Korg Zero 8

[Mike Goodwin]

I had the zero4 for a couple of days and that was enough to know that it was not stable enough to keep. On the last day I had it it did not BOOT UP correctly 8[ Do some reading of reviews and you will hear others complaints.
Others must have different experiences as they show up from time to time. The EQ's on it do not sound that great and the build quality is find. In the end I kept my Mackie D4. It is not a good midi controller but it is stable and built very well. Oh and it sounds good. That is important after all.

[Homebelly]

Behold!


I see.....dear God....can it be?? 12 faders! Count em' . And just an irresponsible amount of assignable knobs and buttons.

Sure it's not 72 virgins, but....

Ahh,, yes,, but.
Its still only four pairs of audio in...

But any how,,
its all same ol' same ol'.

[beats me]

Behold!


I see.....dear God....can it be?? 12 faders! Count em' . And just an irresponsible amount of assignable knobs and buttons.

Sure it's not 72 virgins, but....

Ahh,, yes,, but.
Its still only four pairs of audio in...

But any how,,
its all same ol' same ol'.

Well the OP was asking about MIDI controllers and I think 4 pairs of inputs would be more than enough and I think it would be enough for most bedroom producers and performers.

For me every single controller available has a deal breaker or shortcoming on it but the xone comes the closest. My biggest issues are it's expensive and it's not exactly something you can throw in a backpack and hit the street.

[Homebelly]

Behold!


I see.....dear God....can it be?? 12 faders! Count em' . And just an irresponsible amount of assignable knobs and buttons.

Sure it's not 72 virgins, but....

Ahh,, yes,, but.
Its still only four pairs of audio in...

But any how,,
its all same ol' same ol'.

Well the OP was asking about MIDI controllers and I think 4 pairs of inputs would be more than enough and I think it would be enough for most bedroom producers and performers.

For me every single controller available has a deal breaker or shortcoming on it but the xone comes the closest. My biggest issues are it's expensive and it's not exactly something you can throw in a backpack and hit the street.

True dat!!

Now,,
where are my 72 virgins???

[BongoBennie]

I owned one for a minute, as a midi controller its great, audio is rubbish for the price, I switched to the Mackie D4, Im looking at re-purchasing one since the price has fallen from 1800 (what i paid less than a year ago) to @1000 new from PSSL, waiting to see the Vestax to decide

[six_o_clock_crow]

I spent last evening searching around on other forums, and I am less than convinced about the Zero 8. Obviously it works for some people, and that's great, but there are enough bad reports about it to put me off.

I am warming to the Xone - thank you Beats for convincing me to have another look . Will have to do some research - looks like a new version is out/coming out, the 4D? Which may mean I could pick up a 3D more cheaply.

One thing I'm not clear on - does the audio come from the laptop into the Xone? Does the Xone act as a soundcard, with the four audio channels on the Xone available as seperate outputs in Live? Also, I am guessing you could expand the set up by using additional 1D controllers alongside a 3D?

I love the look of the VCM, but I am reluctant about putting that much money into a purely MIDI controller.

[thoffir]

I spent last evening searching around on other forums, and I am less than convinced about the Zero 8

i am a zero4 user and it rocks. you can simulate 4 decks with live. you can feed all that audio with one firewire cable to the mixer, use its per channel eq and effects, sampler and master effects, add some favourite live/vst ones via midi (the same firewire cable) if you still want more, route back any side of fader (or sampler, or particular track) back into live, looooop it, chop it with dummy clips and send on the other side of fader or channel etc. and record your whole set via master back into ableton. setup is very minimalistic (just two cables):

Code: Select all

laptop ----- (one firewire cable with audio and midi in/outi) ---- zero4 ----- analog/digital master out

requires no drivers on mac, audio and midi works in real plug-n-play style. and of course if you are not into djing you can change it into big midi controller only and do everything inside ableton. i'm using 1.60 firmware and have no problems described on ableton and korg forums.

the only flaw i found is little audio drop if you changing audio to audio/midi and back. but that is not a big issue. for example if you want more than 4 knob midi control on channel 3 you can map it using 8 midi knobs and few midi buttons from track 4 - that is even beter as you can still use native zero eq/effects on channel 3.
or you can have normal setup and switch it rhytmically to the beat

that is absolutely best value:price device wchich includes:
- 8 firewire in / 16 firewire out soundcard (put any stereo signal on any channel, take audio signal via firewire from any bus: pre-eq/effect, post-eq/effect etc, fader side, sampler, master)
- customizable midi surface
- midi interface (in/out on separate channel)
- 4 channel analog mixer (with 4 phono and practically all types of analog ins and outs)
- sampler
- effect boxes

try to sum up all those devices and compare zero4/zero8 price. and try to draw cables routing setup (only two with zero!). there are some midi enabled mixers but you loosing normal mixer controls as a cost of midi control. there are some usb/fw audio mixers but you can use it in most cases as "one computer line in" or "save your master out" options. there is no real alternative besides xone, but...

xone 3d looks impresive and is fun but its biggest flaw is that it can use only 4 stereo signals (lin/3out or 2in/2out). so it is two "ableton decks" only with its built-in eq and no fancy back and forth routing possibilities (that is propably why platstikman uses xone 92 and two 1Ds - he spins on 4 - that require addional multi port audio card). 3D is much better for traktor in my opinion. if you are doing mix out of ableton you don't need so much midi controllers as well as 3d offers. as eq/pan and effects and it's parameters are done by mixer (and whole cueing) you are saving about 8 knobs and few buttons - you just need few for clip scrub / loop size and position and on-off / clip select / ableton effects.

i was considering xone 2d as alternative, with a different logic: "whole mixing in will be done in ableton" (eq/effects/crosfading) but in my opinion it intentionally lacks 3rd row of normal knobs under rotary encoders for prefect 3eq midi controlled equalising forcing you to buy a analog mixer. that is xone evil marketer's intentional job. and ergonomy is not as great as on zero (you probably have to work with midi layers).

