[OT] Any vegans here?

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arctic ranger
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Post by arctic ranger » Sat Oct 14, 2006 11:43 pm

sqook wrote:
err_eur wrote:number one, the reason I use larger font size is because I this small font is simply bad for your eyes to look at constantly. I get headaches reading this stuff.
(Annoyingly large font size tag removed :) )

If small fonts annoy you (which I can definitely understand), then please go to the preferences of your web browser, and change the default font to 14-point-blue-something. My mother can email you with further instructions on this if you require them. This way, you can read everybody's posts in big-ass-readable-blue, instead of just yours. And in the end, everybody wins. :) Oh, and btw, for pages like ableton's which use a custom stylesheet which would override this, you can make your own CSS stylesheet and make your browser use it instead.


As far as the discussion at hand goes, I've been veggie for 10+ years, and am healthy and doing great. I've tread the vegan thing twice, and although I sympathize with its philosophy, I think that it is frankly a bit impractical given the nature of our society. Sadly, our civilization has been based on animal biproducts for thousands of years, and this is unlikely to change anytime soon.

However, what really blows my mind is how upset people can get about other people's eating preferences. Getting upset about someone smoking next to you is one thing, but eating a cheeseburger? Or, for that matter, a tofu burger? C'mon people... there are more important issues in the world that concern us at the moment.

+1
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err_eur
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Re: love-alopes

Post by err_eur » Sun Oct 15, 2006 12:06 am

Welkin wrote:ERR_EUR! http://www.bumsteer.com/buyonline.htm

thought you might be interested.

sorry I couldn't resist .. you just take your self too seriously...
you're on the verge of sounding like some psychotic religious fanatic.
blah blah blah
peace

FUCK YOU!
arctic ranger wrote:
sqook wrote:
err_eur wrote:number one, the reason I use larger font size is because I this small font is simply bad for your eyes to look at constantly. I get headaches reading this stuff.
(Annoyingly large font size tag removed :) )

If small fonts annoy you (which I can definitely understand), then please go to the preferences of your web browser, and change the default font to 14-point-blue-something. My mother can email you with further instructions on this if you require th

If I feel like using big text
that's what I am going to do. It's there as an option, so I use it, in an expressive way, like in instances when I would be screaming in someone's face.
I do my own thing, sorry, I am not interested in conforming to the "accepted" font size in order to have a bunch of fake internet friends,

I don't care about your rationalizations or justifications, there is a world of difference between vegeatbles and meat, and yes, I did live on a fruit and nut diet for some time......which is accepted as being as close to karma free as one can get. Your stupid pro-carnivore arguments are pointless and redundant,

and yes i do consider people that eat meat the enemies of the spiritual evolution of the human race and the planet as a whole. The problems of the world all start with man's propensity for the consumption of animal flesh.



the fact of the matter is, soemone started this thread asking about the advantages of a vegan diet from any vegans who might be reading these forums, then a bunch of DICKHEADS come in with their anti-vegan bullshit trying to force THEIR opinions on her and anyone who is vegan/vegetarian.....

but because I express passion, you say I'm the one starting shit, and come to try to shut me up. Go read the beginning of the thread, MORONS. Who is the asshole trying to shove their shit down someone's throats? I am so sick of these types of neanderthals, i have to deal with people like this EVERY DAY, and yes I hate the mentality behind it. It pisses me off to no end.




and if you are annoyed with people debating this subject than DON'T READ THE DAMN THREAD. No one is forcing you to.........

b0unce
Posts: 5379
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Re: love-alopes

Post by b0unce » Sun Oct 15, 2006 12:40 am

err_eur wrote:
Welkin wrote:ERR_EUR! http://www.bumsteer.com/buyonline.htm

thought you might be interested.

sorry I couldn't resist .. you just take your self too seriously...
you're on the verge of sounding like some psychotic religious fanatic.
blah blah blah
peace

FUCK YOU!
arctic ranger wrote:
sqook wrote: (Annoyingly large font size tag removed :) )

If small fonts annoy you (which I can definitely understand), then please go to the preferences of your web browser, and change the default font to 14-point-blue-something. My mother can email you with further instructions on this if you require th

If I feel like using big text
that's what I am going to do. It's there as an option, so I use it, in an expressive way, like in instances when I would be screaming in someone's face.
I do my own thing, sorry, I am not interested in conforming to the "accepted" font size in order to have a bunch of fake internet friends,

