Future Live 4 Mac users who want more beef/cpu just buy a PC

forge · Post by **forge** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 1:32 am

FaX-0-Matic wrote: That said though I'm tracking down an older Powermac OS9 compliant to run metasynth ,metatrack and Xx on.
May as well get the best of both worlds IMHO ...........

ah well then you want the pismo. King of the powerbooks.

can anyone please enlighten me what the fuck is a Pismo?? Wall street I can kind of handle, but Pismo sounds like a fraggle. I somehow doubt that Apple would name their computers after Jim Henson characters unless stev Jobs finally lost it and went for the under 7s market, for 2 and a half grand a pop. That's alot a lunch money.

prinzali · Post by **prinzali** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 2:15 am

Mbazzy wrote:ClaudeK, I really would like you to show me the factorynew PC Laptop that for the price of an Ibook 1 ghz 12' + an extra 512 mb ram = 768Mb Ram [Not bought from APple Store of course ] , that gives you comparable functionality for Audio .[ +/-1120 Euro/$ ], dedicated video memory, 2xUSB, 1x Firewire, S-video out, ...

Never mind the HD speed that's just good for OS and applications, we need an external FW @ 7200 rpm anyhow.

Don't think it is THAT easy ... maybe secon dhand

Hey

To start with im actually looking to get a 12" PB, so im not anti mac at all; but anyway hold your horses. In Denmark, you can easyly get a PC Laptop for that prize with the ports you specify. This is just a quick one..
http://www.edbpriser.dk/Listprices.asp?ID=40647
(Its in Danish text but you can read the specs.)
1.000 Euro = 7.500 DKK

And everyware you go, you can get new ones on sale, for a fair prize. I cant say anything about the actual qualety of the laptop in the link above, but lets not kid ourselves. They are cheap and fast.

Im not Troling around, but maby we should look at other things then raw power and how many VSTi we can run at the same time.

Thouse who say, "get a PC laptop, more bang for the buch". well that can be true but from what i have experianced with a old laptop i used in a computerclass, tings like heat, and noize are big issues. The computer is not comfordble to work with when its too hot and it can lead to crash. I havent had a mac but i have tryed the OSX on a 17" out at a friends house, and he is realy happy with his setup, no noize and no heat problem. I think thats one of the top 5 aguments. Many PC laptops are made in a low qualety case, and cant realy stand the transport in a bag. The mac's are made in a way to save space, the display is mounted in a way that when its closed its thiner, things like that. Stabelety is not realy an issue with XP being so stable.

Shure you can get a top of the line PC laptop, like one from Dell, but they are expensive, so your right Mbazzy that would be more expensive, but if you just want raw power in a laptop you can get one at lower prizes the mac's.
---

So Lets make a top 5 list

Why get a PC, Why get a mac.

id start with
Mac
* No Heat and noize problem (what i have been told bt my friend)
* 12" display option, small & lightwait

PC
* Cheaper

Hope this has been contructive
Pleace exuse my spelling, im Danish

Regards
-André

Kodama · Post by **Kodama** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 2:44 am

It's because my iBook begins to drag just launching Reason and Live and running a few instruments.

I'm not like gamers that want 100fps they will never see or engineers that want 192khz they will never hear, I really get the too slow messages when trying to do stuff.

The reverb takes ~25% of my CPU just launching, so I thought it would be a good start. Now, like I said I'm thinking part of problem is the Live port (especially the reverb) that has issues.

I tested Reason itself, and it was 2x the speed, which is more in line with what you'd expect from 2x the clock.

Not to forget that extra cpu over what I need means I can start thinking of my computer as a real time low latencey fx processor at the same time.

::i'm sorry, not pickin on you in particular... at all... but these threads :about which is better are giving me the shizizinits... really dude, when are you gonna use 28 reverbs on a track??!??

i know... just a test... rar rar... but really...

Winterpark · Post by **Winterpark** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 6:09 am

Kodama wrote: I'm not like gamers that want 100fps they will never see or engineers that want 192khz they will never hear, I really get the too slow messages when trying to do stuff.

The reverb takes ~25% of my CPU just launching, so I thought it would be a good start. Now, like I said I'm thinking part of problem is the Live port (especially the reverb) that has issues.

I tested Reason itself, and it was 2x the speed, which is more in line with what you'd expect from 2x the clock.

