Ableton Forum

So people did a bunch of work for you for free and you're going to make a double CD and charge them for it? Classy!

Another possible candidate for synths that support microtonal stuff would be Madrona Labs' "Aalto". Randy Jone's implementation of a Buchla-style complex oscillator is absolutely wonderful, and the thing supports the Scala tuning standard. I took the Scala tuning file I use for MSP and Ethno and just dropped it into the Aalto folder and hey presto - it fired up and worked perfectly. It's one of the best analog-style plug-in implementations I've heard in a good while. Might be worth a listen (and his hardware controller looks pretty nice, too):

http://www.madronalabs.com/

How do you get to this scale tuning :
221.23 Hz = G# (a1 = 442.5 Hz / 440 Hz + 9.6 cent)

As you can see it's +9.6 cent.

Gregory Taylor wrote:So people did a bunch of work for you for free and you're going to make a double CD and charge them for it? Classy!

Another possible candidate for synths that support microtonal stuff would be Madrona Labs' "Aalto". Randy Jone's implementation of a Buchla-style complex oscillator is absolutely wonderful, and the thing supports the Scala tuning standard. I took the Scala tuning file I use for MSP and Ethno and just dropped it into the Aalto folder and hey presto - it fired up and worked perfectly. It's one of the best analog-style plug-in implementations I've heard in a good while. Might be worth a listen (and his hardware controller looks pretty nice, too):

http://www.madronalabs.com/

No, I was just kidding. Finishing a CD is one side of the story selling it the other one.
Thanks for the link.
Regards, OT

PHY6 wrote:How do you get to this scale tuning :
221.23 Hz = G# (a1 = 442.5 Hz / 440 Hz + 9.6 cent)

As you can see it's +9.6 cent.

Are we talking about Venus, don´t we?
As far as I understood this kind of work it is not possible if you work in the cent tuning system. Normal soft- or hardware synthesizers only do cent steps. Some of them are possible to get tuned in Hz but only for every single note. I know that a lot of people work with the cent system what brings them very close to the original tunings. To get in resonanz I made the experience that is enough. Some people are using the synths inside of Reason for example and these only do cent steps.
So please let me know if you have a better solution.
Best regards and thanks for the answer, OT

Its probably worth noting that Ableton has a special file format that allows people to make microtonal (single cycle) waveforms.
AMS files are text files that get translated into waveforms when you use them in Simpler/Sampler.

I wrote a couple of articles about it a few years ago: http://www.thecovertoperators.org/Searc ... leton+meta

The second article covers microtonal waveforms.
Its easy but a bit tedious. Then again, since you already have Max, its a small step to make a text file generator that possibly gets its data from .scala files. Or you can tweak Monolake's generator.

PHY6 wrote:How do you get to this scale tuning :
221.23 Hz = G# (a1 = 442.5 Hz / 440 Hz + 9.6 cent)

As you can see it's +9.6 cent.

Regarding pitchbend resolution cent as float wouldn't be a problem.
For the standard range of +/-2 semitones we get 400/16384 = ~0.025 cent per pitchbend step.

broc wrote:

PHY6 wrote:How do you get to this scale tuning :
221.23 Hz = G# (a1 = 442.5 Hz / 440 Hz + 9.6 cent)

As you can see it's +9.6 cent.

Regarding pitchbend resolution cent as float wouldn't be a problem.
For the standard range of +/-2 semitones we get 400/16384 = ~0.025 cent per pitchbend step.

How does that translate to the cents in the m4l device ?

PHY6 wrote:

broc wrote:

PHY6 wrote:How do you get to this scale tuning :
221.23 Hz = G# (a1 = 442.5 Hz / 440 Hz + 9.6 cent)

As you can see it's +9.6 cent.

Regarding pitchbend resolution cent as float wouldn't be a problem.
For the standard range of +/-2 semitones we get 400/16384 = ~0.025 cent per pitchbend step.

How does that translate to the cents in the m4l device ?

The device can easily be adapted, for example like this.

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broc wrote: Regarding pitchbend resolution cent as float wouldn't be a problem.
For the standard range of +/-2 semitones we get 400/16384 = ~0.025 cent per pitchbend step.

How does that translate to the cents in the m4l device ?[/quote]
The device can easily be adapted, for example like this.

<pre><code>
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851.3ocuWssbaBCD8Y7WACSdHWboRb0tu01+f9ZlLYvfHQsfjGP10oYxGU+E
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</code></pre>[/quote]

Thanks, can't check it right now, but I'll see what this does.
I have absolutely no knowledge (and time) for programming of max, so for me it's abracadabra...
I have an outboard synth that's capable of tuning in Hertz, but I'd like my vst's to be tuned aswell.
I've found some tuning files for Alchemy, but this might get all my synths in tune...great.

hoffman2k wrote:Its probably worth noting that Ableton has a special file format that allows people to make microtonal (single cycle) waveforms.
AMS files are text files that get translated into waveforms when you use them in Simpler/Sampler.

I wrote a couple of articles about it a few years ago: http://www.thecovertoperators.org/Searc ... leton+meta

The second article covers microtonal waveforms.
Its easy but a bit tedious. Then again, since you already have Max, its a small step to make a text file generator that possibly gets its data from .scala files. Or you can tweak Monolake's generator.

Pretty hot stuff!!! Thanks for sharing these secrets with us. I read the article but I have a few questions to it, I´m getting to later. The sounds are great and there is a very big potential that is for shure.
Best regards, OT

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That patch works well. I´ve been testing it.
Also I had been trying your other suggestions. They are working, too. Eccept for tracks I played chords with the synthesizer and if I have different finetunings at Operater´s oszillators I guess. Then I get to hear more disharmonics instead of tuning ins.
OT

OT,

I'm glad that it basically works as expected. But unfortunately we don't know the pitchbend implementation of operator in detail. It has several pitch related parameters (eg. coarse, fine, pitch envelope, spread) which could possibly lead to inconsistent or unexpected behavior.

broc, YOU are the man...
Been searching for a long time to be able to do this. Never thought of the option to do this with m4l untill I stumbled on this thread.
Got a few different VSTi's hooked up with your device, and it works...thank you SOOO much...

broc wrote:OT,

I'm glad that it basically works as expected. But unfortunately we don't know the pitchbend implementation of operator in detail. It has several pitch related parameters (eg. coarse, fine, pitch envelope, spread) which could possibly lead to inconsistent or unexpected behavior.

Too bad. At some of the traks it is working perfectly at others not. But with your help I am closer to the perfect tunings than ever. There for a real BIG THANK YOU!!! Of course I can overwork the missing tracks and find other sounds that will match. This should not be such a big thing. In one song it´s only two traks. And for the future work I am able to create real well!
And who knows what changes are coming up into ABLETON in the future....
Best Regards, OT

PHY6 wrote:broc, YOU are the man...
Been searching for a long time to be able to do this. Never thought of the option to do this with m4l untill I stumbled on this thread.
Got a few different VSTi's hooked up with your device, and it works...thank you SOOO much...

So that is fine I could help arange things for you, too.
Are you into music about the Cosmic Octave?
OT