Pitch Black wrote: And, being Ableton, I think they would do it more elegantly and beautifully than anyone else.
squelcht wrote: I'm waiting for the day when Novation makes some badass new iPad Automap/Launchpad style app, just as Korg & Moog has started to venture into.
Is there a "not" missing in that last sentence?Machinesworking wrote:More specifically, I don't think Ableton has the sort of global hooks in place in their software to pull off something that's as plug and play as the DP7 controller, which I hope is an issue to them?
Griid does not require Max for Live. Stay tuned for some big news btw..globalgoon wrote:Do you have to have max4live to be able to use the iPad with ableton?
Pitch Black wrote:After going thru considerable brouhaha to get the demo of Griid working on my ipod touch, I then find it's not at all reliable - some scenes simply do not fire when they are triggered. Enough to disqualify it from prime-time for me.
I would love to see Ableton come up with a iApp built from an "insider's" point of view. And, being Ableton, I think they would do it more elegantly and beautifully than anyone else.
Might just have to wait a few (years?) for it though!
ExactlyMachinesworking wrote:You mean something like this?
http://www.motu.com/newsitems/new-iphon ... -performer
Uses OSC to control Digital Performer 7, plug and play, no network setup to speak of. Works flawlessly.
I have no idea why? Somewhere along the way Ableton lost touch with the GUI and UI concepts they started with and decided to be a "one Live Set specific open ended idea fits all possible conceptual ways to connect to our interface" DAW. Seriously the UI is falling behind, when a dinosaur like MOTU pops out a controller like this that makes your hardware look clunky, something's wrong.
More specifically, I don't think Ableton has the sort of global hooks in place in their software to pull off something that's as plug and play as the DP7 controller, which I hope is an issue to them?
Nice! Between Griid, TouchOSC, and TouchAble the one that is going to win for me is the one that connects reliably with very little basic trouble shooting. I have a long tech history of "Wow, that's just odd" behavior problems that leaves most people stumped. For that reason I give up quite quickly and just wait for the next update and hope for the best.Hedroom wrote:Ok everyone.
Big Griid update coming...
You've asked for it... now, for the first time, you can have it!
No, I see no OSC support in Live, period. MOTU added it to DP7, and produced a free iphone app specifically tailored to DP. It works flawlessly, no need for the end user to lear Max for Live, to set up an IP address, to mess around with setting it up every time you open Live, or to go back to old songs and add the MIDI mapping.... none of that, it simply works.hoffman2k wrote:Is there a "not" missing in that last sentence?Machinesworking wrote:More specifically, I don't think Ableton has the sort of global hooks in place in their software to pull off something that's as plug and play as the DP7 controller, which I hope is an issue to them?
Half the hooks are already in place because of all the control surfaces. At the moment you can do anything a Mackie control can do.
We are missing lots of stuff in the area of creating/editing/moving clips and accessing devices within Racks. But that is bound to get sorted now because of MFL. Before MFL there was no controller that allowed these sort of actions. Maybe apart from LiveControl by ST8 which allows MIDI Clips to be edited.
If these improvements happen, they'll be useful with python hacks, MFL, future MIDI Controllers and native OSC support.
As for the plug and play part. Its all about Bonjour which works on any mac and on a PC if you install quicktime. And we already know you can run the UDP connection from a python script.
Machinesworking wrote:No, I see no OSC support in Live, period. MOTU added it to DP7, and produced a free iphone app specifically tailored to DP. It works flawlessly, no need for the end user to lear Max for Live, to set up an IP address, to mess around with setting it up every time you open Live, or to go back to old songs and add the MIDI mapping.... none of that, it simply works.hoffman2k wrote:Is there a "not" missing in that last sentence?Machinesworking wrote:More specifically, I don't think Ableton has the sort of global hooks in place in their software to pull off something that's as plug and play as the DP7 controller, which I hope is an issue to them?
Half the hooks are already in place because of all the control surfaces. At the moment you can do anything a Mackie control can do.
