Ableton Forum

login wrote:I always thought companies as ADK are a rip off, kind of the Apple bussiness model adapted to windows.

In what way? ADK builds custom PCs based on a user's specific needs out of components they have tested that are known to work well together. Apple does that?

Not being dicky, I just don't see the connection.

Also, ADK are very transparent about the pricing of their components and services, so it's not exactly an arm twist.

Just a note: having run Live in both Windows and Mac environments, I don't think there is a discernable difference. I have found Live to be as stable on both, all other things being the same. Neither have I found Ableton Support any less helpful.

@mekanism1200 - my sympathy. It can be very frustrating - especially when your time is under pressure

mekanism1200 wrote:Warning Rant Alert!

I have sent over a dozen crash reports since its release with none of these issues being fixed.

Remember crash reports do not elicit Ableton Support.

You need a Status report: (Help--> Get Support --> make Status report --> email to Support @ Ableton)

They are usually very helpful.

dtomaloff wrote:

login wrote:I always thought companies as ADK are a rip off, kind of the Apple bussiness model adapted to windows.

In what way? ADK builds custom PCs based on a user's specific needs out of components they have tested that are known to work well together. Apple does that?

Not being dicky, I just don't see the connection.

Also, ADK are very transparent about the pricing of their components and services, so it's not exactly an arm twist.

Well you can build it your self and save the labor costs, bulding a PC isnt hard and can be done withih 2 hours, then just one more hour for OS instalation, less if you have SSD.

login wrote:

dtomaloff wrote:

login wrote:I always thought companies as ADK are a rip off, kind of the Apple bussiness model adapted to windows.

In what way? ADK builds custom PCs based on a user's specific needs out of components they have tested that are known to work well together. Apple does that?

Not being dicky, I just don't see the connection.

Also, ADK are very transparent about the pricing of their components and services, so it's not exactly an arm twist.

Well you can build it your self and save the labor costs, bulding a PC isnt hard and can be done withih 2 hours, then just one more hour for OS instalation, less if you have SSD.

Yes, one does have that option, but I don't see how providing an optional, transparent service is a "ripoff." I, for instance, don't know much about building computers or choosing components. The relatively small difference in price between bare parts and a finished PC can be seen as the price one pays for warranty, support, and general expertise that one (such as I) might not possess. If one can--and is willing--to DIY, cool, but I don't get the ripoff aspect is all I'm saying.

Anyway, not trying to thread-jack. To each his/her own.

mekanism1200 wrote:Thanks for chiming in everyone-

To the Apple fans- Windows 7 is a solid platform. Live 9 is the ONLY software out of a myriad of other programs I use that has these issues. It is clearly an Ableton or Max issue, its not the OS. No I will not switch to Apple because they are better blah blah blah! I will switch programs before I do that.

Ignore the apple FB's.

However, some thoughts. On my win7x64 system live runs with almost NO problems. However, M4L isn't really top notch. If you do a search, you'll see that people do have issues with that.

But vsts (all) and the use of the product....almost no issues (other than stuff live should implement )

just take a look here:
viewtopic.php?f=35&t=205402
and you see that a lot of people are having these problems and that it is a problem with running m4l in live 64 bit on windows 7 64 bit. i also have these frequent crashes with m4l devices under these system configurations and my system is otherwise extremely stable. these problems are known for months now, even by the m4l developers, and nothing has happened. i expect that a lot of people are still using windows 7 64 bit and i really think that fixing these crashes with m4l should be a top priority. i can only hope that one of the next betas provides a fix for these problems.

login wrote:

dtomaloff wrote:

login wrote:I always thought companies as ADK are a rip off, kind of the Apple bussiness model adapted to windows.

In what way? ADK builds custom PCs based on a user's specific needs out of components they have tested that are known to work well together. Apple does that?

Not being dicky, I just don't see the connection.

Also, ADK are very transparent about the pricing of their components and services, so it's not exactly an arm twist.

Well you can build it your self and save the labor costs, bulding a PC isnt hard and can be done withih 2 hours, then just one more hour for OS instalation, less if you have SSD.

I doubt you will be building your own laptop. When I was doing research on what laptop to buy I was looking at Macbooks and a custom Lenovo Thinkpad.

The Macbook pro with the specs I wanted was over $3k and I would lose the optical drive, and had to settle for a 15" screen.

The Lenovo Thinkpad got me close to what I wanted and was around $2100 out the door, but with not as good of a video card and no backlit keyboard.

The ADK laptop had all of the specs I wanted, I got to keep the optical drive, backlit keys, 17" screen, full support, warranty and with the Presonus Audiobox came to about $2500 out the door. It also came factory overclocked to 3.8ghz, custom Bios for low latency, Paragon backup software, and laptop bag as bonuses.

Needless to say I dont regret my purchase at all.

re:dream wrote:

mekanism1200 wrote:Warning Rant Alert!

I have sent over a dozen crash reports since its release with none of these issues being fixed.

