Ableton Forum

Posted: **Wed May 03, 2006 5:43 am**

stinky wrote:
How bout blaming Apple, or IBM...? Intel?
no, it's NI and other companies

Maybe the Dali Lama?
no, the dali lama uses logic

NI has got to be the largest audio software company out there..
If you ask them, they say they are small........

it's not like Apple gave anyone a heads up...

Logic pro has to be the largest chunk of software out there, if they can port all those kick ass fx/synths/etc.....NI (and others) can too. I'm all for giving them time......but someone said that they recieved an email saying it's been pushed back........not good.

now, i'm not saying NI is the best software company out there, but you gotta give them credit where credit is do (they make kickass products) and sympathize at the enormous undertaken it has to be to provide a TESTED universal binary for their product set.. keep in mind that this stuff isn't a snap of the fingers to implement... they've got to put a portion of each department on this task, while still moving ahead with prior software timelines...
I TOTALLY agree, but again, they want money, they given some timelines, and it's getting to be time to see something......one at a time is even fine!

It's KORE, they want more money........get people buying kore and komplete and "we'll worrry about the others later"........

continue to buy NI, just like you would anyone else, including Ableton... just be smart about it...
I tried and FAILED the no-buy-(insert your company here) you are sooooo correct!

BTW, when apple broke the news of their architecture change, i planned on buying a macbook pro NEXT YEAR (ie 3rd-4th quarter of 2007)

WHY? Simple:

Because an architecture change of this magnitude is definitely a tall order, and a smart person would wait and not complain that their software doesn't run properly, or there are all these bugs

2 reasons!!!!!

1) Wait until the bugs (i'm speaking mainly of hardware, but also software) are out - usually takes at least 2-3 generations of a product

2) Wait for developers to migrate your favorite apps - That's the most important reason, otherwise you're sitting there with your dick in your hand bitching about so and so company for not moving their ass fast enough when you snap your fingers

UUUHHHhhh... it's not brain surgery folks, just patience..
Um, are you ok? That is not really necessary is it? Some of us wanted to take the ride.....the complaints go back before macintels were made.

And the problem AGAIN is that they said this.......they meant that and they knew they were not telling the truth in the first place.

I can sympathize with NI, at this point, more than i can sympathize with a poor consumer choice...
And do you do this with the oil companies too?

Posted: **Wed May 03, 2006 6:19 am**

First of all, learn how to use quotes, so it's easier to read... Try using the preview button..

Quote:
How bout blaming Apple, or IBM...? Intel?

no, it's NI and other companies

that's not really an argument... especially when NOONE knew that apple was making the switch till they announced it... My point is that all these software companies are relying on a hardware/software platform that all of a sudden changes.. a little realism is in order...

Quote:
Maybe the Dali Lama?

no, the dali lama uses logic

Funny, don't quit your day job...

Quote:
NI has got to be the largest audio software company out there..

If you ask them, they say they are small........

They're probably thinking in terms of a SOFTWARE company.. in terms of a software company, they're not that big.. Think Adobe! They're 10x as big, and they've not even ported... and it may not be another year till they do.. be happy you're not a graphics designer, photographer, video editor...

Quote:
it's not like Apple gave anyone a heads up...

Logic pro has to be the largest chunk of software out there, if they can port all those kick ass fx/synths/etc.....NI (and others) can too. I'm all for giving them time......but someone said that they recieved an email saying it's been pushed back........not good.

Apple owns logic.. that's why they got the jump... And dropped logic for win32... that makes it only 1 platform to develop for... not multiple platforms..

Quote:
now, i'm not saying NI is the best software company out there, but you gotta give them credit where credit is do (they make kickass products) and sympathize at the enormous undertaken it has to be to provide a TESTED universal binary for their product set.. keep in mind that this stuff isn't a snap of the fingers to implement... they've got to put a portion of each department on this task, while still moving ahead with prior software timelines...

I TOTALLY agree, but again, they want money, they given some timelines, and it's getting to be time to see something......one at a time is even fine!

