Ableton Forum

delicioso wrote:

exper wrote:Just wait until they try and "mix" by pushing a grid of buttons. I bet automation of track volume in 8 steps will sound just great!

Surprising this type of argument still keeps popping up. The point of the Launchpad is for those who already have controllers that have knobs. A Nocturn or nanoKontrol can do a lot more than the APC40 without cumbersome hacks as far as what you can do with knobs. And together with launchpad, the combination is still more portable, cheaper, and doesn't require an additional power adapter.

The only people I see getting worked up over the Launchpad in this forum are those who already invested in the APC40 and thus need to justify their purchase. Just be satisfied with what you have if it works for you. And no, not everyone wants to buy both or have room for both. It's not about collecting controllers. It's using what works for you. It's great that there are lots of options now. Novation was smart in realizing that people would want to mix and match between the different choices of controllers for a more modular approach to customizing their setup. I'm not knocking the APC40 though I never wanted one because it's too bulky for my taste. But I'm sure it's great for some people, especially newbies who might not want to deal with more than one controller.

It wasn't an argument. I think the launchpad is great for those who already have some other type of controller. And, as for a nocturn or nanokontrol being capable of being as in depth as an apc, can you simultaneously control 8 tracks of pan, volume, mute, solo and edit an effect without changing pages/scenes with a nanokontrol? Probably not. I'm with you on the power adapter issue however.

Nothing about the apc has been cumbersome by any means. I am most defintely satisfied with the apc barring not having full on lcd screens with text, but that would be a much more expensive beast. And, as for your last sentence, check my signature, I hardly think I'm a newbie who can only deal with one controller...
As I've said elsewhere, I still even like the launchpad. I may even buy one to be a monome emulator, sequencer interface for m4l or even keep the apc home and travel with a launchpad.
Plus, this is hardly about saving space. For instance with the nocturn/launchpad combo, nobody's gaining any precious, usable space. The apc is aprox. 17x13 while the lp is 9.5x9.5 and the nocturn is 6x9.5. so combined, not including space for usb cables is 16x10 or 20x10 depending on side by side or one on top of the other. Here's a pic showing the scale, again not compensating for the novation's sideways usb ports which I believe are on opposite sides, so add an inch to both the left and the right.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3524/402 ... 79c0_o.png

exper wrote:And, as for a nocturn or nanokontrol being capable of being as in depth as an apc, can you simultaneously control 8 tracks of pan, volume, mute, solo and edit an effect without changing pages/scenes with a nanokontrol? Probably not.

I've used the APC40. I can do more with Nocturn and nanoKontrol with their respective remote midi scripts found in this forum than the APC and they allow for further customization easily. I can move between the 4 scenes of my nanoKontrol or the 4 group buttons of my Nocturn quickly and it doesn't slow my workflow at all. Besides I'd rather have the encoders on my Nocturn for volume controls rather than non-motorized faders. Also, I can control 16 tracks on my nanoKontrol very quickly for triggering/stopping clips, arming, panning, sends, solo/cueing, volume ...etc

exper wrote:Nothing about the apc has been cumbersome by any means.

But when it comes to trying to use it as a general midi controller especially for third party plugs compared to other midi controllers like Novation's Automap line, it does seem like a pain.

exper wrote:And, as for your last sentence, check my signature, I hardly think I'm a newbie who can only deal with one controller...

No need to get defensive about that. Notice that I said that it would be great, especially for newbies, and not that it's made for newbies or that those who use it are newbies.

exper wrote:As I've said elsewhere, I still even like the launchpad.

But that's what I'm saying. Why do you need to point that out? Why do you make it sound like it's such a big deal to like the launchpad? As I've said, it's been mostly APC40 owners who're acting like they're threatened by the announcement of Launchpad, like it might make them feel they made a wrong choice in getting the APC. Admittedly, many people rejoiced at the announcement of the Launchpad and felt justified in not getting the APC for many reasons. But those people are entitled to making that choice. APC owners have been so quick to jump on that sentiment by attacking Launchpad or insisting one should have both. Some people just don't want the APC. That's no reason to get all worked up about it.

exper wrote:Plus, this is hardly about saving space. For instance with the nocturn/launchpad combo, nobody's gaining any precious, usable space.

