BAN ANIMAL EXPERIMENTS IN EU - VOTE NOW !

[Emissary]

You are one seriously deluded mofo. just thought i'd let you know. This is the problem with scientists, the belief they are evolving evolution themselves. They think they know better than billions of years of natural evolution.

There is no right or wrong way to evolve - only success and failure. Do you think there is an underlying consciousness running throughout the natural world shaping evolution

do you believe there isnt?

[optimistic]

Choo Choo -> BANG <- Choo Choo


Another trainwreck thread..... WOW

This thread delivers

[Salty P]

do you believe there isnt?

If you take a snapshot of an eco system (or watch Planet Earth when you're stoned), it's easy to think that all of these species are having one big love fest and living in perfect harmony. But over thousands of years many species would have perished to get to this state. Success or failure is determind by a species ability to adapt to changes in their environment, not by some mystical force.

If however you assume that there is a underlying consciousness, why would this process that allows countless species to go extinct in order for a select few to survive, have a superior moral standing than humanity using animals to further the needs of its own species?

[LoopStationZebra]

I like paste.

fxd.

[Emissary]

I like paste.

fxd.

paste?

[LoopStationZebra]

I'm right with you, Android, but you do get seriously pissed. I'm not sure if that really helps your position. I'm not judging, mind you. Just find it interesting.

What's your own ethical journey on this issue? How did you feel about it when you were getting your undergrad vs how you felt before school? You don't have to answer, of course, but I don't personally know anyone in the field and am curious.

I was a lot more "hippie" before I started. I even got into it because of my kooky spiritual nonsense beliefs. My parents told me to get to a real university or I would be kicked out, so I did it and joined the Environmental and Occupational health program. However, I believe the universe (or god or whatever) directs us to the best path in our lives via feelings of excitement and joy. I was in my class for about 10 minutes when I realized I couldnt give a shit, got up and and left and dropped all my classes. I was looking through the other bio majors and saw the classes for biotech and thought that one sounded the coolest because it involved a lot of chemistry, physics, and fun sounding courses like DNA recombinant techniques and neural biology. Good lord did I get an education. Ever since then I've been fascinated with it, we are HACKING LIFE. We are taking the creation and functioning of organisms and biochemistry into our own hands, and it is leading us into the dawn of a new era where the actual process of evolution has evolved itself to a new level where organisms intelligently alter and create new forms of biological processes. Biology is like any other form of technology, only it is far more advanced. To be able to harness it for our own purposes is going to lead to an explosion of new ways of doing things, like reverse engineering advanced alien tech. the things we are learning and doing these days is absolutely mind blowing and it saddens me that the general population has no clue what is going on and what's actually involved.

For instance, if I told you that we actually use lentiviruses like HIV routinely in the lab, you'd probably freak the fuck out. But you wouldn't understand how we are using the virus code to inject our own custom DNA into the DNA of another organism after removing the parts of the virus RNA that code for other viruses. There isnt any danger because the vector doesnt have the ability to replicate itself, but if the public got word that we use HIV to genetically modify animals that could later be used in agriculture they would throw a shit fit. I probably would have too, but I've been learning this and doing this after years of hard work to gain an understanding of how it actually works and now I'm excited to use it. Unfortunately, science is under attack from all directions and most of it is coming from people who dont know SHIT. That's the problem, in order to know shit, you have to put in a lot of time and effort to learn a LOT of stuff to get a fundamental grasp of how all this stuff fits together. I get upset that people have the unmitigated gall to throw baseless accusations and spout nonsense like "animal research never solved anything" when they dont know anything about what they are talking about and refuse to put in the same amount of effort to learn it that the scientists did. Its insulting to the amazing things brilliant people have accomplished through scientific research.

I see a lot of issue dodging in this thread. I say if you are against animal research, go back to school and learn everything there is to know about biology and biochemistry and biotechnology and animal research and all that so you have a grasp of the subject and are therefore in a position to find some sort of alternative. Otherwise its just a bunch of horseshit based upon worthless opinions grounded in a lack of knowledge of the subject at hand.