I don't care about your rationalizations or justifications, there is a world of difference between vegeatbles and meat, and yes, I did live on a fruit and nut diet for some time......which is accepted as being as close to karma free as one can get. Your stupid pro-carnivore arguments are pointless and redundant,

and yes i do consider people that eat meat the enemies of the spiritual evolution of the human race and the planet as a whole. The problems of the world all start with man's propensity for the consumption of animal flesh.



the fact of the matter is, soemone started this thread asking about the advantages of a vegan diet from any vegans who might be reading these forums, then a bunch of DICKHEADS come in with their anti-vegan bullshit trying to force THEIR opinions on her and anyone who is vegan/vegetarian.....

but because I express passion, you say I'm the one starting shit, and come to try to shut me up. Go read the beginning of the thread, MORONS. Who is the asshole trying to shove their shit down someone's throats? I am so sick of these types of neanderthals, i have to deal with people like this EVERY DAY, and yes I hate the mentality behind it. It pisses me off to no end.




and if you are annoyed with people debating this subject than DON'T READ THE DAMN THREAD. No one is forcing you to.........
:lol:
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rajcoont
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Post by rajcoont » Sun Oct 15, 2006 12:52 am

lifes too short to be angry about things you can't control. I respect people who are vegetarian/vegan and don't preach; i have no respect for self righteous people worked up into a lather over things that don't affect them personally in any way other than their sensibilities being offended. animal rights activists at the far end of the spectrum are as small minded and worthy of ridicule as their far right anti abortion activists brethren...close minded bitter people enforcing their worldview on the rest of us...you'll never win the battle for hearts and minds, and you hold us all in contempt anyway...like i said, i've been there before, i've met the militant vegans and they are not the sort of people i would care to spend any time for any reason

frankie123
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Post by frankie123 » Sun Oct 15, 2006 1:46 am

Err_eur, I looked at the beginning of the thread. I don't see anybody trying to push meat on anybody?

Conveying anger on the internet won't do you any good, it will only make you look as foolish as if you were conveying anger in person.

Err eur said:
"and yes i do consider people that eat meat the enemies of the spiritual evolution of the human race and the planet as a whole. The problems of the world all start with man's propensity for the consumption of animal flesh. "


You are out of your mind. Have you read dianetics?
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Approach
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Post by Approach » Sun Oct 15, 2006 1:56 am

I was veggie for a bit but then I was seduced by a Mc Chicken. Guess I just suck at life because I don't feel all this mystical circle of life stuff. I'm just a souless SOB who loves his mother and good techno.

and to angry big font vegan guy...LOL

kineticUk
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Re: love-alopes

Post by kineticUk » Sun Oct 15, 2006 2:00 am

err_eur wrote:and if you are annoyed with people debating this subject than DON'T READ THE DAMN THREAD. No one is forcing you to.........
Ok I won't.
Bye Bye
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missjade
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Re: ...

Post by missjade » Sun Oct 15, 2006 5:18 am

It's untrue that milk cows live their entire lives in concrete stalls. I've been to a couple of milk farms in argentina and the US, milk cows usually have it good, they get to spend most of the day grazing.

A lot of propaganda gets thrown around about animals living in cages till death, it is true that a good number of animals are treated like that, but theirs also a good number of animals that aren't treated poorly.[/quote]


well, i was pretty much referring to factory farms but that's good to know that you've seen better conditions. i know in europe they've banned a lot of practices i mentioned which is good.

on a side note, argentina rules.

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Post by missjade » Sun Oct 15, 2006 5:21 am

Approach wrote: I'm just a souless SOB who loves his mother and good techno.
quote of the day
:mrgreen:

sqook
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Re: love-alopes

Post by sqook » Sun Oct 15, 2006 5:29 am

err_eur wrote:
Welkin wrote:ERR_EUR! http://www.bumsteer.com/buyonline.htm

thought you might be interested.

sorry I couldn't resist .. you just take your self too seriously...
you're on the verge of sounding like some psychotic religious fanatic.
blah blah blah
peace

FUCK YOU!
arctic ranger wrote:
sqook wrote: (Annoyingly large font size tag removed :) )

If small fonts annoy you (which I can definitely understand), then please go to the preferences of your web browser, and change the default font to 14-point-blue-something. My mother can email you with further instructions on this if you require th

If I feel like using big text
that's what I am going to do. It's there as an option, so I use it, in an expressive way, like in instances when I would be screaming in someone's face.
I do my own thing, sorry, I am not interested in conforming to the "accepted" font size in order to have a bunch of fake internet friends,

