Ableton Forum

D K wrote:i do see the point, but the wmc is an industry conference...
what do you expect? it's just like cmj or sxsw...
i think this "real" talk is pure elitist scenester bullshit, btw.
do what you do to the best of your ability, be a good positive human, and don't compare yourself to others. appreciate others' success, and it will come back to you.
peace.

actually, i don't all this as being elitist scenester bullshit. it is about supporting those who support you.

what spike is saying is like if walmart came to town and ran out all the local hardware shops and then the "american hardware conference" voted them "best hardware retailer". it's not that they are the best, OR that they are really contributing to the quality of hardware retailing, OR that they have knowledgable staff who really school you on what you need to know about hardware. it's just that they had the money to open stores and they knew hardware would sell. sure they may have what you need when you need it, but it won't be the really good stuff, it won't be sold to you by someone who has put their life into knowing their hardware and knows you by name when you walk into the store. and it won't give a damn thing back to the community. not to mention the fact that it will have a negative impact on all of those mom and pop hardware stores who busted their ass to build a quality place to shop for hardware.

elitist? i don't think so. recognizing hypocrisy when it's right in front of you?

yup. i think that's it.

but we all know the "conference " is the epitome of the b.s. we're trying to
rise above...it IS big business. easy to recognize. trying to prove to big business (or anyone that thinks for themselves) that you are "real" is a waste of time. infiltrate it. break it down from the inside. do your thing, the best you can, be true and that's the ultimate reward. not the recognition.

If you don't like iTunes, don't vote for it. Plain and simple.

If you don't want iTunes to 'control' the industry, change it. But by attacking those who don't see things your way, you isolate yourself, not iTunes.

and really, there is nothing pure about WMC. There is nothing pure about anything...everything has its good and bad.

Unless you have a "real DMR" (whatever that means - whose definition? what is that about beauty being in the eye of someone...), wouldn't you do it for the love and not the $$$?

And please, slipmats? there isn't a chance in hell that I would buy them from my local shop...The last thing I need is a spinning advertisement staring me in the face all night.

Definitely scenester nonsense if you ask me.

Dance to what you want to danc to, not what someone tells you to.

AOL Music? 1-800-Dentist? ~ Are your teeth clean? Maybe I'll hear dance music on my next visit.

tylast wrote:AOL Music? 1-800-Dentist? ~ Are your teeth clean? Maybe I'll hear dance music on my next visit.

AOL Music actually sponsored a music show featuring a DJ mix by John Digweed.

Do you feel it's a bad thing that reputable corporations are trying to co-opt the mainstream dance bandwagon? What's so bad about dentist networks and service providers that are willing to pump money into Electronic music for sake of a little publicity? Don't we gain more than them, considering we're the fledgling operation, and they're the established money?

it's all about getting dance record labels not wanting to put their tunes on itune .

1-800-dentist. WDF?!?!?! are we now to assume that the stuff we call music is in fact muzak and is best played in dentist offices. or is that just a cover to "rave" and legally inhale nitrous oxide? i agree... wmc is a joke. unfortunately, no one is laughing.

itunes is itunes. nothing more nothing less. they do what they do and they do a damn good job at it (i.e. selling ipods that tend to breakdown in a year or two). and while they sell dance music, they are not in fact a "dance music retailer". they are a "mass market retailer" and that's fine, the world needs those as well. now either wmc is way off base or the whole nature of dance music has changed and none of us noticed.

can i suggest we just drop the subject and move on? how about that new magik johnson tune on soco audio? talk about a club hottie.

...period. The dance music industry as most people wax nostalgic was in its infancy just shy over twenty years ago. Now, it has changed, just as the whole record industry has changed, the technology has change, the way a young child changes into a teenager, and then changes into an adult. The fact is that "change is". Pure and simple - so why resist it?

Now change may be "good" or it may be "bad", but that all depends on your point of view. Its important to keep in mind that ones personal perspective really determines whether someone thinks that anything is good or bad.

So, those who think that the corporatization of the industry and community is bad, are looking at the industry and community from only a limited point of view. Another limited point of view may be that that the industry is better than before. IN my opinion both perspectives are equally true. Its not an either/or scenario - its a both/and situation.

If we can think inclusively, then the community will continue to grow, to evolve. The only way it can die is if the people who love the music die, or their love of the music dies. No corporation, Apple or otherwise, can do anything unless we want them too. The fact that they already are so popular and influential is a testament to the fact that people, for better or for worse, support the direction their going in.

elitist? i don't think so. recognizing hypocrisy when it's right in front of you?

yup. i think that's it.

I agree with the poster who said that it is elitist. I don't know Spike, but his his post makes clear that he has a set of criteria that he thinks one must meet in order to qualify as a "dance music retailer" and anyone who does not meet those criteria should not be considered a dance music retailer. To me that is elitism because he is imposing his own beliefs on everyone else.

It's the exact same thing as when people spend hours arguing about whether an artist qualifies as EDM or break-core or hard-step or whatever is the descriptive contraction du jour.

Maybe I-Tunes doesn't sell vinyl or slipmats and hasn't been around for 10+ years, but if they're selling dance music, that pretty much facially qualifies them as a dance music retailer since they are retailing dance music.