Awesome. Exciting work. Sounds like you've had an interesting journey.

I love science. I love *cough*mad*cough* scientists. After 8 years of a total anti-science administration here in the States, I can only hope that we're once again embracing mankind's two most important goals:

1. Warp Drive
2. ReAnimation

[LoopStationZebra]

I like paste.

fxd.

paste?

[Minimal Justice System]

I can only hope that we're once again embracing mankind's two most important goals:

1. Warp Drive
2. ReAnimation

I'd vote for teleportation first and I would be all for animal testing in conjunction with human testing to get some radical Brundlefly style genetic mutations!!

[Emissary]

Beautiful, i love it when simple minds make themselves laugh. Truly a special moment xxx

[LoopStationZebra]

I can only hope that we're once again embracing mankind's two most important goals:

1. Warp Drive
2. ReAnimation

I'd vote for teleportation first and I would be all for animal testing in conjunction with human testing to get some radical Brundlefly style genetic mutations!!

Indeed. It's like killing 3 issue birds with one stone.
1. You've harmed an animal.
2. You've tested on a human.
3. You've fucked with the discovery of inner space and art and history and Mother Nature and all the other crap Emissary has been prattling on about.

[Aequitas123]

will you guys shut up i'm trying to mix here!

[b0unce]

every hippie i have ever talked to has been utterly charming and insightful. Art is the discovery of inner space and the knowing of oneself. Scientists on the other hand are self deluded arse holes with no perception of life, history or themselves. They are the dullards of the universe. I rely on the millions of years of history and art to work out what is coming in the future. Science in itself is not evil, its just most that follow its path are the pinnacle of self deluded mediocrity. They have egos big enough to believe they are helping humanity where in actual fact they are bringing about its end. Now let me get back to my joss sticks and hemp soup loony tits.

'pinnacle of self deluded mediocrity' ....lol, wtf is that supposed to mean ?

Leonardo Da Vinci, was a scientist. For example he stole the dead to study anatomy. He cut them open, and probed around at their insides, and took note of what was there. He was also a fine artist. Go figure.

What about all those 'artists' who work in advertising ? huh ? foisting those earth-killing products on the masses who don't need or want them ?

You're being one of those archetypical dickwads who rails against EVERYTHING. you amount to little more than a red herring.

[Salty P]

every hippie i have ever talked to has been utterly charming and insightful

Have you ever been to a psy-trance rave?

[Emissary]

every hippie i have ever talked to has been utterly charming and insightful. Art is the discovery of inner space and the knowing of oneself. Scientists on the other hand are self deluded arse holes with no perception of life, history or themselves. They are the dullards of the universe. I rely on the millions of years of history and art to work out what is coming in the future. Science in itself is not evil, its just most that follow its path are the pinnacle of self deluded mediocrity. They have egos big enough to believe they are helping humanity where in actual fact they are bringing about its end. Now let me get back to my joss sticks and hemp soup loony tits.

'pinnacle of self deluded mediocrity' ....lol, wtf is that supposed to mean ?

Leonardo Da Vinci, was a scientist. For example he stole the dead to study anatomy. He cut them open, and probed around at their insides, and took note of what was there. He was also a fine artist. Go figure.

What about all those 'artists' who work in advertising ? huh ? foisting those earth-killing products on the masses who don't need or want them ?

You're being one of those archetypical dickwads who rails against EVERYTHING. you amount to little more than a red herring.

I cant believe you wasted 30 seconds of your life replying to this dickwad, its clear he is just trying to wind everyone up as usual, just ignore him.

[Emissary]

every hippie i have ever talked to has been utterly charming and insightful

Have you ever been to a psy-trance rave?

they are not hippies they are posers moonlighting as hippies. I'm talking big bearded naked blokes who live in the forests and drink recycled urine. Those guys are fucking awesome