I don't care about your rationalizations or justifications, there is a world of difference between vegeatbles and meat, and yes, I did live on a fruit and nut diet for some time......which is accepted as being as close to karma free as one can get. Your stupid pro-carnivore arguments are pointless and redundant,

and yes i do consider people that eat meat the enemies of the spiritual evolution of the human race and the planet as a whole. The problems of the world all start with man's propensity for the consumption of animal flesh.



the fact of the matter is, soemone started this thread asking about the advantages of a vegan diet from any vegans who might be reading these forums, then a bunch of DICKHEADS come in with their anti-vegan bullshit trying to force THEIR opinions on her and anyone who is vegan/vegetarian.....

but because I express passion, you say I'm the one starting shit, and come to try to shut me up. Go read the beginning of the thread, MORONS. Who is the asshole trying to shove their shit down someone's throats? I am so sick of these types of neanderthals, i have to deal with people like this EVERY DAY, and yes I hate the mentality behind it. It pisses me off to no end.




and if you are annoyed with people debating this subject than DON'T READ THE DAMN THREAD. No one is forcing you to.........
Maybe if you ate some meat, you wouldn't have these nasty mood swings, man. :P

Meef Chaloin
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Post by Meef Chaloin » Sun Oct 15, 2006 10:21 am

Approach wrote:I was veggie for a bit but then I was seduced by a Mc Chicken
man thats lame

frankie123
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Post by frankie123 » Sun Oct 15, 2006 2:50 pm

Meef Chaloin wrote:this argument is bullshit, and so is that article. The crux of the argument seems to be that vegetarians shouldnt be veggies because they kill as many animals as meat eaters?!

Thank you for contacting PETA about animals killed during grain harvesting.
While millions of animals are killed each year in the
harvesting process, millions of animals suffer EVERY DAY in the meat
industry. BILLIONS of animals are tortured and slaughtered for food every
year in the United States alone.
All of these animals being raised for meat
eat grain. In fact, they consume more than half of all of the grain produced
in this country. If the population of the United States were vegetarian, we
would actually require LESS grain, and thereby kill fewer animals during
harvesting. When you eat meat, not only are you contributing to the
suffering of the farmed animals, but you are also contributing to the
majority of the animals killed during harvesting.

Conviniently you left out the response to this.




*Note: I have never contacted PETA. Someone sent my guiltless grill article to them and PETA decided to contact me instead.

PETA stands for People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals. Let's ignore for a moment that their name implies there exists a universal set of ethics, and instead let's focus on the meat of this email: PETA is "primarily concerned with preventing the suffering of living animals." Oh really? As opposed to preventing the suffering of dead animals? Good thing they clarified because I was confused and couldn't infer that when they said "animals" they didn't mean dead animals. Glad we have that cleared up, let's move on.

So what exactly constitutes as "prevention" of animal suffering? The moral vegetarians (not the ones who do it for religious or health reasons) love to chant "we're trying to limit the suffering." What the hell does that mean? If you eat wheat or soy, you're not limiting anything. Unless you plant, grow and pick your own crops, you're not doing everything you can to "limit" the suffering. You know deep down that you could help limit a whole lot more suffering, but you've chosen not to. You've chosen not to because your lifestyle is too convenient, and you'd have to give up too much, but nevermind that--you have a conscience to feel good about, and you can't let a little thing like millions of violent deaths of field animals get in the way of your moral trip.

Limit the suffering? That's like me saying I'm going to eat meat only 364 out of 365 days of the year in an effort to "limit" the suffering, I'm doing my part to prevent suffering. "BUT MADDOX, YOU COULD LIMIT A LOT MORE SUFFERING BY NOT EATING MEAT AT ALL!!!1" Exactly, and vegetarians could limit a lot more suffering by planting their own crops, but where do you draw the line? You claim to have compassion for animals, but just as soon as it gets too inconvenient you decide to call it quits? Cowards. You're no better off; not in my book. A murderer who kills 10 people is no better off than a murderer who kills 20 if the murder is avoidable. Of course, from the perspective of a suggestible young vegetarian I'm sure being responsible for half as many murders as the next guy means you're off the hook, right?