Not to forget that extra cpu over what I need means I can start thinking of my computer as a real time low latencey fx processor at the same time.

ok, point taken... I too, can't wait to see what live 4's mac optimizing is gonna do for my G3 ibook...

regards,
-am

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 7:40 am

am wrote:ok, point taken... I too, can't wait to see what live 4's mac optimizing is gonna do for my G3 ibook...

Nothing, really. The optimizations are almost certainly going to be Altivec-specific, and that doesn't help G3 users a bit.

Winterpark · Post by **Winterpark** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 7:43 am

actually, no they're not... read this.

http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=8283

Mbazzy · Post by **Mbazzy** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 7:43 am

Prinzali [a.o.] : indeed if the laptop you're choosing is your sole DAW and you want to maximize the sheer raw CPU power , a laptop PC currently is the best buy . But as you said yourself a decent spec'd PC laptop will set you back an equally decent amount of money.

If personnally I had to invest eg. 2000-2500 Euro in total for a complete new setup from the ground up [an amount that comes close to a topend PC laptop with all necessary audio bells and wistles ] , I'd still choose a desktop PC system for in the studio [ that's where you need the raw power but besides that I think that a conventional desktop setup is also better for ergonomics - between 1000-1400 Euro/$ you can get yourself a very decent spec'd desktopPC] and the ibook for on the road ... the best of both worlds ...

But OK, everyone's needs may vary ... but just don't allow you to be carried away by a lot of hype [ on both sides ] ...

The important thing is to decide for yourself what your needs are ...

claudek · Post by **claudek** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 7:52 am

I have a Mac laptop Ibook and a custom built PC for studio. The Pc ran me about 700E. I had a friend make it..Asnus MB and P4 2.8Ghz and gig ram and 80 GB HD. No cd or extras..just a firewire PCI card.
It all runs great..To get this power from a Mac I'd be needed in g5 territory. I'm over the PC/ Mac war days and simply find best tools to make my workflow easier. Macs are good computers, but once I tried the PC it is not bad either just better for running more apps, plugs etc..
I simply like both..
I'd prefer a G5 anyway! but simply can't afford it..nor a BMW to go with my Ipod.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 7:56 am

am wrote:actually, no they're not... read this.

Oh... My bad.

I stand corrected.

Mbazzy · Post by **Mbazzy** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 7:59 am

Claudek :

Apparently we are on the same side of the fence ... nice to have this kind of "confirmation" ...

prinzali · Post by **prinzali** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 10:29 am

Mbazzy wrote:Claudek : Apparently we are on the same side of the fence ... nice to have this kind of "confirmation" ...

Hey Mbazzy
Why do you think lots of live proformers use mac's?
Not trying to make a point, just a plane question..

Hype?
looking good?

Regards
-André

Mbazzy · Post by **Mbazzy** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 10:46 am

Think that a lot has to do with "tradition" and the fact that audio was some years ago almost the exclusive playground of the mac ... Many artists also come out of the graphic sector where mac is better established [or used to be ]

Also in between all this hype,have you also noticed that many/most of the people who REALLY perform and/or have actualy music out on labels etc mostly do not have those hi spec'd machines everyone is "needing" ...
[be it PC/Mac ] ...

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 10:57 am

Mbazzy wrote:Also in between all this hype,have you also noticed that many/most of the people who REALLY perform and/or have actualy music out on labels etc mostly do not have those hi spec'd machines everyone is "needing" ...
[be it PC/Mac ] ...

Exactly my thoughts. To me it seems that this whole "I need the fastest possible machine to make music" is just a continuation of the old tradition of musicians blaming their gear for the state of their music. That also explains why I rarely see any real pros complaining about their slow computers. They just happily continue making great music with their "oh so slow" 2 - 3 year old G4's.

prinzali · Post by **prinzali** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 11:03 am

Mbazzy wrote: Also in between all this hype,have you also noticed that many/most of the people who REALLY perform and/or have actualy music out on labels etc mostly do not have those hi spec'd machines everyone is "needing" ...
[be it PC/Mac ] ...

That may be true, i havent looked at the actual power of the computers they use, but it sound reasonoble.

The folks who favor PC's tend to only talk about raw power and prize,
folks who favor Mac's seam to have other prioretyes.

Regards
-André

claudek · Post by **claudek** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 11:14 am

I kind of have to agree that power is not needed to make good music.
In fact most of the best records are made with a simple setup and using your head..An Ibook could make a complete hit album if your mind is ready!

I sometimes go back to my ibook just to keep more focussed as on the PC I have too much on the menu to choose from..