It's KORE, they want more money........get people buying kore and komplete and "we'll worrry about the others later"........

It does cost money to develop software, and port it to a totally new architecture... Imagine if NI had to port all of there software to Linux all of a sudden... (FreeBSD in this case)

Quote:
continue to buy NI, just like you would anyone else, including Ableton... just be smart about it...

I tried and FAILED the no-buy-(insert your company here) you are sooooo correct!

By your own admission...

Quote:
BTW, when apple broke the news of their architecture change, i planned on buying a macbook pro NEXT YEAR (ie 3rd-4th quarter of 2007)

WHY? Simple:

Because an architecture change of this magnitude is definitely a tall order, and a smart person would wait and not complain that their software doesn't run properly, or there are all these bugs

2 reasons!!!!!

1) Wait until the bugs (i'm speaking mainly of hardware, but also software) are out - usually takes at least 2-3 generations of a product

2) Wait for developers to migrate your favorite apps - That's the most important reason, otherwise you're sitting there with your dick in your hand bitching about so and so company for not moving their ass fast enough when you snap your fingers

UUUHHHhhh... it's not brain surgery folks, just patience..

Um, are you ok? That is not really necessary is it? Some of us wanted to take the ride.....the complaints go back before macintels were made.

And the problem AGAIN is that they said this.......they meant that and they knew they were not telling the truth in the first place.

You obviously know nothing about software development, or the IT world... Don't forget that NI had to all of a sudden hire/find developers who knew how to program for this new platform, as well as program for the old platform... specifically in audio software design??! These people don't grow on trees... especially for a 5% market..

Quote:
I can sympathize with NI, at this point, more than i can sympathize with a poor consumer choice...

And do you do this with the oil companies too?

That's constructive... of course i don't sympathize with oil companies, but NI is not a monopoly, and it doesn't run a software cartel... a little perspective is in order..

I can sympathize because i know what it takes, and i'm realistic... not just bitching because i have no foresight...

Posted: **Wed May 03, 2006 6:24 am**

this wouldnt be an issue if apple had just made the G5 powerbook!!!

i kid, i kid.

Posted: **Wed May 03, 2006 6:26 am**

believe me, you wouldn't want a g5 powertoaster

Posted: **Wed May 03, 2006 6:29 am**

stinky wrote:believe me, you wouldn't want a g5 powertoaster

haha i know. My joke was only in reference to the fanboys who used to say "G5 powerbooks next tuesday!"

believe me, i cant wait to get my mitts on some Merom sweetness.

Posted: **Wed May 03, 2006 6:30 am**

Believe me, i can wait, but only just barely enough to know that i'm not making a foolish decision by buying now and being frustrated by all the limitations....

Posted: **Wed May 03, 2006 6:32 am**

stinky wrote:Believe me, i can wait, but only just barely enough to know that i'm not making a foolish decision by buying now and being frustrated by all the limitations....

not to mention the spec improvements to be made later in the product's cycle.

im sure macbooks will get a nice speed bump or hardware upgrade before the holidays, as most products usually do.

Posted: **Wed May 03, 2006 6:38 am**

What's funny to me is how macbookpro owners don't realize that they're just a TESTBED... people complain about software companies (hrmmm, Microsoft) releasing to early, and endless beta cycles where customers wind up being the company's unpaid testers (and they PAID for it).. shit man, people make a living out of being testers... my best friend is a tester... you guys should be making fuckin money for the hairpulling that you're going through...

Posted: **Wed May 03, 2006 6:39 am**

i'd rather be frustrated with the "really fucking fast portable Mac and not that much software" limitation than the "really fucking slow portable Mac and a bunch of NI stuff that i can barely run" limitation.

either way, i guess frustrations breed creativity.

NI needs to take their heads out of their asses though.
That statement has nothing to do with Intel Macs either, i don't expect them to give us a proper UB release when they can't even get their website to operate properly on a semi-regular basis. i tried downloading the KORE video from their site the other day.... yea, what a joke. 1.5kb/sec.