I keep getting email from moral vegetarians saying "HEY MADOX WE FEED MORE GRAIN TO ANIMALS AND IF YOU EAT THE ANIMALS YOU ARE KILLING TWICE AS MUCH." No shit? The only difference is that I'm not protesting at street corners about other peoples' diets--I'm not the one with a mission to prevent "the suffering of living animals." This email I received, and many like it is the whole reason I wrote the article in the first place. My opinions are kept to myself on my personal web page. I don't remember asking anyone to read a damn thing on my website. When you open up your inbox, you don't find it full of my opinions, and if you do I didn't send them to you. I'm not standing on the street corners protesting, I'm not putting fliers on your car and I'm not putting ads on TV and in magazines. I'm not shoving my agenda down your throat, don't shove your agenda down mine. All you dumbass activists need to get bent already.

Fun with facts: vegetarians love to boast outrageous figures like "it takes 5,000 gallons of water to produce one pound of beef and only 20 gallons to produce one pound of wheat." I've heard figures ranging from 2,000 to 5,000, and vegetarians will be damned if they include a source so we'll take the mean (that means "average") and go with 3,500. The average person consumes 1.5 million gallons of water every year (it takes water to grow and produce the food you eat in addition to the water you drink, quit emailing me you morons). Why isn't PETA protesting overpopulation of humans on the street corners? Why isn't PETA passing out free condoms or throwing javelins in your cock when you walk down the street if they really cared about water consumption? It's not like that water just suddenly disappears. The earth has had about the same amount of water for 2 billion years. So if a pound of beef takes 3,500 gallons of water, what difference does it make? How many vegetarians drive a car? To make a car (including tires), it takes about 40,000 gallons of fresh water. That's not including the gas it takes to run the car, the electricity to run the gas station, the water used to create the boat that brought your precious oil, the water used to create the pavement you drive on, the destruction of toxic chemicals that went into creating your clothes, and the electricity you use every day to send me stupid emails over the internet. Every year you are directly responsible for the consumption of billions of gallons of water. There are 26 million people suffering preventable brain damage from iodine deficiency, and another 1.5 billion people at risk. Nevermind that, you have animals to save. By driving your cars, you pump billions of tons of poison into the atmosphere and you're slowly killing us all. The computer you use requires 250 watts of electricity, let alone the billions of computers required to keep you on the internet. All consuming energy. All contributing to pollution. Let's just ignore those minor hypocrisies. Someone wants to enjoy a burger and you'll be damned if you're going to let them.

What makes you think that animals suffer in slaughter houses anyway? I think it would rule to be raised for slaughter. Get all the free steroids you want, free meals and plenty of good company--hell, you have it made. Then when you're at the prime of your life, you get your head generously chopped off so you don't have to live through the suffering of old age. Not only that, but you can die with the satisfaction of knowing that somebody is going to enjoy eating a burger made out of you. What's more humane? Being slaughtered for meat or having to spend 8 hours a day, 40 hours per week in a cubicle for the rest of your life with assholes who listen to shitty music without headphones, then retiring and withering away with old age and cancer as your obnoxious kids grow up and treat you like shit? Slaughter please.
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frankie123
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Post by frankie123 » Sun Oct 15, 2006 2:55 pm

The last paragraph is obviously humor, but the rest of the article has strong points, focusing on hypocrisy.
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Kodama
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Post by Kodama » Sun Oct 15, 2006 4:04 pm

Oh wow that guy could explain away the holocaust, he should be a defense attorney for crimes against humanity courts.

Why do anything at all ever? Why ever support anything? Why ever have any morals? They can all be explained away by this guy...

Sorry, but I will continue to have morals despite your indignation.


And you know, this also has to do with so much more -

- The well being of people who have to work in the meat industry

- The enormous amount of shit, hundreds of thousands of fucking gallons of shit going into our water supplies and water tables.

- The chemicals - all of us have chemicals in our blood that are left over remnants of the meat industries' waste.

- The fact that the world cannot live the way the US does if we still want a planet.

- The fact that you based your experience with vegetarianism off of eating only vegetable based food for 7 days, how scientific!

- The fact that you found a very tiny fraction of the meat industries' many disgusting products that you will eat.

Oh and since you keep posting quotes from that best home page jackass, and because I grow so very tired of this:




The Case Against Meat
Evidence Shows that Our Meat-Based Diet is Bad for the Environment, Aggravates Global Hunger, Brutalizes Animals and Compromises Our Health

by Jim Motavalli

There has never been a better time for environmentalists to become vegetarians. Evidence of the environmental impacts of a meat-based diet is piling up at the same time its health effects are becoming better known. Meanwhile, full-scale industrialized factory farming—which allows diseases to spread quickly as animals are raised in close confinement—has given rise to recent, highly publicized epidemics of meat-borne illnesses. At presstime, the first discovery of mad cow disease in a Tokyo suburb caused beef prices to plummet in Japan and many people to stop eating meat.

