Ableton is loyal to its customers

zakary · Post by **zakary** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 11:36 am

Regardless of my complaints / struggle from time to time, i think ableton is very loyal to its customers. Especially when compared to other music app software companies which either do not offer good support / bug fixing or even an upgrade path to new versions, with recent announcements i can see that some of my tools are either discontinued or not supported.

Live has had a really good upgrade path, giving you the option to purchase new functionality by ugrading or by buying the extra features, bells & whistles.

Now i might not be getting what i exactly had in mind (everyone will probably say the same .... yes automation into session clips) but after seeing info of Live 8, i can say that every single new feature will be appreciated, for example the feature to preview your sample library with the option to play at normal sample speed and scrub through it might provve to be one very valuable feature for everyone ...... There is of course room for improvement.

just my thoughts

mlangsman · Post by **mlangsman** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 11:41 am

Im not sure theres that much loyality in it really - they just sell what customers want ... which is just plain sales at the end of the day. They obviously have a great product and are very enthusiastic about it which cant be said for all companies that's for sure.

I would think them more loyal if any of their upgrade offers were open to those not upgrading from lite(like the operator one and the pre-xmas one).

peace,
Marc

zakary · Post by **zakary** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 11:44 am

mlangsman wrote:Im not sure theres that much loyality in it really - they just sell what customers want ... which is just plain sales at the end of the day. They obviously have a great product and are very enthusiastic about it which cant be said for all companies that's for sure.

I would think them more loyal if any of their upgrade offers were open to those not upgrading from lite(like the operator one and the pre-xmas one).

peace,
Marc

yes of course, pricing policy is what leaves you with a good or bad taste but as far as functionality is concerned, i think things are good.

mlangsman · Post by **mlangsman** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 11:56 am

I think not including a single synth in the main live package is a bit rough - especially given what other DAWs offer. The instrument prices arent very competitivle either - they are the same price as say a native instruments synth that can be used stand alone or in any application.

Marc

chrysalis33rpm · Post by **chrysalis33rpm** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 1:13 pm

The Abes have obviously listened to their customers and done their darndest to both add in much requested features and to innovate beyond ways that most of us were imagining.

I am so tired of the pricing debates- if you want the instruments, Live Suite is a good deal, buying them individually isn't. End of story. But the core functionality of the software is what we should judge, and they have rocked it this time around.

leedsquietman · Post by **leedsquietman** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 1:49 pm

I think Ableton are loyal and have built up a mostly great relationship with their users

a) they allow public beta testing - unlike Apple Logic, Steinberg Cubase et al.

b) they send out a newsletter that updates you regularly with what's going on.

c) they sent out questionnaires requesting which features customers wanted last year and they actually implemented the most requested ones.

d) they are pretty humble and gracious when you deal with them. They admit to mistakes such as rush releasing Live 7 and not expecting the response and being overwhelmed, having the printer break down that prints the manuals etc and even lost some orders - they said sorry and gave us vouchers, free live packs etc.

Seems pretty loyal to me and a model many others should consider ...

doc holiday · Post by **doc holiday** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 2:23 pm

i'm happy to give them my money every year

pulsoc · Post by **pulsoc** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 2:32 pm

Lower the price for the full-version and raise the price for the upgrade.

Very loyal.

decrepitude · Post by **decrepitude** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 2:33 pm

Ableton Live the program, the company and the innovative minds behind it, have my utmost respect!

It has revolutionized the way people perform (and record) music - and it certainly isn't limited to electronic.

I too have had my rants here and while it's due to my very high expectations, I want all the Abletons to know that the product(s) they produce are dear to my heart. I totally appreciate their efforts and only wish them the best for the future.

zakary · Post by **zakary** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 2:42 pm

In my initial post & thoughts i was referring to functionality.
As far as pricing is concerned i probably won't be very happy paying for Live 8 upgrade, cause i paid 469eu for live 6 + 200eu to upgrade to Live 8 = 669 eu.

morerecords · Post by **morerecords** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 3:12 pm

I agree with the oringal post. In the 90s, Steinberg was very good to me, but then I amde the mistake of switching to Logic and Apple 4-5 years ago. Thinking about how unpleasant my experience was dealing with Apple computers not on ly an issue with logic but then with my computer, and how lousy their service was, I switched to Ableton and have never looked back. These guys have been very good to me, most of my feature requestsd were met with the announcement of Live 8, and I couldn't be happier with these guys.
I also love dealing with:
D16
PSP
U-he
and Magnus of soniccharge
Spectrasonics
sweetwater (for purchases)

These are all great guys/.

UNPLEASANT EXPERIENCE: Apple, Guitar Center, and IK multimedia

leedsquietman · Post by **leedsquietman** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 3:20 pm

The upgrades are worth it IMHO.

Steinberg charge more for their upgrades for Cubase.

Of course, if you don't want to pay, you don't have to upgrade ....

Other great companies I've dealt with
Voxengo
Celemony Melodyne
Crysonic
Sonalksis
RND (formerly Elemental Audio - of late excellent, at first they were not so good)
Echo Audio
Arturia

sunaivod · Post by **sunaivod** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 3:36 pm

I emailed up an order yesterday (paypal), begging to give my money to them

But I'm still getting nothing. So I still got to figure out how loyal they are.
Or do I need more patient?

Or are the abes busy with groupies some were?

mazmith · Post by **mazmith** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 3:55 pm

suite 8 juxtaposing the apc40 is going to be a glorious day in my household. just wish it wasn't going to be so expensive to update

they make it so by the time i can afford 8, live 9 will come out a week later. Maz.

Acidfever · Post by **Acidfever** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 10:37 pm

Hmmmm define loyal. Live is a great product but the update pricing seems to become steeper with every release.

Also if you compare the price for Ableton Suite and compare this to Cubase 4(5) and Logic Studio you can only conclude that pricing is a bit steep compared to the featureset and included goodies.

Why does Ableton put themselves at the most expensive side of the market?

On top of this it seems that the coolest new feature in Live 8 (Max for live) will be yet another payed upgrade.

I will absolutely buy Live 8, nice new features....but the term "loyal" doesn't seem suitable. I think Ableton delivers exactly that what customers might expect for the price they pay. All major products have introduces quite substantial new features in non major upgrades, i don't remember this happening with ableton(might be wrong here but we even had to pay to get rid of the horrible audio engine we had to deal with in Live v5 & 6. Let's be honest...this was THE major feature in Live 7).

i'd say that customers are loyal to ableton, and that ableton exactly (but only just) delivers what to be expected at pretty steep prices. We've not seen long time customer discounts or any special deals (besides some sample pack) for long time customers.

Don't get me wrong though...i love Ableton live....but we've had to wait something like 3 major versions to get some upgrades to something as trivial as the midi editor for instance.

So let's just keep everything in perspective. I've been using live since i upgrade from live lite to v4 full and at this point i spend something like 600-650 euro (780 - 850 USD) to get where we are today. And now the next upgrade is 50% more expensive than the last one without even having the best new feature anounced in it. That's another 149 euro (195USD) and god knows what they will charge for mac for live later on (but i expect that to be in the 100+ area).

I would really like to see some proof of loyalty with some customer discounts.

No comments on support though, ableton has always been great in that departmen (while other companies went from great to mediocre (Native Instruments i.e.).

I will probably turn the whole Ableton fan community against me with a post like this but i felt this had to be said anyways.