A possible solution for the OFF TOPIC clutter!

sweetjesus · Post by **sweetjesus** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 1:57 pm

forge wrote:
Tarekith wrote:The only reason I don't like the OT stuff, is that it buries the genuine Live related questions and topics that much faster. It's certainly easy enough to just ignore the OT treads and not open them, but it makes it that much harder t track down the topics you are trying to watch (and yes, I know about email notifications). I come here for LIVE, not for politics, religion, general immaturity, or name calling.

I can understand why people like the OT stuff, but at the same time, I don't understand the Ableton's insistance that it has to share the same forum with topics that directly apply to their product. A seperate OT forum would serve both people just as easily IMO. People who just want to learn more about Live can do so without the distraction of the increasing numbers of OT threads. And people who want to just chat and share OT viewpoints with other Live users can do so without upsetting the Live types.

It's not like this forum has tons and tons of sub-forums like some websites, so I think one more would really only make EVERYONE happy. No?
actually, if you do a count it's not really the OT that's burying topics

it's that the userbase has steadly increased with every release

the percentage of OT is still alot less than live/music/tech

topics get buried because alot of people post
the "view posts since last vist" thing is a good solution, you dont miss much and when you see that big list you dont bother clicking on the shit you cant be arsed with

personally i dont care

but i thought the filter system would be a good way to address the issue for those who care without having to modify the forum schema.

but yeah i think just a combination of Offtopic, stupidly quick post counts... etc have a cumulative effect.

the answers most new people are looking for have been answered a billion times and nobody references the wiki directly and theres no sticky and no sticky wiki.

The music forum gets fuck-all responses compared to 1) responses music used to get before and 2) compared to the odd song which pops up into the general forum...

Angstrom · Post by **Angstrom** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 2:05 pm

there are a few PHPbb mods that are useful, also they arent a PITA to install if you use the special mod installer thing.(Easy Mod)

http://www.phpbb.com/phpBB/catdb.php?cat=26

although, the easiest method would be to add a few word replacements into what is generally thought of as the 'swear filter'.

A few suggestions

Democrats => Breakbeat technicians
Republicans =>Reverb abusers
Peak Oil => Drum Sound
Religion => the perfect beat
Congress => dancefloor

resulting in marvelous topics such as

"When the Breakbeat technicians regain the dancefloor from the Reverb abusers this Drum sound myth will be exposed for what it is and the mighty US of A will no longer be driven by the perfect beat crusade"

problem solved.

b0unce · Post by **b0unce** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 2:06 pm

forge · Post by **forge** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 2:26 pm

Angstrom wrote:there are a few PHPbb mods that are useful, also they arent a PITA to install if you use the special mod installer thing.(Easy Mod)

http://www.phpbb.com/phpBB/catdb.php?cat=26

although, the easiest method would be to add a few word replacements into what is generally thought of as the 'swear filter'.

A few suggestions

Democrats => Breakbeat technicians
Republicans =>Reverb abusers
Peak Oil => Drum Sound
Religion => the perfect beat
Congress => dancefloor

resulting in marvelous topics such as

"When the Breakbeat technicians regain the dancefloor from the Reverb abusers this Drum sound myth will be exposed for what it is and the mighty US of A will no longer be driven by the perfect beat crusade"

problem solved.

HA!

and there it is!

forge · Post by **forge** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 2:28 pm

Angstrom wrote:there are a few PHPbb mods that are useful, also they arent a PITA to install if you use the special mod installer thing.(Easy Mod)

http://www.phpbb.com/phpBB/catdb.php?cat=26

although, the easiest method would be to add a few word replacements into what is generally thought of as the 'swear filter'.

A few suggestions

Democrats => Breakbeat technicians
Republicans =>Reverb abusers
Peak Oil => Drum Sound
Religion => the perfect beat
Congress => dancefloor

resulting in marvelous topics such as

"When the Breakbeat technicians regain the dancefloor from the Reverb abusers this Drum sound myth will be exposed for what it is and the mighty US of A will no longer be driven by the perfect beat crusade"

problem solved.

HA! and there it is, problem solved!

gafferuk · Post by **gafferuk** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 2:30 pm

It seems to me that it's plain obvious, people want a split.

b0unce · Post by **b0unce** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 2:43 pm

funnily enough, its the guys who enjoy the OT BS most of all who dont want it split, selfish bastards. I dont buy the 'ableton cant do it because..' excuses for a second.

hoffman2k · Post by **hoffman2k** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 3:22 pm

Had a look at this section of the site lately? http://www.ableton.com/jobs

They're hiring about 50 people. They're literally doubling their capacity.
Keep in mind that there are currently about 50 people employed by Ableton.

They're seriously undermanned.
Notice how many of those jobs are web related....

It's not because there are 10 threads asking for the same thing, that it actually will happen. Case and point: the feature requests...

Ableton is notoriously slow in dealing with things that are not directly related to the current version of Live they're working on.

The "post your music" thread got to 50 pages, before they even talked about adding a link your music section.
They talked about it in november 2005 and the section was added in march 2006...

forge · Post by **forge** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 3:29 pm

hoffman2k wrote:Had a look at this section of the site lately? http://www.ableton.com/jobs

They're hiring about 50 people. They're literally doubling their capacity.
Keep in mind that there are currently about 50 people employed by Ableton.

They're seriously undermanned.
Notice how many of those jobs are web related....

It's not because there are 10 threads asking for the same thing, that it actually will happen. Case and point: the feature requests...

Ableton is notoriously slow in dealing with things that are not directly related to the current version of Live they're working on.