All this comes at a time when meat consumption is reaching an all-time high around the world, quadrupling in the last 50 years. There are 20 billion head of livestock taking up space on the Earth, more than triple the number of people. According to the Worldwatch Institute, global livestock population has increased 60 percent since 1961, and the number of fowl being raised for human dinner tables has nearly quadrupled in the same time period, from 4.2 billion to 15.7 billion. U.S. beef and pork consumption has tripled since 1970, during which time it has more than doubled in Asia.

One reason for the increase in meat consumption is the rise of fast-food restaurants as an American dietary staple. As Eric Schlosser noted in his best-selling book Fast Food Nation, “Americans now spend more money on fast food—$110 billion a year—than they do on higher education. They spend more on fast food than on movies, books, magazines, newspapers, videos and recorded music—combined.”

Strong growth in meat production and consumption continues despite mounting evidence that meat-based diets are unhealthy, and that just about every aspect of meat production—from grazing-related loss of cropland and open space, to the inefficiencies of feeding vast quantities of water and grain to cattle in a hungry world, to pollution from “factory farms”—is an environmental disaster with wide and sometimes catastrophic consequences. Oregon State University agriculture professor Peter Cheeke calls factory farming “a frontal assault on the environment, with massive groundwater and air pollution problems.”

World Hunger and Resources

The 4.8 pounds of grain fed to cattle to produce one pound of beef for human beings represents a colossal waste of resources in a world still teeming with people who suffer from profound hunger and malnutrition.

According to the British group Vegfam, a 10-acre farm can support 60 people growing soybeans, 24 people growing wheat, 10 people growing corn and only two producing cattle. Britain—with 56 million people—could support a population of 250 million on an all-vegetable diet. Because 90 percent of U.S. and European meat eaters’ grain consumption is indirect (first being fed to animals), westerners each consume 2,000 pounds of grain a year. Most grain in underdeveloped countries is consumed directly.

While it is true that many animals graze on land that would be unsuitable for cultivation, the demand for meat has taken millions of productive acres away from farm inventories. The cost of that is incalculable. As Diet For a Small Planet author Frances Moore Lappé writes, imagine sitting down to an eight-ounce steak. “Then imagine the room filled with 45 to 50 people with empty bowls in front of them. For the ‘feed cost’ of your steak, each of their bowls could be filled with a full cup of cooked cereal grains.”

Harvard nutritionist Jean Mayer estimates that reducing meat production by just 10 percent in the U.S. would free enough grain to feed 60 million people. Authors Paul and Anne Ehrlich note that a pound of wheat can be grown with 60 pounds of water, whereas a pound of meat requires 2,500 to 6,000 pounds.

Environmental Costs

Energy-intensive U.S. factory farms generated 1.4 billion tons of animal waste in 1996, which, the Environmental Protection Agency reports, pollutes American waterways more than all other industrial sources combined. Meat production has also been linked to severe erosion of billions of acres of once-productive farmland and to the destruction of rainforests.

McDonald’s took a group of British animal rights activists to court in the 1990s because they had linked the fast food giant to an unhealthy diet and rainforest destruction. The defendants, who fought the company to a standstill, made a convincing case. In court documents, the activists asserted, “From 1970 onwards, beef from cattle reared on ex-rainforest land was supplied to McDonald’s.” In a policy statement, McDonald’s claims that it “does not purchase beef which threatens tropical rainforests anywhere in the world,” but it does not deny past purchases.

According to People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals (PETA), livestock raised for food produce 130 times the excrement of the human population, some 87,000 pounds per second. The Union of Concerned Scientists points out that 20 tons of livestock manure is produced annually for every U.S. household. The much-publicized 1989 Exxon Valdez oil spill in Alaska dumped 12 million gallons of oil into Prince William Sound, but the relatively unknown 1995 New River hog waste spill in North Carolina poured 25 million gallons of excrement and urine into the water, killing an estimated 10 to 14 million fish and closing 364,000 acres of coastal shellfishing beds. Hog waste spills have caused the rapid spread of a virulent microbe called Pfiesteria piscicida, which has killed a billion fish in North Carolina alone.

