Ableton Forum

the issue began happening on a brand new windows 10 laptop with no fancy anything installed, no external devices, very bare bones in terms of installed software. the issue does not happen in ableton 9.2.3 and earlier, but does happen in every build of ableton since. this clearly indicates that the problem was introduced in ableton 9.5.

Are you using Max For Live?

that is a very good question. i am. i will try uninstalling it next time i feel the courage to waste an afternoon dealing with an ableton newer than 9.2.3.

I imagine you can test it without uninstalling. Just try creating a set without Max devices.

oh! my set doesn't use any, but i do have it installed. the simplest-repro problem set is just 2 tracks, each with a long sample (2 hours or so) with some edits in the arrangement mode.

lunch wrote:the issue began happening on a brand new windows 10 laptop with no fancy anything installed, no external devices, very bare bones in terms of installed software. the issue does not happen in ableton 9.2.3 and earlier, but does happen in every build of ableton since. this clearly indicates that the problem was introduced in ableton 9.5.

Fair enough, but if this issue does not happen on every 9.5/9.6 box then the problem is not general, but unique in some respect to your box, your setup or similar. Why not find out for yourself if it's your machine or not?

of course it does not happen on every machine. that does not mean that it is not a bug in ableton that needs to be addressed. the machine in question works fine with ableton 9.2.3 and earlier. anything newer is a hangfest. ableton has a bug that needs to be found. i was trying to help them find it, but they have proven to be uninterested in improving the stability of their software. which is unfortunate.

lunch wrote:of course it does not happen on every machine. that does not mean that it is not a bug in ableton that needs to be addressed. the machine in question works fine with ableton 9.2.3 and earlier. anything newer is a hangfest. ableton has a bug that needs to be found. i was trying to help them find it, but they have proven to be uninterested in improving the stability of their software. which is unfortunate.

Yes, it is. But it sounds to me something is missing from your account for this. Maybe you gave them too little info to be able to repeat this or third party software seemed to be involved. I had just that conclusion made for a report I made the other day, that I also sent to the third party developer.

I repeat that if "this issue does not happen on every 9.5/9.6 box then the problem is not general, but unique in some respect to your box, your setup or similar".

If this is true this means that there's a clear possibility that Live isn't involved and that the reason can be found. I know you think the fact the old version 9.2 doesn't display this issue must mean it's Live, but this is not necessarily true as a new version of Live could make a bug in other software active, even if the bug doesn't reside with the Live code. So what I'm saying is it could be either piece of software including Live or an interaction. It could be that the configuration simply needs to be changed or that the settings have gone corrupt.

You likely need to conduct the regular exclusion methodology, which is a PITA, but has been proven works since decades.
I've had to reinstall everything twice in the last three years to solve problems like yours. Multiple times it turned up the issue was not with Live but with hardware or third party software that needed updating or reconfiguration.

I've had reports getting ignored, for the beta especially, but commonly I get good responses and things happen and the issues even get fixed (not all). Intermittent issues remain very hard to fix for any developer. That's one reason I suggested just now to Ableton to please make a special build or some feature that allows you to get more info on what's going when you have a specific problem, a debug version or that they make it an option to get improved logging as well as letting us users get more info from the status and crash reports we make when sending in bugs and other issues.

It's typically easier for users to know what to investigate and deeper user knowledge would likely lead to better reports and prevent a few too.

there is no third party software involved. no effects in use, you've seen the set yourself. doesn't matter which audio driver i select. no external plugins installed, no other programs running, asus ux350ca, windows 10.

ableton live 9.5 - beta 9.6b4 32 and 64 bit all hang permanently trying to open the very simple set in question. 9.2.3 and previous do not.

lunch wrote: you've seen the set yourself.

I don't believe I have. It could be a good idea to let others make an attempt with it or if you have access to other machines and get your project opened in Live 9.6 in different versions of Windows. If this specific set opens on other machines you must conclude it's something with your machine and act accordingly. Either way that's valuable information for you.

As a sidebar I have a graphical problem equally as rare as yours would seem to be that has been going on for more than a year and that up to recently happens once with every new version of Live and is only fixed by restarting Live. I've encountered this on 2 machines and after at least 3 clean major OS installations. Needless to say It's very hard to reproduce even for me. So it's not that I'm not sympathetic to what you're going trough.

Stromkraft wrote:
Just adding that I tried this project of lunch's originating from Live 8 and it opens no problem in OS X 10.9.5 into Live 9.5 64bit and into Live 9.5.1b6 32bit with no missing files, but in Windows 7 it crashes Live 9.1.8 (couldn't try 9.5 at the moment) at buffering samples. Possibly then this particular problem is one on the Windows platform and is not specific to Live 9.5.

^ Posted: Thu Dec 24, 2015 2:02 am

lunch wrote:

Stromkraft wrote:
Just adding that I tried this project of lunch's originating from Live 8 and it opens no problem in OS X 10.9.5 into Live 9.5 64bit and into Live 9.5.1b6 32bit with no missing files, but in Windows 7 it crashes Live 9.1.8 (couldn't try 9.5 at the moment) at buffering samples. Possibly then this particular problem is one on the Windows platform and is not specific to Live 9.5.

^ Posted: Thu Dec 24, 2015 2:02 am

Oh, this is the same one? OK, I forgot. Just tested and posted. Anyone else on Windows have tested this?

I'm suspecting an OS X bug for the issue of mine that I mentioned. Is there any way you could determine with the help of Ableton whether this is either a Windows bug or a problem in the Live version for Windows? Did you mention to support this crashes also on other Windows machines? My Windows installation of Live 9.1 is just a demo now I think, but it should open projects. I'd report this again to Ableton with new data.

Did you ever try creating another project and importing all tracks to it? Or you did try and you got the crash when importing tracks? You'd lose the return tracks unfortunately.

On 9.6.1b1 still crashing most times when loading another project.
Thats kind of annoying. The first set contains dubmachines, autobeat, omnisphere 2, stylus rmx

The second one a jBridged Hurdy Gurdy, Shevvannai via Kontakplayer, Omni2 again, stylus rmx

how can we know which plugins could cause the trouble ? 9.2 was more stable when switching between sets.

do have to demand a analysis-tool for crashcausing pluggins ?

Tagor wrote:On 9.6.1b1

You do know that the current beta is 9.6.1b4, right? Just let it update. Or did you just miss the beta auto-updates? As far as I'm concerned it's unacceptable that Live should crash when loading a set unless it's a problem within the set. Ableton should uphold that standard.

Yes i know there is 9.6.1.b4
but i only got the beta because Live 9.6 was already buggy.

so can we autopdate without loosing the controller-scripts ?
some custom scales and colour-tweaks in the pushbase will not be lost, or do ih have to backup/reimplement them?

**EVEN THERE IS NO AUTOUPDATE RUNNING WHEN I START Live 9 beta with internet-connection