The "post your music" thread got to 50 pages, before they even talked about adding a link your music section.
They talked about it in november 2005 and the section was added in march 2006...

are you sure that jobs page has been updated recently?

b0unce · Post by **b0unce** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 3:42 pm

how many man hours does it take to add another section in the forum index ?

1000 ? 100 ? 50 ? 30 ? 10 ? 5 ? 3 ? 2 ? 1 ? 15 minutes ?

how many man hours does it take to give a volunteer or two the moderator powers to move threads from section to section ?

sqook · Post by **sqook** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 3:44 pm

Angstrom wrote:there are a few PHPbb mods that are useful, also they arent a PITA to install if you use the special mod installer thing.(Easy Mod)

http://www.phpbb.com/phpBB/catdb.php?cat=26

although, the easiest method would be to add a few word replacements into what is generally thought of as the 'swear filter'.

A few suggestions

Democrats => Breakbeat technicians
Republicans =>Reverb abusers
Peak Oil => Drum Sound
Religion => the perfect beat
Congress => dancefloor

resulting in marvelous topics such as

"When the Breakbeat technicians regain the dancefloor from the Reverb abusers this Drum sound myth will be exposed for what it is and the mighty US of A will no longer be driven by the perfect beat crusade"

problem solved.

+1

However, I'd like to add "9/11" to your list, with the replacement text of "Live 6". "Sasha" should be also be replaced by "Bush", and vice-versa.

leisuremuffin · Post by **leisuremuffin** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 3:53 pm

b0unce wrote:
how many man hours does it take to give a volunteer or two the moderator powers to move threads from section to section ?

how many man hours does it take to deal with the ensuing drama....

.lm.

hoffman2k · Post by **hoffman2k** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 3:57 pm

b0unce wrote:how many man hours does it take to add another section in the forum index ?

1000 ? 100 ? 50 ? 30 ? 10 ? 5 ? 3 ? 2 ? 1 ? 15 minutes ?

how many man hours does it take to give a volunteer or two the moderator powers to move threads from section to section ?

How many man hours does it take to convince Bernd and Gerhard?

It's not how long it takes to do...
It's what the main dudes at Ableton think about it that counts.
Their decisions is not something they make lightly (unless when it comes to removing buttons and functions from Live. they seem to be pretty quick with that)

And moving threads around will just make this into another ALDJ.com, where the moderator is the main dude that decides what goes and what not.
Then there will be a problem with how it is moderated or why it is moderated.

Like it or not. this is still the best Live forum around.

Some examples:

http://www.ableton-live-fans.com/forum/
This site has too many sections to make it even attractive to use the forum

http://sonictransfer.com/forums/ableton ... um-f2.html
This one just sucks in general...

http://community.sonikmatter.com/forums ... owforum=65
In this one, you never get any replies.

http://www.bigbluelounge.com/forums/viewforum.php?f=27
The best place for mac users. It's funny how rare a mac vs pc thread is in there

KVR requires you to be registered to just read the thing (sometimes

)

And then there's http://www.abletonlivedj.com/forum/
Probably the second best Live forum if it weren't for the moderation.

b0unce · Post by **b0unce** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 4:05 pm

hoffman2k wrote: How many man hours does it take to convince Bernd and Gerhard?

It's not how long it takes to do...
It's what the main dudes at Ableton think about it that counts.
Their decisions is not something they make lightly (unless when it comes to removing buttons and functions from Live. they seem to be pretty quick with that)

OK then, thats a step in the right direction. So its not that its technically challenging, so that excuse we can now toss out the window. Its that the head boys need to be convinced, well then - if thats all it takes - lets go on and on about how we would like an Off-the-topic-of-music section, to improve the noise/signal ratio in here - the proposed General-music/performance section.

hoffman2k wrote: And moving threads around will just make this into another ALDJ.com, where the moderator is the main dude that decides what goes and what not.
Then there will be a problem with how it is moderated or why it is moderated.

a thread thats in no way music related gets tossed into the Off-the-topic-of-music section, not censoring or banning....just a little organisation, I dunno what the moderation practise is like over at ALDJ so i cant comment further than that. - but it should be pretty simple & straight forward.

Is it about music/performance ?
YES-leave it
NO-move it

I dont think anyones gonna get pissed off cos their thread was moved, its not like anyone is being censored - just organised

forge · Post by **forge** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 4:10 pm

b0unce wrote:
hoffman2k wrote: How many man hours does it take to convince Bernd and Gerhard?

It's not how long it takes to do...
It's what the main dudes at Ableton think about it that counts.
Their decisions is not something they make lightly (unless when it comes to removing buttons and functions from Live. they seem to be pretty quick with that)
OK then, thats a step in the right direction. So its not that its technically challenging, so that excuse we can now toss out the window. Its that the head boys need to be convinced, well then - if thats all it takes - lets go on and on about how we would like an Off-the-topic-of-music section, to improve the noise/signal ratio in here - the proposed General-music/performance section.

hoffman2k wrote: And moving threads around will just make this into another ALDJ.com, where the moderator is the main dude that decides what goes and what not.
Then there will be a problem with how it is moderated or why it is moderated.
a thread thats in no way music related gets tossed into the Off-the-topic-of-music section, not censoring or banning....just a little organisation, I dunno what the moderation practise is like over at ALDJ so i cant comment further than that. - but it should be pretty simple & straight forward.

Is it about music/performance ?
YES-leave it
NO-move it

I dont think anyones gonna get pissed off cos their thread was moved, its not like anyone is being censored - just organised

thing is, if ther was an OT section I would never go there, and I like getting occasionalyl drawn in

although I use the "view posts since last vist" so they'd still show up

so I guess it doesnt really matter to me