More than a third of all raw materials and fossil fuels consumed in the U.S. are used in animal production. Beef production alone uses more water than is consumed in growing the nation’s entire fruit and vegetable crop. Producing a single hamburger patty uses enough fuel to drive 20 miles and causes the loss of five times its weight in topsoil. In his book The Food Revolution, author John Robbins estimates that “you’d save more water by not eating a pound of California beef than you would by not showering for an entire year.” Because of deforestation to create grazing land, each vegetarian saves an acre of trees per year.

“We definitely take up more environmental space when we eat meat,” says Barbara Bramble of the National Wildlife Federation. “I think it’s consistent with environmental values to eat lower on the food chain.”

The Human Health Toll

There is some evidence to suggest that the human digestive system was not designed for meat consumption and processing (see sidebar), which could help explain why there is such high incidence of heart disease, hypertension, and colon and other cancers. Add to this the plethora of drugs and antibiotics applied as a salve to unnatural factory farming conditions and growing occurrences of meat-based diseases like E. coli and Salmonella, and there’s a compelling health-based case for vegetarianism.

The factory-farmed chicken, cow or pig of today is among the most medicated creatures on Earth. “For sheer overprescription, no doctor can touch the American farmer,” reported Newsweek. According to a Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) report, the use of antimicrobial drugs for nontherapeutic purposes—mainly to increase factory farm growth rates—has risen 50 percent since 1985.

Ninety percent of commercially available eggs come from chickens raised on factory farms, and six billion “broiler” chickens emerge from the same conditions. Ninety percent of U.S.-raised pigs are closely confined at some point during their lives. According to the book Animal Factories by Jim Mason and Peter Singer, pork producers lose $187 million annually to chronic diseases such as dysentery, cholera, trichinosis and other ailments fostered by factory farming. Drugs are used to reduce stress levels in animals crowded together unnaturally, although 20 percent of the chickens die of stress or disease anyway.

One result of these conditions is a high rate of meat contamination. Up to 60 percent of chickens sold in supermarkets are infected with Salmonella entenidis, which can pass to humans if the meat is not heated to a high enough temperature. Another pathogen, Campylobacter, can also spread from chickens to human beings with deadly results.

In 1997, more than 25 million pounds of hamburger were found to be contaminated with E. coli 0157:H7, which is spread by fecal matter. The bacteria are a particular problem in hamburger, because the grinding process spreads it throughout the meat. E. coli, the leading cause of kidney failure in young children, was the culprit when three children died of food poisoning after eating at a Seattle Jack in the Box restaurant in 1993.

The British epidemic of bovine spongiform encephalopathy (BSE), or mad cow disease, which began in 1986 and has affected nearly 200,000 cattle, jumps to beef-eating humans in the form of the always-fatal Creutzfeldt-Jakob Disease (CJD). The CDC reports that an average of 10 to 15 people have contracted CJD from meat in Britain each year since it was first detected in 1994. In 1998, the British Medical Association warned in a report to Members of Parliament, “The current state of food safety in Britain is such that all raw meat should be assumed to be contaminated with pathogenic organisms.” In 1997, it added, Salmonella or E. coli infected a million people in Britain. BSE spreads through cattle that are fed contaminated central nervous-system tissue from other animals. “Its future magnitude and geographic distribution…cannot yet be predicted,” the CDC reported. In the U.S., deer have been affected with chronic wasting disease, which has many similarities to British BSE, though a definitive link to humans has not been established.

In the book Eating With Conscience, Dr. Michael W. Fox reports that what is known as “animal tankage”—the non-fat animal residue from slaughterhouses—is used in a wide variety of products, from animal feed and fertilizer to pet food. Dr. Fox adds that hundreds of cats in Europe (and several zoo animals) that ate tankage-laced food have contracted forms of BSE. The Japanese outbreak is believed to have originated in BSE-contaminated feed imported from Europe.

According to the U.S. Department of Agriculture (USDA), more than 10 million animals that were dying or diseased when slaughtered were “rendered” (processed into a protein-rich meal) in 1995 for addition to pig, poultry and pet food. Animals that collapse at the slaughterhouse door or during transportation are called “downers,” and their corpses are routinely processed for human consumption. A 2001 Zogby America poll conducted for the group Farm Sanctuary found that 79 percent of Americans oppose this practice, which could be an entry point for BSE into the U.S. meat supply. Farm Sanctuary petitioned the USDA in 1998 to end processing of downer meat for human consumption, but its petition was denied.