I was talking about portability and the convenience of being bus-powered. But yes, size was one of the reasons I chose to get Maschine instead of APC40 to fit in my setup.

delicioso wrote:

exper wrote:And, as for a nocturn or nanokontrol being capable of being as in depth as an apc, can you simultaneously control 8 tracks of pan, volume, mute, solo and edit an effect without changing pages/scenes with a nanokontrol? Probably not.

I've used the APC40. I can do more with Nocturn and nanoKontrol with their respective remote midi scripts found in this forum than the APC and they allow for further customization easily. I can move between the 4 scenes of my nanoKontrol or the 4 group buttons of my Nocturn quickly and it doesn't slow my workflow at all. Besides I'd rather have the encoders on my Nocturn for volume controls rather than non-motorized faders. Also, I can control 16 tracks on my nanoKontrol very quickly for triggering/stopping clips, arming, panning, sends, solo/cueing, volume ...etc

exper wrote:Nothing about the apc has been cumbersome by any means.

But when it comes to trying to use it as a general midi controller especially for third party plugs compared to other midi controllers like Novation's Automap line, it does seem like a pain.

exper wrote:And, as for your last sentence, check my signature, I hardly think I'm a newbie who can only deal with one controller...

No need to get defensive about that. Notice that I said that it would be great, especially for newbies, and not that it's made for newbies or that those who use it are newbies.

exper wrote:As I've said elsewhere, I still even like the launchpad.

But that's what I'm saying. Why do you need to point that out? Why do you make it sound like it's such a big deal to like the launchpad? As I've said, it's been mostly APC40 owners who're acting like they're threatened by the announcement of Launchpad, like it might make them feel they made a wrong choice in getting the APC. Admittedly, many people rejoiced at the announcement of the Launchpad and felt justified in not getting the APC for many reasons. But those people are entitled to making that choice. APC owners have been so quick to jump on that sentiment by attacking Launchpad or insisting one should have both. Some people just don't want the APC. That's no reason to get all worked up about it.

exper wrote:Plus, this is hardly about saving space. For instance with the nocturn/launchpad combo, nobody's gaining any precious, usable space.

I was talking about portability and the convenience of being bus-powered. But yes, size was one of the reasons I chose to get Maschine instead of APC40 to fit in my setup.

You know what, good grief, I must have been in a bad mood earlier... sorry about that. I mis-read a lot apparently!
And, agree with the apc's uselessness with external, non live use. I guess that's why I'm keeping the remote zero as well.
There are tools for everyone, which is why we are all still not using those old school Fat Boy midi controllers!

No hard feelings, and now, back to working with Maschine!

I agree, they do seem complimentary but man when you shell out £400 on the APC you really start trying to justify where that extra £250 went, maybe you pay more for the privelage of less real estate on the table top...

charles_2 wrote:This APC vs Launchpad stuff is really juvenile. Maybe you should spend your time and energy making music instead of trying to create pointless feuds.

Sorry, but somtimes I feel like I have to start some disturbance. Mostly when I'm coming home from a long party night with buzzing in my ears because the crowd screamed "louder" the whole night. Therefore I hardly can't spend my time and energy for making music even if I would. But once such a thread is rolling I mostly like how it evolves...

delicioso wrote:The only people I see getting worked up over the Launchpad in this forum are those who already invested in the APC40 and thus need to justify their purchase. Just be satisfied with what you have if it works for you. And no, not everyone wants to buy both or have room for both. It's not about collecting controllers. It's using what works for you. It's great that there are lots of options now. Novation was smart in realizing that people would want to mix and match between the different choices of controllers for a more modular approach to customizing their setup. I'm not knocking the APC40 though I never wanted one because it's too bulky for my taste. But I'm sure it's great for some people, especially newbies who might not want to deal with more than one controller.

sdmiddleton wrote:I agree, they do seem complimentary but man when you shell out £400 on the APC you really start trying to justify where that extra £250 went, maybe you pay more for the privelage of less real estate on the table top...

This sounds like a summary after my fancy and as I intended but I fear...

Oh, I missed this:

exper wrote:...I bet automation of track volume in 8 steps will sound just great!

8 steps? Have you ever heard about the term "Value Scaling"?




BTW: Can your APC do this?



Hehe, controller and visuals in one! 100% acid style

aqua_tek wrote:

citizenchris099 wrote:It's funny how anti launch pad some of my friends are

I just think this comment is hilarious. I wasn't aware that there was a full-on Live controller war.