Remember crash reports do not elicit Ableton Support.

You need a Status report: (Help--> Get Support --> make Status report --> email to Support @ Ableton)

They are usually very helpful.

Good point, this will be my next step. Thanks for the help!

mekanism1200 wrote: I put a rant disclaimer at the top. If you didnt want to read a post that read as whining then you shouldnt have responded,

I don't mind the whining and ranting if it's accompanied with sufficient facts about the problems, so that the community can help if possible. Leaving that out only frustrates the reader too.

mekanism1200 wrote: I have only contacted support once a while ago and they told me to read the manual. …
I will try contacting Ableton again.

Hmmm, I do wonder what you said to get that response. I've never got anything even close that.

mekanism1200 wrote: Granulator 2 now crashes any time I try to add it, even with an empty project. Crashes occur upon loading projects with devices, when adding them, many different scenarios.
I have only contacted support once a while ago and they told me to read the manual. I have submitted about 75% of the crashes through the reporting system and was hoping that would be sufficient enough for them to see an issue but I was wrong.

Yes, I've also had issues installing packs lately in a fresh system. That didn't use to happen, so I'd say it's a current issue for some at least.

mekanism1200 wrote: The ADK laptop had all of the specs I wanted, I got to keep the optical drive, backlit keys, 17" screen, full support, warranty and with the Presonus Audiobox came to about $2500 out the door. It also came factory overclocked to 3.8ghz, custom Bios for low latency, Paragon backup software, and laptop bag as bonuses.

Needless to say I dont regret my purchase at all.

That sounds like a great machine. ADK vouched for the Presonus too?

Anyway, from your description I'd think it's safe to say your issues, with installing packs at least, has nothing to do with hardware and probably not Windows either. It's the Ableton Live pack installation system that does seem to have a little problem.

My experience with pack installation crashes would indicate that packs are indeed getting fully installed, but that there is a problem sometimes with displaying the default lesson. It has happened to me now multiple times, but not every time.

Beside this issue, I have some problems related to loading or moving some stuff or doing unorthodox maneuvers, but it's very seldom I get a crash. I never get crashes during normal music production operation since I reinstalled all music software (except Komplete 9), but had a brief unstable period around Christmas I think. I got great help here in the forums for that and also from Ableton support.

Stromkraft wrote:

mekanism1200 wrote: The ADK laptop had all of the specs I wanted, I got to keep the optical drive, backlit keys, 17" screen, full support, warranty and with the Presonus Audiobox came to about $2500 out the door. It also came factory overclocked to 3.8ghz, custom Bios for low latency, Paragon backup software, and laptop bag as bonuses.

Needless to say I dont regret my purchase at all.

That sounds like a great machine. ADK vouched for the Presonus too?

Anyway, from your description I'd think it's safe to say your issues, with installing packs at least, has nothing to do with hardware and probably not Windows either. It's the Ableton Live pack installation system that does seem to have a little problem.

My experience with pack installation crashes would indicate that packs are indeed getting fully installed, but that there is a problem sometimes with displaying the default lesson. It has happened to me now multiple times, but not every time.

Beside this issue, I have some problems related to loading or moving some stuff or doing unorthodox maneuvers, but it's very seldom I get a crash. I never get crashes during normal music production operation since I reinstalled all music software (except Komplete 9), but had a brief unstable period around Christmas I think. I got great help here in the forums for that and also from Ableton support.

Yeah ADK recommended presonus for my needs as I didnt need that many I/O's. The 22vsl has been great, no problems whatsoever. When I get some time I will dig into this a bit deeper and try to do some repro's so I can give Ableton support more to work with other than random incidents.

I didnt mean to come on here acting like a whiny lil girl, its just frustrating when you have limited time to do the one thing you love to do on your spare time and you instead are fighting with software issues. Its the nature of the beast I suppose.

You guys have been real helpful, thanks again!

I am running an ADK laptop, windows 7, RME UFX soundcard, for live performance with 8 inputs including drums, vocals, clarinet, and using some M4L effects.... CPU is about 38% on a 90 minute live set in arrangement view.... We have played about 20 shows and have not had a crash or problem.

I do get an occasional crash on a studio track that is way overloaded with plugins, tracks etc.

Stromkraft wrote: My experience with pack installation crashes would indicate that packs are indeed getting fully installed, but that there is a problem sometimes with displaying the default lesson. It has happened to me now multiple times, but not every time.

UPDATE

I fixed this problem by reverting to the original Default "Current Set" instead of my own template that I used. It also fixed a cosmetic problem with that the pack icon wasn't properly installed in the pack bundle (On OS X bundles are folders that are treated like files).

I don't have any other issues with my own template, but somehow the pack installation didn't like it for displaying the first lesson of the pack. This is still a bug as Live shouldn't crash depending on the template.

mekanism1200 Do you have your own template too? If so, try reverting the default set to see if that helps you too. We may of course have similar symptoms and the reasons for our respective pack installation issues may also be different.