Europe will spend billions of dollars bringing a virulent epidemic of yet another animal-borne disease—foot-and-mouth—under control. In the last two years, 60 countries have had outbreaks of foot-and-mouth, which kills animals but does not spread to people.

One of the major western exports is a taste for meat, though it brings with it increased risk of heart disease and cancer. Clearly, there is something seriously wrong with a diet and food production system resulting in such waste, endemic disease and human health threats.

Caring About Animals

The average meat eater is responsible for the deaths of some 2,400 animals during his or her lifetime. Animals raised for food endure great suffering in their housing, transport, feeding and slaughter, which is something not clearly evident in the neatly wrapped packages of meat offered for sale at grocery counters. Given the information, many Americans—especially those with an environmental background—recoil at knowing they participate in a meat production system so oppressive to the animals caught up in it.

The family farm of the nineteenth century, with its “free-range” animals running around the farmyard or grazing in a pasture, is largely a thing of the past. Brutality to animals has become routine in today’s factory farm. A recent article in the pig industry journal National Hog Farmer recommends reducing the average space per animal from eight to six square feet, concluding “Crowding pigs pays.” Morley Safer reported on the television program 60 Minutes that today’s factory pig is no “Babe”: “[They] see no sun in their limited lives, with no hay to lie on, no mud to roll in. The sows live in tiny cages, so narrow they cannot even turn around. They live over metal grates, and their waste is pushed through slats beneath them and flushed into huge pits.”

Beef cattle are luckier than factory pigs in that they have an average of 14 square feet in the overcrowded feedlots where they live out their lives. Common procedures for beef calves include branding, castration and dehorning. Veal calves, taken away from their mothers shortly after birth, live their entire lives in near darkness, chained by their necks and unable to move in any direction. They commonly suffer from anemia, diarrhea, pneumonia and lameness.

Virtually all chickens today are factory raised, with as many as six egg-laying hens living in a wire-floored “battery” cage the size of an album cover. As many as 100,000 birds can live in each “henhouse.” Conditions are so psychologically taxing on the birds that they must be debeaked to prevent pecking injuries. Male chicks born on factory farms—as many as 280 million per year—are simply thrown into garbage bags to die because they’re of no economic value as meat or eggs.

Some 95 percent of factory-raised animals are moved by truck, where they are typically subjected to overcrowding, severe weather, hunger and thirst. Many animals die of heat exhaustion or freezing during transport.

Some of the worst abuse occurs at the end of the animals’ lives, as documented by Gail Eisnitz’ book Slaughterhouse, which includes interviews with slaughterhouse workers. “On the farm where I work,” reports one employee, “they drag the live ones who can’t stand up anymore out of the crate. They put a metal snare around her ear or foot and drag her the full length of the building. These animals are just screaming in pain.” He adds, “The slaughtering part doesn’t bother me. It’s the way they’re treated when they’re alive.” Dying animals unable to walk are tossed into the “downer pile,” and many suffer agonies until, after one or two days, they are finally killed.

The threat to slaughterhouse workers’ safety is largely underreported or ignored in the media. For example, Mother Jones magazine, in an otherwise admirable story on slaughterhouse workers, barely mentions the frequent injuries caused by pain-wracked animals lashing out inside the slaughterhouses. Despite the existence of the Humane Slaughter Act and regular USDA inspection, animals are often skinned alive or—in a major threat to worker safety—regain consciousness during slaughtering.

The Vegetarian Solution

Vegetarianism is not a new phenomenon. The ancient Greek philosopher Pythagoras was vegetarian, and until the mid-19th century, people who abstained from meat were known as “Pythagoreans.” Famous followers of Pythagoras’ diet included Leonardo da Vinci, Benjamin Franklin, George Bernard Shaw and Albert Einstein. The word “vegetarian” was coined in 1847 to give a name to what was then a tiny movement in England.

In the U.S., the 1971 publication of Diet For a Small Planet was a major catalyst for introducing people to a healthy vegetarian diet. Other stimuli included Peter Singer’s 1975 book Animal Liberation, which gave vegetarianism a moral underpinning; Singer and Jim Mason’s book Animal Factories, the first expose´ of confinement agriculture; and John Robbins’ 1987 Diet for a New America. In the U.S., according to a 1998 Vegetarian Journal survey, 82 percent of vegetarians are motivated by health concerns, 75 percent by ethics, the environment and/or animal rights, 31 percent because of taste and 26 percent because of economics.

