theories and mind control. Hahaha. I will pay $1,000 and give my Mac Book with the latest version of Live to the fist person who can provide unrequited proof that Americans live in a fascist nation and are under mind control. George Bush is certainly a douchebag, but he is no Mussolini.
Mussolini, a well known fascist, himself defined fascism as the unification of corporate and government. He said it could as well be called corporatism - Where private interests are embedded in the governance. This is in fact exactly what you have in the United States and indeed many other countries as well. The term fascism can have many definitions, but is often confused with simply a dictatorship or Nazism, which it need not be, but may also be. Fascism often exists in a republic, and can also mean a political system where a certain class has not the full rights of another class. By this you could also view the denial of marriage to gay people as a form of fascism or unequal access to health care as fascism. Of course these are more loosely fascist but it really depends on how you are defining it. I think Mussolini's definition is widely accepted and is in full effect in the United States. Even though people aren't being lined up to be executed or anything.

May I have your Macbook?

There is a lot more to fascism than a "unification of corporate and government". That is a definition that allows fascism to include communism (the corporate is controlled by the goverment) or libertarianism (most of the jobs of government can be more effectively handled by the corporate) or Reaganite conservatism (it is the job of the government to create a healthy corporate environment, which will lead to greater general prosperity) or any one of a million other -isms.

When Mussolini spoke about corporatism, he didn't mean like a private corporation (say, coca cola). Corporatism, the term means a group or cartel set up to regulate and control a specific enterprise. The steel corporation, for example, would not be a privately held steel company, but a conglomerate of the various steel interests who all together form the steel policy (such as how steel prices would be set). This is completely contrary to the path that the USA has been on for my whole lifetime at least, which is a complete reliance on the power of free-market capitalism. Corporatism is more than just corporations having power. The USA does not have anything resembling a corporatist agenda or goverment.

Likewise, the denial of rights to certain groups is not fascism either. All political systems deny rights to one or another group. We deny children the right to vote, and we deny pedophiles the right to sleep with those children. Neither case suggests that we are a fascist state. There simply doesn't exist a perfect system whereby everyone has exactly equal rights because everyone is different. I am against denying gays the right to marry or denying poor people access to healthcare, but I hardly think that either implies fascism.

I think the main problem is that sometime in the 60's the Frankfurt school of philosophy came up with the great idea of labeling all of your political enemies as "fascists" in order to immediately undermine them. It's easy to do because fascism isn't so easy to define. Italian fascism is but one type, and it's hardly what you'd call a well thought out system. It's like comparing someone to Hitler. If you can call Saddam Hussein a "middle eastern version of Hitler" you can justify doing anything you want. You don't have to show how he's like Hitler, you just say it. The fact that he was nothing like Hitler in any of his actions didn't make him a good guy, and the fact that the USA is not a fascist state doesn't mean that it's run properly, or even that it's a decent place. It's just better not to use those terms so loosely.

I guess I should watch this movie, but I doubt I will.

glitchrock-buddha · Post by **glitchrock-buddha** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 6:40 pm

But I think the point that many people make about the fine line of fascism is when private interests gain too much control of government, then that is a path towards a fascist regime, whether or not the political party declares itself as such (Since parties would never declare themselves as adhering to a fascist ideology). And I agree that it's much more complex than that, and I don't think anyone would claim that the US is a fascist state, only that elements of fascism already exist and many of course believe that there are powerful groups who are doing everything possible to increase this fascist element. Whether or not that will actually happen, of course depends on how much resistance it is met with.

glitchrock-buddha · Post by **glitchrock-buddha** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 6:48 pm

thesmallisbeautiful wrote:
This is completely contrary to the path that the USA has been on for my whole lifetime at least, which is a complete reliance on the power of free-market capitalism. ...

The USA does not have anything resembling a corporatist agenda or goverment.

I have to say I disagree with both of these statements. The USA is not so free-market capitalism. Can you really say that after the recent "Bailouts" which largely went to bonus's for business-men and executives? Besides this the government has their hands in all sorts of business affairs and always has.

No corporatist agenda? I don't know, seems to me like the majority of the USA's foreign policy is about corporate profits and not a whole lot else.