[six_o_clock_crow]

Wow! Thank you so much for the info Thoffir.

To be fair, I did a lot of reading last night and there were a lot less complaints from Zero 4 users than Zero 8 users. In fact, there were a number of posts on various forums where Zero 8 users were complaining and Zero 4 users would chip in and say "well, I'm using a 4 and have had no troubles."

So, maybe I need to check out the Zero 4 as an option too.

I have looked at the specs for the new Xone 4D and the audio interface is much better than the 3D. Looks like all four channels would be available as seperate outputs in Live.

Also, I know some people hate USB, but I have no Firewire on my laptop. The Zero's are FW, the Xone is USB2. I could add a firewire express card to my laptop, of course, but it's another consideration I need to take into account.

Thanks for all the help so far, guys - but please keep pitching in if anyone has any more views on this. I have a while to think about it as I'll be saving over the next year for whatever I end up buying. So who knows what gear will be out by then! So, the options I am looking at are:

Lemur
Vestax VCM600
Korg Zero 4 or 8
A&H Xone 4D or second hand/reduced 3D

I am leaning towards the 3D/4D and away from the Lemur or Vestax - as I said before, if I am paying a serious chunk of cash I think I want more than just a MIDI controller. Also, the A&H or Korg options allow for integrating other gear into a live set should I want to later. I've certainly always fancied a Machinedrum

[Patch]

thoffir...

You just made me dribble all over my keyboard. The zero4 would be perfect for me if it JUST had 5 freely assignable buttons for mouseless navigation...

Anyone know if anyone has DARED to mod a zero4 to include freely assignable buttons?

[thoffir]

I have one, but almost right after i bought it live 7's midi sync went to hell and so i didn't work with it a whole lot.

i'm just manually setting temo on korg into the value in ableton. never had any problems with such simple manual setup with sampler and effects sync.

i also tried syncing both ways, zero to ableton and ableton to zero and it worked, but i never use it for longer time, so i can't confirm if there are any drifts.

[beats me]

Old video but here's the sweetheart of beatport messing with the xone 3d.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XjRKLHUqYAE

Maybe with Obama in office I can afford one.

[thoffir]

You just made me dribble all over my keyboard. The zero4 would be perfect for me if it JUST had 5 freely assignable buttons for mouseless navigation...

you can make it all green (all channel buttons, faders and knobs are only midi) and recreate all mixer/cue/faders/effects/sampler in ableton (i even have such mini-zero4 emulation done in ableton while i'm using my always-in-backpack-solution x-session pro which is only midi controller: basic eq, filter, delay, clip selection, livecut control, sampling+beat chopping). question is what for?

i was looking mainly for the classic djing tool which can adopt modern sources (ableton tracks as separate channnels) and classic ones (turntable, external synth). i was also looking for almost unlimited midi control surface with real knobs. and i needed at least 3 ch. audio (A, B, headphone cue) and midi interface. and finally i needed to do my live actions without touching the computer (no mouse, no keyboard). and one device fits my needs, and i automaticaly HAVE to use MORE THAN FIVE midi knobs even if i'm using +/- 20 nonmidi knobs and 4 faders now, huh? c'mon!

i will repeat: *FOR ME* few midi knobs is enough while i'm using zero4+ableton at this stage of my learning curve (i started my djing last month, never done that before). the others may need more... i'm using and i'm recommending that to all dj beginners using live:
- three buttons: left / right / loop on-off switch (requires midi2keyboard app for right/left cursor move)
- knob1: scene select
- knob2: clip scrub (works also as "start that clip")
- knob3: loop position
- knob4: livecut wet/dry/type of cutting
the rest of the tasks are done oldskool way like in analog mixer.

as i'm beginner that setup plus 8 effects per channel, built in sampler, my own resampling mechanisms in live and 10 master effects is more than enough, belive me. for zero4 my ableton live is just deck simulation with some unique effects and unique scrub and quite unique "make a loop anywhere forward, keep it, bring back song into previous position" features.

my skills may grow soon and i'm sure i will not be limited with zero4. and i may use more midi knobs in future which should make you more happy. i never tried zero in full midi setup to control ableton liveact style yet. for that i prefer my micro modular (finally got it synced with external midi clock) with only 3 knobs (lol), kp3 and no computer at all. beardyman style but with different instrument.

[Patch]

Sounds like you've got a sweet DJ set-up, there. But I'm assuming that all your clips are pre-loaded into session view. I like to be able to open the browser and drop clips into session view through out my set.

That's why I need 5 freely assignable buttons (I'll use 'em with Bomes to navigate Mouselessly - Mouselessly? New word, right there!)

[thoffir]

So, maybe I need to check out the Zero 4 as an option too.

if you plan straight djing four "decks" may be enough for you. but if you want multitrack messing in live that may be not enough. indeed there is more negative comments on 8 than on 4. i also see that your budget is practically unlimited (xone 4d and lemur are on high end side). get 4d and you will probably have all i described plus more knobs plus bigger respect minus per channel master/effects minus sampler.
i will not buy lemur before trying it, and that's just midi controller... you should also took into account how YOUR PERFORMING looks like on those devices. if you plan public use of course:)

[thoffir]

Sounds like you've got a sweet DJ set-up, there. But I'm assuming that all your clips are pre-loaded into session view. I like to be able to open the browser and drop clips into session view through out my set.

yep. all clips are preloaded. if you looking for different philosophy use serato itch. if you still want it in ableton live use api. as i see there are people on forum which achieved your goal. unless you are using LE version i can't see problem why you can't preload everything you plan to use.