Is the vegetarian diet healthy? The common perception persists that removing meat from the menu is dangerous because of protein loss. Lappé says there is danger of protein deficiency if vegetarian diets are heavily dependent upon 1) fruit; 2) sweet potatoes or cassava (a staple root crop for more than 500 million people in the tropics); or 3) the particular western problem, junk food.

But Reed Mangels, nutrition advisor to the Vegetarian Resource Group (VRG), says vegetarians can meet their protein needs “easily” if they “eat a varied diet and consume enough calories to maintain their weight. It is not necessary to plan combinations of foods. A mixture of proteins throughout the day will provide enough ‘essential amino acids.’”

Although meat is rich in protein, Vegetarian and Vegan FAQ reports that other good sources are potatoes, whole wheat bread, rice, broccoli, spinach, almonds, peas, chickpeas, peanut butter, tofu (soybean curd), soymilk, lentils and kale.

Supermarket shelves overflow with soy- or seitan-based meat substitutes. The soybean contains all eight essential amino acids and exceeds even meat in the amount of usable protein it can deliver to the human body. (It should be noted, however, that some people are allergic to soy, and the “hyper-processing” of some soy-based foods reduces the useful protein content.) Animal rights advocates also claim that, contrary to the urging of the meat and dairy industries, humans need to consume only two to 10 percent of their total calories as protein.

How many vegetarians are there in the U.S.? It depends on whom you ask. A PETA fact sheet asserts that 12 million Americans are vegetarians, and 19,000 make the switch every week. Pamela Rice, author of 101 Reasons Why I’m a Vegetarian, puts the number at 4.5 million, or 2.5 percent of the population, based on recent surveys. Older counts, from 1992, put the number of people who “consider themselves” to be vegetarians at seven percent of the U.S. population, or an impressive 18 million. A 1991 Gallup Poll indicated that 20 percent of the population look for vegetarian menu items when they eat out.

Actual vegetarian numbers may be lower. VRG got virtually the same results in two separate Roper Polls it sponsored in 1994 and 1997: One percent of the public, or between two and three million, is vegetarian (eats no meat or fish, but may eat dairy and/or eggs), with a third to half of them living on a vegan diet (eschewing all animal products). Roughly five percent in both studies “never eat red meat.” A 2000 poll was slightly more optimistic, putting the number of vegetarians at 2.5 percent of the population. Women are more likely to be vegetarians than men; and—surprisingly—Republicans are slightly more likely to abstain from meat than Democrats.

The American Dietetic Association says in a position statement, “Appropriately planned vegetarian diets are healthful, are nutritionally adequate and provide health benefits in the prevention and treatment of certain diseases.” Vegetarians now have excellent opportunities to put together well-planned meals. The sale of organic products in natural food stores is the highest growth niche in the food industry, according to Nutrition Business Journal, and it grew 22 percent in 1999 to $4 billion. The natural food markets of today are not the tiny storefronts of yesteryear, but full-service supermarkets, with vigorous competition among giant national chains. Diverse veggie entrees are now available in most supermarkets and on a growing list of restaurant menus.

It’s never been easier to become a vegetarian, and there have never been more compelling reasons for environmentalists to make that choice. It’s not always easy to do—most environmentalists still eat meat—but the tide is beginning to turn.

GO VEGAN!!! - Macbook Air, Bass Station II, Some Korg shit, Live Suite, U-He, Audio Damage, Microtonic, Ohmicide, more soft stuffs, awesome controllers, euro rack modular synth,an awesome cat.

noisetonepause
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Re: love-alopes

Post by noisetonepause » Sun Oct 15, 2006 4:29 pm

err_eur wrote:If I feel like using big text that's what I am going to do. It's there as an option, so I use it, in an expressive way, like in instances when I would be screaming in someone's face.
I do my own thing, sorry, I am not interested in conforming to the "accepted" font size in order to have a bunch of fake internet friends,
Oh my. Someone's mother did a very poor job.

Do you masturbate in public? Shit on the floor in supermarkets? Spit on people's shoes?

I don't generally agree with the idea behind ASBOs but in your case I think I could make an exception. Twat.
Suit #1: I mean, have you got any insight as to why a bright boy like this would jeopardize the lives of millions?
Suit #2: No, sir, he says he does this sort of thing for fun.

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