Ableton Forum

I think that answered UKRuss's question.. can we go back to the original question? It was really getting interesting with C.S.'s and michaellpenman's posts! Want more .

By the way.. marvotron posted this 808 emulation at KVR: http://relivethefuture.com/music/patche ... 8-v0.7.zip

forge wrote:yeah the only reason is tweakability

if you want more real or recognisable drums you are probably far better off using samples - you can still do a hell of a lot to them with Si/ampler

I think everyone knows about drum samples.

why bother? two reasons:
- a purely academic study of Operator to train my ears and hands
- the joy of using something you made from scratch


some cool tips, thanks!! can't wait to try them later.

I'll post my synthetic operator kit tonight. For those interested I made some Live packs of my kits that are fun to mangle.
http://www.rhythminmind.net/drumsamples.html

Check out the inside synthesis videos if you have a chance:

http://insidesynthesis.blogspot.com/ (also on SonicState)

Episode 4 is specific to FM synths like Operator, but in Episode 1 he builds a drum machine patch using an MS-2000, and the methods can be almost directly applied to Operator with a little tweaking.

Ideally the not-yet-made Episode 5 should be exactly what you're looking for.

this thread is good for a link. thanks guys!

OK, well for anyone unfamiliar with the Sound on Sound "synth Secrets" articles ...


Practical bass drum synthesis
Practical percussion synthesis
practical snare drum synthesis
Practical Cymbal Synthesis
Analysing Metallic Percussion

there are many, many more in the series.

Tone Deft wrote:

forge wrote:yeah the only reason is tweakability

if you want more real or recognisable drums you are probably far better off using samples - you can still do a hell of a lot to them with Si/ampler

I think everyone knows about drum samples.

why bother? two reasons:
- a purely academic study of Operator to train my ears and hands
- the joy of using something you made from scratch


some cool tips, thanks!! can't wait to try them later.

I dont know how you got 'dont bother' from that - I use Operator for drums, I was saying it depends on what are you wanting to create - what types of drum sounds? Different things work better for different jobs

If you want cymbals, unless you really want a really synthetic sounding one then you are probably better with samples - that;s why the 909 uses sampled cymbals, because inharmonic sounds are really hard to synthesise

the 808 used 6 oscillators playing pulse waves with some kindof clever circuitry and band pass filters and a high pass to make it's cymbal, but that one still sounds synthetic - but again, like I said, that might be what you want

Toob wrote:I think that answered UKRuss's question.. can we go back to the original question? It was really getting interesting with C.S.'s and michaellpenman's posts! Want more .

By the way.. marvotron posted this 808 emulation at KVR: http://relivethefuture.com/music/patche ... 8-v0.7.zip

well done that man! Good job

again - notice the absense of cymbal! [edit: just looked more closely at the Hi-Hat - he used 6 oscillators!! so there ya go!]

take a look at the clap - that;s an interesting one

if you look at the waveform in the 'drum machines' bundle at the clap the attack has about 4 peaks - claps have this kind of flamming attack - called 'roll in' in marvotron's kit - he's used an arpeggiator to create it - I've used a simple delay before set to 'time' and with the delay time around 20ms

here's a good article by Craig Anderton

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/document ... c=3SOSWXXA

Toob wrote:Nice topic! I'm trying to master Operator myself. You could read Live's lessons about Operator as well.

And that is really cool C.S. and Michaell!!!

dont mean to hijack but...

where/how do i read these lessons?? been looking for them all over and http://www.ableton.com/pages/instrument ... to_operate <---page doesnt provide links...did i miss something in the demo install?

Tytus wrote:

Toob wrote:Nice topic! I'm trying to master Operator myself. You could read Live's lessons about Operator as well.

And that is really cool C.S. and Michaell!!!

dont mean to hijack but...

where/how do i read these lessons?? been looking for them all over and http://www.ableton.com/pages/instrument ... to_operate <---page doesnt provide links...did i miss something in the demo install?

in the help menu in Live

forge wrote:I dont know how you got 'dont bother' from that

<insert 'the internet is a lousy form of communication' comment>
I shouldn't have phrased my question with the word 'bother' it links it too strongly to your post.


cool tips, thanks to you!!

forge wrote:

Tytus wrote:

Toob wrote:Nice topic! I'm trying to master Operator myself. You could read Live's lessons about Operator as well.

And that is really cool C.S. and Michaell!!!

dont mean to hijack but...

where/how do i read these lessons?? been looking for them all over and http://www.ableton.com/pages/instrument ... to_operate <---page doesnt provide links...did i miss something in the demo install?

in the help menu in Live

That's right!

forge wrote: in the help menu in Live

Sorry...dont see em. Looking in the "all lessons" and "table of contents". no mention of operator. whats the path exactly? i know abes dont make it this hard to find tutorials...

Tytus wrote:

forge wrote: in the help menu in Live

Sorry...dont see em. Looking in the "all lessons" and "table of contents". no mention of operator. whats the path exactly? i know abes dont make it this hard to find tutorials...

In Live 7 go to the lessons, scroll down and click on "More Lessons...". Then you'll see a Table of Contents in which you can scroll down again untill you see the Operator heading. Underneath it there will be 6 short lessons. Have you installed Live and Operator properly?