In reality, i think most APC40 users are content enough to either not get worked up over the Launch Pad, or actually EMBRACE it as a great companion to their APC40. (i include myself in the latter)

As opposed to the band of new Launch Pad fanboys who won't STFU trying to justify WHY they prefer the LP to the APC.

Complex much?

hilarious or not its true. the very mention of the LP to some of my friends gets them ranting. I'm on the fence as of now...leaning towards an LP or maybe a Livid "Block"

reflective7511 wrote:To big to bulky to chiseled...

Just like this retarded thread.

We do MUSIC !

We might be lazy bastards but at least I though we could be a bit more open minded than the sad (and boring) reflexion : "there could be only ONE dedicated ableton live controler" ...

Hence +1 retarded thread.

1ino1eum wrote:We might be lazy bastards but at least I though we could be a bit more open minded than the sad (and boring) reflexion : "there could be only ONE dedicated ableton live controler" ...

??? I haven't heard anyone say that at all so I'm not sure what all the whining is about. In fact, pretty much everyone that's talking about getting the Launchpad is planning on using it with another controller. If anything, APC40 is the one that was hyped as the "ONE dedicated ableton controller" more than anything else.

And there seem to be enough reasons why some people are upset or dissatisfied with Akai and APC40, like the Euro price gouging, unnecessarily bulky size and not being as portable as it could have been, requiring a power adapter, being almost useless as a general midi controller especially for third party plugs without inconvenient hacks, not as many grid buttons as the Launchpad...etc. These are all sentiments that would justify this thread.

Like I said, all of you who are whining about the existence of this thread are owners of APC40. If you're happy with it, I'd suggest you go spent more time with it instead of being insecure about it in this thread.

delicioso wrote:

1ino1eum wrote: Like I said, all of you who are whining about the existence of this thread are owners of APC40. If you're happy with it, I'd suggest you go spent more time with it instead of being insecure about it in this thread.

Yea I'm very insecure.
That's why I created a threat to justify why I buy a piece of hardware instead of another one, and then started to answer meticulously, part by part, quote by quote, to everyone telling me how juvenile I was.

+1 on retarded

delicioso wrote:Like I said, all of you who are whining about the existence of this thread are owners of APC40. If you're happy with it, I'd suggest you go spent more time with it instead of being insecure about it in this thread.

Haha, so true. I wanted to stay out of this one but couldn't resist.

Tone Deft wrote:dumb thread. did you watch the video FFS? it shows how well they work together.

aqua_tek wrote:As opposed to the band of new Launch Pad fanboys who won't STFU trying to justify WHY they prefer the LP to the APC.

exper wrote:Right, and this is before anyone has owned an LP yet. Just wait until they try and "mix" by pushing a grid of buttons. I bet automation of track volume in 8 steps will sound just great!

senator adam wrote:Just like this retarded thread.

1ino1eum wrote:Hence +1 retarded thread.

Bleep Blop Ima Robot wrote:+1 on retarded

^^^ All APC40 owners!!!

I wonder if we can get some sort of nerd gang warfare going using the controller identities.

I can just imagine the bitch-slap rumble.

mutant23 wrote:

delicioso wrote:Like I said, all of you who are whining about the existence of this thread are owners of APC40. If you're happy with it, I'd suggest you go spent more time with it instead of being insecure about it in this thread.

Haha, so true. I wanted to stay out of this one but couldn't resist.

Tone Deft wrote:dumb thread. did you watch the video FFS? it shows how well they work together.

aqua_tek wrote:As opposed to the band of new Launch Pad fanboys who won't STFU trying to justify WHY they prefer the LP to the APC.

exper wrote:Right, and this is before anyone has owned an LP yet. Just wait until they try and "mix" by pushing a grid of buttons. I bet automation of track volume in 8 steps will sound just great!

senator adam wrote:Just like this retarded thread.

1ino1eum wrote:Hence +1 retarded thread.

Bleep Blop Ima Robot wrote:+1 on retarded

^^^ All APC40 owners!!!

So, because someone owns an APC and is sick of 'the LP is SUCH a better buy SUCKERS!' threads they are now 'insecure' about their purchase? Ok...

So anyone sick of the mac vs PC threads must also be insecure about their purchases... right...

The whole 'go spend more time making music w/ it' argument is also pretty stupid since I'm fairly sure that people that own APC's are making far more music than those who own LP's at this point.