Sub Kick Trick w/ the Ableton Filter Delay...

kaffein · Post by **kaffein** » Sun Dec 07, 2008 2:08 pm

I was looking for an easier and quicker way to achieve the 50Hz sub kick trick in Ableton Live, rather than have to duplicate a kick track, filter out the frequencies and delay the whole track...

I have come up with a solution with the Filter Delay.

I will assume everyone knows what the sub kick trick is and when it is necessary to use it, so with out further ado I will just present this trick as a handy little screenshot.

Filter Delay Settings:

L+R ON
Filter ON
Filter Freq @ 50Hz
Q @ .50
Delay set to Time @ 20ms (This is the 50hz wavelength)
No Feedback
Pan to the center
Leave dry volume @ 0dB
Adjust delay volume to taste, but use 0dB as a starting point and go from there.

If this has already been discovered, oh well! I searched.
Either way, enjoy!

Superchibisan · Post by **Superchibisan** » Sun Dec 07, 2008 5:10 pm

sounds like fun

Night Spirit · Post by **Night Spirit** » Sun Dec 07, 2008 5:12 pm

Good idea. Ill give it a go and see how it sounds!

kinkajou · Post by **kinkajou** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 3:28 pm

kaffein wrote:I will assume everyone knows what the sub kick trick is and when it is necessary to use it, so with out further ado I will just present this trick as a handy little screenshot.

...link please?

Meef Chaloin · Post by **Meef Chaloin** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 3:30 pm

i presume he is talking about using a 50hz sine wave and gating so it opens when the kick plays.

Marcus_Hertz · Post by **Marcus_Hertz** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 9:34 pm

kinkajou wrote:
kaffein wrote:I will assume everyone knows what the sub kick trick is and when it is necessary to use it, so with out further ado I will just present this trick as a handy little screenshot.

...link please?

me too!

kaffein · Post by **kaffein** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 12:52 am

It stems from an old recording engineer trick where they used a speaker to pick up more low end frequencies and this was combined with the regular kick microphones. It was then EQd/filtered to give the frequencies they wanted, and then time delayed to hit like a subliminal second hit of the drum.

Basically you use this to boost 50Hz, 20ms after the initial impulse. Since it is 20ms after the kick and the it just consists of mainly 50Hz and below material, this will have the least amount of interference with the original kicks attack/punch and won't sound like 2 kicks hitting.

That's a basic low down. I hope this makes sense...

Mainly for use with samples or kick drum recordings that need more oomph.
Some people prefer to use sine waves instead for even longer sustaining notes and for a more synthetic sound.

kaffein · Post by **kaffein** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 1:01 am

Meef Chaloin wrote:i presume he is talking about using a 50hz sine wave and gating so it opens when the kick plays.

That's another technique, both similar in what they achieve though.

Pitch Black · Post by **Pitch Black** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 2:27 am

Nice trick! Thanks!

I've been using a high-pass filter in the past to achieve a similar result, but it doesn't have the phase advantage of your method... cheers man!

CrypticChig · Post by **CrypticChig** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 5:05 pm

I have been doing a similar trick with 2 other plug-ins. Mda-Subsynth (free)and CamelPhat(not-free). although i only have one stereo mix of the drums. it was miked with 7 different microphones but ran thru a mixer and then stereo output to a computers line-in. And this trick(once figured out more) works for making the kick(and some of the snare) to sound monsterous. Without ruining the rest of the drums.

I could go into more detail once i set it up again and maybe take some screen shots of the two plug-ins.

Night Spirit · Post by **Night Spirit** » Wed Dec 10, 2008 5:07 pm

Cryptic, Id be interested to see what you have going on in CamelPhat, so if you could elaborate that would be great. After trying the filterdelay and autofilter sub kick tricks I think im liking the autofilter option better. I like being able to see a sharper Q value, and you can turn up the lfo amount to get the sub kick coming in and out during a breakdown and the turn it off when you want the beat to hit hard again. The filter delay sound really good too but much more subtle. Great ideas all around guys. Thanks!

CrypticChig · Post by **CrypticChig** » Wed Dec 10, 2008 6:47 pm

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=ZDF3OARK

i'm fairly new to this forum so bare with me I don't know how to insert photos. So i uploaded a RAR file(i use winrar to extract them) to megaupload with the following :

1. dry drums mp3 (real drums)
2. wet drums mp3 (with the subsynth and camel phat effects on them)
3. camel phat settings bmp
4. subsynth settings bmp

all in all its only bout a 551kb download.

what i have been doing is using compression after the subsynth/camelphat phase of effects and some eq. sometimes a multi-band compressor.

hope this helps.

Night Spirit · Post by **Night Spirit** » Wed Dec 10, 2008 10:19 pm

Nice package you put together there cyptic. Thanks!

Meef Chaloin · Post by **Meef Chaloin** » Thu Dec 11, 2008 10:18 am

thanks for this tip kaffein, works a treat!

djgroovy · Post by **djgroovy** » Thu Dec 11, 2008 2:50 pm

Nice tricks, quicker and easier than layering a sine wave, thanks.

Sub Kick Trick w/ the Ableton Filter Delay...

Sub Kick Trick w/ the Ableton Filter Delay...

Re: Sub Kick Trick w/ the Ableton Filter Delay...

Re: Sub Kick Trick w/ the Ableton Filter Delay...