Ableton Forum

kami's not the same after the trolls picked on him.

H20nly wrote:

friend_kami wrote:

H20nly wrote:because i really need 64 bit since i can't handle my plugins responsibly.

i see what you did there and again; try setting up a huge orchestral template and see just how much you can do to handle that "responsibly".

wait, you still working with 8 tracks only?
ah, that might explain your ignorance.

oh kami, your abusive writing style has belittled me in such a clever and calculated way that if you what you said was true, i might be offended.

but i'm not. and you missed.

would it make you feel any better if i told you that last night i was working with around 24-30 tracks?

no, i didn't think so.

what if i told you they were a lot of audio tracks? or that about 12 of them were vocals with Waves plugs on them?

no, i didn't think so.

well... what if i told you my system bogged down and thought for a second.. man kami is right i need 64 bit STAT!!!




sorry... that last part isn't true... my system bogged down because i was pulling the files off a hard drive connected via USB.

but the rest is true

I think what Kami is talking about is Sampling plugins like 'Kontakt' where there is a limit to how much you can load with 32bit Live, not Live audio tracks and plugins per se. It's a fair comment.

i know what kami is on about. he is an exception.

i also think that kami is right... he needs 64 bit. he is one of very few that NEED 64 bit vs. WANT 64 bit. (just because you finally got your first 64 bit OS does not mean that everything not coded in 64 bit is obsolete)

what i do not believe is that repeating the problem a different way in a hundred different threads is going to make it happen any faster.

Live 9 will be ready when Live 9 is almost ready... that is to say betas and such will show up in way that we can all see.
regardless of when that finally takes place... you may or may not find 64 bit as part of the equation. sitting on your hands and complaining in the meantime will not change anything about your sets and your music. which still begs the question: how have you managed thus far?

Come on Abes! Almost 16.000 views and still no news!?

how have you managed thus far?

By loosing time freezing tracks and setting up other computers or complaining about jbridge crashing

H20nly wrote:

friend_kami wrote:

H20nly wrote:because i really need 64 bit since i can't handle my plugins responsibly.

i see what you did there and again; try setting up a huge orchestral template and see just how much you can do to handle that "responsibly".

wait, you still working with 8 tracks only?
ah, that might explain your ignorance.

oh kami, your abusive writing style has belittled me in such a clever and calculated way that if you what you said was true, i might be offended.

but i'm not. and you missed.

would it make you feel any better if i told you that last night i was working with around 24-30 tracks?

no, i didn't think so.

what if i told you they were a lot of audio tracks? or that about 12 of them were vocals with Waves plugs on them?

no, i didn't think so.

well... what if i told you my system bogged down and thought for a second.. man kami is right i need 64 bit STAT!!!




sorry... that last part isn't true... my system bogged down because i was pulling the files off a hard drive connected via USB.

but the rest is true

try 200+ tracks with shittons of orchestral libraries and other essentials one would need in order to create filmscores and sounddesign for movies.
20 tracks and your system bogged?
feel sorry for you, mate. however that doesn't mean that 32 bit is just fine. it just means that for the people that actually are working on big projects are getting shafted. fuck do i know, i've stopped using live for anything other than a routable semimodular drumplugin since i bought session drums and just rewire the shit instead. at the least then i can decide what channels to hide and actually work efficiently on big projects.

sorry to say, but if you are working with 20-30 tracks, then sure, i understand why you see no need for an overhaul of live.

H20nly wrote:how have you managed thus far?

it's quite simple actually: work more, learn more, expand your knowledge of your software, as well as the limitations of said software. eventually you either sit down, shutup and stick with the lesser option, or you move on and pray to whatever sad diety you might occasionally believe in that the developers eventually understands that people are using their software as it is marketed as: a DAW, instead of a "you can play live with this thing" tool.

a DAW with substandard DAW features is not a DAW, it's a sketchpad for music. Either they need to get with the program or stick with what they know: making a better sketchpad for music.
Ableton wanted to take over the DAW market it seems like, introducing a lot of features people wanted working in a studiosession rather than a livesession, but failed when people actually started to use it more and more as a DAW and saw it's shortcomings.

for example: group tracks. brilliant in theory, right? well, not if you have a big bunch of them and they all have their own overview of their content without any means of hiding. more grouptracks with content: less screenspace and more vertical scrolling needed. that alone is a reason to switch DAW when you reach a certain threshold; there's a reason proper DAW have a really freaking small tracklist window where you can hide tracks completely as to get rid of clutter, easier asset management and generally a better overview of what the shit is going on.

the browser is a joke. really, it's worhless for anything else than plugin and device manament. that again comes down to asset management. we have no tagging, no keywords, no nothing. we have an expandable folderstructure with devices to choose from, and we have a search hotkey that can't search keywords, only names.

brilliant.

Guys,
There is 19 pages.
in short - when?

ddr400 wrote:Guys,
There is 19 pages.
in short - when?

seriously? you think Ableton is going to look at a half baked thread and make business decisions based on that? they know it's loooong overdue, they know people weren't happy with Live 8, they know about Bitwig, there's NOTHING enlightening or new in this thread to them. the number of views or posts doesn't mean shit.

ABLETOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOON! More than 16.000 VIEWS!!!!! And STILL no news on Live 9 ???????????????????

Tone Deft wrote:

ddr400 wrote:Guys,
There is 19 pages.
in short - when?

seriously? you think Ableton is going to look at a half baked thread and make business decisions based on that? they know it's loooong overdue, they know people weren't happy with Live 8, they know about Bitwig, there's NOTHING enlightening or new in this thread to them. the number of views or posts doesn't mean shit.

total silence does mean shit; shit for the company who gets a bad reputation for being disrespectful to their users.
this forum is a good example of that, people are pissed off.

we get newsletters telling us to buy an epiano when they are selling a product with an device designed specifically for this and they are marketing this device as extremely accurate.
we get no updates, we get no actual informational news about anything that is going on, nor what has happened in the past 3 years besides an extra instrument a little now and then developed by whoever and costs like a tank.

i don't care when live 9 will be released, but i do care about any sort of confirmation about it, even if it's just a simple freaking "yeah, we are working on it" a little now and then.
according to how many annoyed posts there is on this forum i assume that a lot of other people share that opinion with me.
shafting your customers and then not saying a word for 3 years is NOT a good way to keep your customers loyal, nor to keep a good reputation.

hell, look at reaper and cockos.
that's how you keep your customers happy, and have your customers recommend your product for you.

funken wrote: you using a hundred tracks or something?

yes.
more than a hundred is very common for me.

friend_kami wrote:

Tone Deft wrote:

ddr400 wrote:Guys,
There is 19 pages.
in short - when?

seriously? you think Ableton is going to look at a half baked thread and make business decisions based on that? they know it's loooong overdue, they know people weren't happy with Live 8, they know about Bitwig, there's NOTHING enlightening or new in this thread to them. the number of views or posts doesn't mean shit.

total silence does mean shit; shit for the company who gets a bad reputation for being disrespectful to their users.
this forum is a good example of that, people are pissed off.

it's a minority of people that are pissed off, a few loud rude voices.

we get newsletters telling us to buy an epiano when they are selling a product with an device designed specifically for this and they are marketing this device as extremely accurate.
we get no updates, we get no actual informational news about anything that is going on, nor what has happened in the past 3 years besides an extra instrument a little now and then developed by whoever and costs like a tank.

see, they tell you something and you bitch about it. stay silent about Live 9 and there's nothing to bitch about. if they had said when it will be release people would bitch about that. if they said it was 64 bit people would bitch about that.

i don't care when live 9 will be released, but i do care about any sort of confirmation about it, even if it's just a simple freaking "yeah, we are working on it" a little now and then.
according to how many annoyed posts there is on this forum i assume that a lot of other people share that opinion with me.
shafting your customers and then not saying a word for 3 years is NOT a good way to keep your customers loyal, nor to keep a good reputation.

you don't care when Live 9 will be released but news on it is pissing you off? you need a shrink.

hell, look at reaper and cockos.

yes, let's look at those stalworts of the industry, those trend setting giants we should compare Ableton to. weak.

the forum doesn't mean shit. Ableton can contact just about anyone Professional out there and get feedback and product soak time and real feedback from them.

it's great when they do speak up but you can blame a few rude 3posters for making that environment less likely to happen.

funken wrote:

friend_kami wrote:

funken wrote: you using a hundred tracks or something?

yes.
more than a hundred is very common for me.

omg, I couldnt handle that!

when i did audio as an intern to a company working on a volvo pressrelease i did most of the sfx and ended up with a consolidated version of about 40 tracks, and each of those tracks had about 10 layers.
each layer had at the least 15 tracks as components (ie, an impact has several components, such as debris, different layers to conclude the weight of the impact and so on, pre-impact sounds etc).

you do the math.
now try working with live when doing that heh.

i know people tell me to consolidate, but consolidating is something you do when you are absolutely fine with the result.
running back and fourth between the main studio and my workplace i had no time and no option of consolidating, because i had to make adjustments to both the component layers and the main stem layer, and this is not uncommon to how i and the people i do work with normally work. ableton live is absolutely fantastic for rapid sound design, but not for any serious work, because it's simply too tedious to work with big projects. this is of course not counting the other stuff with it, such as the lack of proper asset-management, or the ram limitation of a 32bit application.

when i do my noise projects every component has it's own track and it's own set of processing, meaning that i can adjust every part of the project whenever i want instead of redesigned an entire stem and/or just adjusting the stem it self.

take a look at this guy here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KBB4Txnpl78
imagine working with multiple automation lanes with that setup in live.
yeah. exactly.
not uncommon at all to have these types of setups for big projects.
last time i was in a big studio, we produced for a band which was a freaking pop/rock band and the tracklist was H U G E.
when the band were finally satisfied, we consolidated it down to a normal manageable sized project, but until then every component had it's own place, every take, every return track, every extra processed track. also not uncommon in a production house, at the least not the one's i've been in.

Tone Deft wrote: you don't care when Live 9 will be released but news on it is pissing you off? you need a shrink.

nope, i don't care WHEN it will be released, but i do care about some sort of official information about it, which we have seen none sofar.
i need a shrink because you can't read properly?
such a great argument.