Ableton Forum

Ok thanks very much for the explaination, but I still don't get it (about the db/dbfs thing, but I knew what clipping is)

When I play commercial songs with foobar I often see the 'Visualisation: Peak Meter' tool going to the maximum/0dbfs. When I render a song with live, that I normalize, I can assure you that it never reaches 0dbfs, and by far. I assume that it just hits the 0db that is displayed by the meters in live.

So what did I get wrong?

EDIT: okay, so live shows dbfs too, that I didn't know. Thanks
But I wonder why my songs don't sound too bad, if I push the volume to +6db?! Wouldn't they sound HORRIBLE and all distorted?

Not neccesarily, the peaks and transients get clipped first, and not everyone can gear that. Definitely not something you want to do though.

Ok, thanks everybody, I understood everything!
(Hum... at least about what I asked in this topic )

My tracks are indeed clipping (but I can't hear it ), and commercial songs too ... a lot (yeah, I know, I'm annoying, always talking about 'commercial', but that's what we're all aiming for, aren't we?)

So I think this topic is more or less closed, I'll read the others to learn how to do a 'real' mastering work.

try this for a 6dB boost... and compare to your method:


1. Add CompressorII to the master track
set threashold to -18dBfs (dB for short, dB is a generic term, like "loudness")
Set the ratio to 3:1
set the attack to 0msec + lookahead
set the makeup gain to +6dB


This will boost the loudness of your track +6dB, but instead of clipping everything that was originally between 0dB and -6dB,
it'll squeeze everything that was originally inbetween -18dB to 0dB.


Squeezing is much softer on the ears than Clipping.
both methods will peak at 0dB.
And the average volume should still be +6dB louder in both cases.


Post-note: you say your +6dB clipped sound files sound OK. That's entirely possible! perhaps you have a single instrument that has very transient peak volumes. Something percussive, like a snare, lets say, is going above 0dB for 10 msec, lets say. Well, adding noise to a snare is not going to be very audible.... its already noisy! And 10msec of noise is a pretty short amount of time. Bottom-line: clipping is not a problem in this scenerio.

Try this: record yourself singing. Normalize, then boost +6dB, render again. I can almopst gaurantee you will hear the "bad noise" in this file.

laird wrote:try this for a 6dB boost... and compare to your method:


1. Add CompressorII to the master track
set threashold to -18dBfs (dB for short, dB is a generic term, like "loudness")
Set the ratio to 3:1
set the attack to 0msec + lookahead
set the makeup gain to +6dB


This will boost the loudness of your track +6dB, but instead of clipping everything that was originally between 0dB and -6dB,
it'll squeeze everything that was originally inbetween -18dB to 0dB.


Squeezing is much softer on the ears than Clipping.
both methods will peak at 0dB.
And the average volume should still be +6dB louder in both cases.


Post-note: you say your +6dB clipped sound files sound OK. That's entirely possible! perhaps you have a single instrument that has very transient peak volumes. Something percussive, like a snare, lets say, is going above 0dB for 10 msec, lets say. Well, adding noise to a snare is not going to be very audible.... its already noisy! And 10msec of noise is a pretty short amount of time. Bottom-line: clipping is not a problem in this scenerio.

Try this: record yourself singing. Normalize, then boost +6dB, render again. I can almopst gaurantee you will hear the "bad noise" in this file.

Wow thanks a lot, that's great, I really need to learn how to use (well) compressors/limiters!

About the PS, yeah, that's why I had some issues with saxophone and voice on some tracks, I understand now, thanks.