We are missing lots of stuff in the area of creating/editing/moving clips and accessing devices within Racks. But that is bound to get sorted now because of MFL. Before MFL there was no controller that allowed these sort of actions. Maybe apart from LiveControl by ST8 which allows MIDI Clips to be edited.
If these improvements happen, they'll be useful with python hacks, MFL, future MIDI Controllers and native OSC support.
As for the plug and play part. Its all about Bonjour which works on any mac and on a PC if you install quicktime. And we already know you can run the UDP connection from a python script.
Ableton are too busy IMO being "clever" to be smart. Some of use just want to use Live as a great performance tool without trying to reinvent performing. A clear, strait forward iphone/ipad app that allows you to run through songs in a set, transport controls and an interactive mixer for free, that literally takes zero time to set up and works flawlessly would be nice, that's what MOTU delivered, and it's IMO pretty awesome that MOTU gave this baby away. I appreciate all the tinker toys that are set up for Live, but it's just become less plug and play, and more plug, tinker around, play.
I could go off about this, the UI thing, just the fact you have to use Racks to automate turning off plug ins in Session View, that an on/off switch in Racks is controlled by a knob instead of a button. That the visual state of a control in Session view is always 100% on etc. etc.
Seriously, in many ways Live is becoming Logic, which is funny because years ago you argued against my requests for basic DAW tools in Live, and IMO M4L in many ways brings the Logic Environment and it's paradigm into Live. What my point was and is, is that Live is veering towards tech nerds without offering an alternative to that in many cases these days. Case in point DP Control VS any solution offered for Live.
Love the program, fear that plug and play issues even will require M4L and some setting up to implement, that the 'intuitive' nature of Live is slipping away into the ether.
You must have read something I didn't say, because I was talking about the "hooks". No there isn't OSC support, but the fact there are like half a dozen applications providing that support, I'd argue that the hooks for Ableton to do this are there.beats me wrote:Machinesworking wrote: No, I see no OSC support in Live, period. MOTU added it to DP7, and produced a free iphone app specifically tailored to DP. It works flawlessly, no need for the end user to lear Max for Live, to set up an IP address, to mess around with setting it up every time you open Live, or to go back to old songs and add the MIDI mapping.... none of that, it simply works.
Ableton are too busy IMO being "clever" to be smart. Some of use just want to use Live as a great performance tool without trying to reinvent performing. A clear, strait forward iphone/ipad app that allows you to run through songs in a set, transport controls and an interactive mixer for free, that literally takes zero time to set up and works flawlessly would be nice, that's what MOTU delivered, and it's IMO pretty awesome that MOTU gave this baby away. I appreciate all the tinker toys that are set up for Live, but it's just become less plug and play, and more plug, tinker around, play.
I could go off about this, the UI thing, just the fact you have to use Racks to automate turning off plug ins in Session View, that an on/off switch in Racks is controlled by a knob instead of a button. That the visual state of a control in Session view is always 100% on etc. etc.
Seriously, in many ways Live is becoming Logic, which is funny because years ago you argued against my requests for basic DAW tools in Live, and IMO M4L in many ways brings the Logic Environment and it's paradigm into Live. What my point was and is, is that Live is veering towards tech nerds without offering an alternative to that in many cases these days. Case in point DP Control VS any solution offered for Live.
Love the program, fear that plug and play issues even will require M4L and some setting up to implement, that the 'intuitive' nature of Live is slipping away into the ether.
Amen.
I've read a lot of posts on this side of the forum lately where noobs are asking for what should be a basic feature. But instead of people saying "no, it can't do that", all the chin strokers respond with overly elaborate workarounds that hardly make it worth the effort. But these people get gitty with the challenge and I don't think they are any longer capable of thinking on basic levels because they've been eyeball deep in workarounds and/or m4l for far too long.
I think this has enabled Ableton to slack off on just making some things simple or embracing methods other DAWs have been using for quite some time.
