Ableton Forum

SubFunk wrote: i partly agree, motu makes good cards... but yes there is motu, presonus, echo and the lot and then there is RME and then... benchmark, metric halo, lynx, etc. (i totally agree about the built, we had motus next to other cards in my old company a 828, V4HD and a 8pre to be precise next to RME FF 800 a 400 and one metric halo ULN2 and the motus where the weakest in any respect, especially built, knobs etc.)

Don't lump Echo in with that lot. For sound quality, perhaps they're about the same (all Audiofires now have updated converters, though), but for driver quality they excel over Presonus, MOTU, EMU, M-Audio and other budget-end interfaces.

SubFunk wrote:it is of no question as soon as someone can afford an RME card to get it. full stop. next level above are the ones i mentioned already. everything else is underneath.

Agreed, personally I doubt I'll ever need anything better than a Multiface II because it's Good Enough to get professional results, and it's utterly solid. Yes, you can get better sounding boxes, but you need to pay a lot more. Four words: law of diminishing returns.

SubFunk wrote:...we had motus next to other cards in my old company a 828, V4HD and a 8pre to be precise next to RME FF 800 a 400 and one metric halo ULN2 and the motus where the weakest in any respect, especially built, knobs etc.

This quote has been burned into my head. It's the bullet through MOTU's heart.

chis wrote:Four words: law of diminishing returns.

I'm going to remind myself of this with every purchase going forward...

Hidden Driveways wrote: Damn. I was dead set on getting a MOTU Traveler, but Sub Funk has me second guessing this decision AGAIN. Oi vey. This never ends...

Now I want the FF400. But hell, if the FF400 needs it's own FireWire bus then that means I need to pay big bucks for a 17" MBP with an Expresscard slot so I can use an external 7200 RPM drive.

well motus are by no means bad cards... not at all, but RME is certainly a different league.

and the normal ff 400 does run pretty well on buspower... about the firewire daisy chaining, well i now very different stories, some guys are lucky others not, i am not sure if it has to do with the chipsets, or something?

but i hear you about the card slot in general, i am very pissed off with apple and i hope they bring it back... i rely heavy on the card slot and run 2x eSATA drives of it. (my studio audio drives)

chis wrote:Don't lump Echo in with that lot. For sound quality, perhaps they're about the same

i am aware of echos superb driver stability (i personally also had great experiences with presonus and RME, metric halo in that respect, though)
i was referring to the sound.

Tarekith wrote:

Cryptic UK wrote:Only thing with the 400 is that its 400:)
So could i daisy chain my firewire 800 hard drive with it and the mac without problems. how are you connecting it to your MBP?

I just connect it via FW400. It's more than fast enough for anything you'd use the FF400 for, so I don't see it only being 400 speed as an issue at all. They make a USB version of the FF400 now too. Only difference between it and the firewire version is that the USB version can actually get slightly lower latencies. Though I never go anywhere close to that low anyway, so no biggy to me.

You mean you connect it through a FireWire 400 to 800 lead?
Or do u have a 400 connection on your MBP?

^^^

it is no issue to use a 400 <-> 800 cable, i run my firebox that way.
and the other port the 400 is hosting a drive.

Yeah I think I'm leaning towards the rme 400 now.

My MBP has a 400 and an 800 port, I plug it directly into the 400 port.

Cryptic UK wrote:Yeah I think leaning towards the rme 400 now.

it is a fine card...

and knowing RME they work probably hard and fast on removing any still existing SL issues.

i personally would go normal ff400, not UC because of the bus power issue. but that might not be from importance for you?

SubFunk wrote:

Cryptic UK wrote:Yeah I think leaning towards the rme 400 now.

it is a fine card...

and knowing RME they work probably hard and fast on removing any still existing SL issues.

i personally would go normal ff400, not UC because of the bus power issue. but that might not be from importance for you?

Wasn't it just in a recent thread where people were saying the the RME Leopard drivers work fine on Snow Leopeoard, but the most recent Snow Leopard driver updates are more unstable?

No idea, I got confused by all that too Might want to check out the threads on the RME forums to see where things stand.

Tarekith wrote:No idea, I got confused by all that too Might want to check out the threads on the RME forums to see where things stand.

me too, i have not used a ff400 or ff 800 since i left the company i was working for... and sl came after that... so no idea, but even if it is true, i don't think it will stay like this for long, RME has the rep to care a lot about the driver performance.

glitchrock-buddha wrote:

SubFunk wrote:

Cryptic UK wrote:Yeah I think leaning towards the rme 400 now.

it is a fine card...

and knowing RME they work probably hard and fast on removing any still existing SL issues.

i personally would go normal ff400, not UC because of the bus power issue. but that might not be from importance for you?

Wasn't it just in a recent thread where people were saying the the RME Leopard drivers work fine on Snow Leopeoard, but the most recent Snow Leopard driver updates are more unstable?

Yeah, Aqua-Tek is having trouble with that. The remedy is to not download and update your OS to the bleeding edge. Hang back awhile and wait for stbility reports before you update the OS.

If it ain't broke, don't update it. I'm still on 10.4.11.

^^^ totally, don't fix or update anything if it is working.

i had troubles with the SL driver on my MBP

on the other hand the SL driver works great on my imac

what everyone is saying about the RME's being in another league is true, but unless you have them side by side like subfunk you will probably never notice a difference. I looked at the RME's and just couldn't justify the expense versus the ultralight MK3,

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/Fireface400/

$1299 + %8.25 tax= $1406

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/UltraLite3Hy/

$549 + %8.25 tax = $594

thats an $812 difference, thats a lot and I dont remember being THAT impressed with them.