And, about the "hire/find developers who knew how to program for this new platform" bit, Audio Damage didn't hire anyone new. Neither did Wave Arts or Metric Halo. The existing developers ADAPTED.

About the only things NI have ever ADAPTED to was new methods of bringing a modern computer to its knees. You'd think with new generations of computing hardware, their software would become more stable...

yea, you'd think....

Posted: **Wed May 03, 2006 6:55 am**

NI needs to take their heads out of their asses though.
That statement has nothing to do with Intel Macs either, i don't expect them to give us a proper UB release when they can't even get their website to operate properly on a semi-regular basis. i tried downloading the KORE video from their site the other day.... yea, what a joke. 1.5kb/sec.

I do agree with you that NI drops the ball about alot, but they do have a huge product base... i'm only playing devil's advocate because i respect their sound quality and the innovation that Reaktor had created initially

And, about the "hire/find developers who knew how to program for this new platform" bit, Audio Damage didn't hire anyone new. Neither did Wave Arts or Metric Halo. The existing developers ADAPTED.

none of the software that you've mentioned comes anywhere close to the complexity of one of the software projects that NI is running.. not even close...

But, i digress, and agree that NI is having the same problems that plague larger software companies (relative to audio software)... bloatware.. plain and simple.. really, extremely large codebase... complexity, beaurocracy, bottom lines, shareholders... yadda yadda.. i'm sure none of these problems plague the software houses that you mentioned...

Again, i'm not taking NI's side... i'm just pointing out that all this should have been expected when you made the purchase, and you AdamJay, made a conscious decision, that you're obviously aware of, which you're also comfortable with, by your own admission...

i'd rather be frustrated with the "really fucking fast portable Mac and not that much software" limitation than the "really fucking slow portable Mac and a bunch of NI stuff that i can barely run" limitation.

and are willing to deal with...

either way, i guess frustrations breed creativity.

Posted: **Wed May 03, 2006 11:16 am**

kinks think of the majority of people who bought macbook pros dont say a word.

its the internet, everyone who wants to say something can be heard.

the macbook has three kinks. whine issue, occasional heat issue (which many non macbook pro owners have as well) and CPU limitation issue (which only truly bothers power hungry individuals).

besides those minor details i love my machine. on daily use i notice none of those problems. if i'm in the library i use the widget trick, by time i need the power for all my plug ins ableton live will prob be initiated for 2 cores, and if i'm charging my laptop on my lap then sure, its hot.

thats all.

edit: NI prob just needs to hire a more work horses

Posted: **Wed May 03, 2006 1:19 pm**

Digi V wrote:the macbook has three kinks. whine issue, occasional heat issue (which many non macbook pro owners have as well) and CPU limitation issue (which only truly bothers power hungry individuals).

ahh yes, I knew it was wise to pick up a pimped out Imac instead of the macbook. my portability is not effected in a single way, and I had the change to put towards a machinedrum.

Posted: **Wed May 03, 2006 7:21 pm**

Digi V wrote:
the macbook has three kinks. whine issue, occasional heat issue (which many non macbook pro owners have as well) and CPU limitation issue (which only truly bothers power hungry individuals).

The whining and heat has been ironed out with their new second revision hardware, and the cpu limitation can be hacked- I'm all good here!

Posted: **Wed May 03, 2006 7:42 pm**

Louis wrote:
Digi V wrote:
the macbook has three kinks. whine issue, occasional heat issue (which many non macbook pro owners have as well) and CPU limitation issue (which only truly bothers power hungry individuals).

The whining and heat has been ironed out with their new second revision hardware, and the cpu limitation can be hacked- I'm all good here!

me too. it's the best portable rig I've ever had and it rivals my dual 2.5 G5 studio machine in speed and performance.

Posted: **Wed May 03, 2006 11:55 pm**

I have had my MBP for about a month and it kicks ass. I have no complaints as it does everything as expected and then some.

The only thing I can say is it does run hot when I have a lot going on but other than that I don't feel like I'm beta testing hardware.

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Kontakt 2.1 - Intel Mac Compatible?