Ableton Forum

diskowipe wrote: i dont think it's fair to criticize people for trying to talk about this stuff and really trying to LEARN something. there are many constructive and eye opening threads on gearslutz about this topic, and people aren't being flamed the second this comes up, which is why there is real information to be found there. nothing can be accomplished if people aren't open to questioning things

again, unbelievably arrogant and patronising. The thing you are not seeing is your role in the bigger picture..... Being long term Ableton forum users we have all seen this debate so many times it's painful, and like I said before it is ALWAYS driven by one enormous ego with golden ears who feels it is enough to say that he and the other "pros" he knows think it sounds different so science be damned I'll trust my golden ears.

Many of us here are also "pros" who have been doing this a long time and have also used many different recording mediums over many years and CANNOT hear this mystical difference (other than maybe things like the panning law that Nico addressed earlier) and have also seen NO evidence that supports these claims. ALWAYS it is someone with a chip on their shoulder acting as a spokesman for their "famous" buddies. I have been personally coming to this forum about 7 years and seen it an infuriating number of times so you can imagine how Ableton feel. Sorry to spoil your delusions of grandeur but you are not the first.

Like the example I gave before of the duplicate audio files tricking all the "pros" we all like to think we're special, but ears and sound by their nature are imperfect.

SubFunk wrote:... it has a lot to do with this forum not being moderated
and some of the 'old' very frequent users of this forum act like they have the right to moderate,
but without having any deep knowledge or even worse real world experience. they are mainly just in love with live..

actually most of the 'old' users I've seen post in this thread know very much what they are talking out - who are you referring to?

I'm mad at myself for even adding to this thread...but this shit can't STILL be rollin' on can it?

Can it?

Can it.

yes it very well can.

evernaut wrote:I'm mad at myself for even adding to this thread...but this shit can't STILL be rollin' on can it?

Train wrecks are a forum speciality around here. Try asking questions about Live and MIDI sync or other real world stuff and hear a pin drop.
^^ I kid, but seriously, I would LOVE to see a thread on external MIDI sync and Live get as much attention on these goofy threads where people chase ghosts and shadows, and air dirty laundry etc.

I can get Digital Performer and Logic to sync to the Poly Evolver, but with Live it acts like MIDI is getting jammed, notes doubling, and sloppy timing etc.
Same system, yet vastly different results. I would love to be able to use Live for this.

I'm very curious about this. I have a lot of outboard stuff that I drive with Lives midi clips (Jomox Mbase, Waldorf Blofeld, etc..) and I've never had midi problems. I have latency issues but nothing I couldn't overcome with the offset controls at the bottom of the tracks. But I have heard this "Lives midi is shit" a lot. Can someone explain what the problem is? Does it only come up with certain (older?) equipment? Or is the midi implementation bad in general? I am getting to grips with Logic at the moment and intend trying out it's midi implementation but as I said, I haven't found any of the problems you mention using Live.

if it ain't broke then don't fix it - if your workflow is functional then that's all that matters.

If it IS broke - then try another sequencer with your gear and see if you get better results. I have only ever synced external gear to Live twice before and only for short clips to link a drum machine, after quite a lot of messing about it worked out OK. If you rely on sequencing a lot of hardware simultaneously to your software sequencer you may find it this easy or very frustrating, so many variables and Live is only one of them. Drivers, MIDI interface, audio interface, bugs all play a part.

Machinesworking wrote:

evernaut wrote:I'm mad at myself for even adding to this thread...but this shit can't STILL be rollin' on can it?

Train wrecks are a forum speciality around here. Try asking questions about Live and MIDI sync or other real world stuff and hear a pin drop.
^^ I kid, but seriously, I would LOVE to see a thread on external MIDI sync and Live get as much attention on these goofy threads where people chase ghosts and shadows, and air dirty laundry etc.

I can get Digital Performer and Logic to sync to the Poly Evolver, but with Live it acts like MIDI is getting jammed, notes doubling, and sloppy timing etc.
Same system, yet vastly different results. I would love to be able to use Live for this.

I've been having sync issues from v7....been using the RME multiface midi ports...
lately I've bought an Novation SL25.. I'm using both Midi outputs to send sync...
using it to output sync is waaay more stable than the multifaceII..
(I guess it's because it has a built-in clock generator...but I could be wrong..)
that being said... there are still some drifts occuring .. but then it falls back in sync...
I'm very pleased with my current setup,,,

sorry to hijack... but still on the 'sync ' issue...
http://web.webhost4life.com/innerclock/ ... ge&name=16
...this looks intriguing...
does anyone have any experience with this system ?

@3dot,
Actually I'm pretty sure, not super sure, but been doing a LOT of testing lately, sending bug reports etc.
that the problem is when a device has sync capabilities of it's own.

More than one issue here, but as brief as I can be explanation:

Midisport 4x4, used it for years, with Live there was drift in tempo, this is mainly using the DSI Evolvers Step Sequencer synced to Live.
My guess it was because of M-Audios crappy MIDI drivers.
So I upgraded recently to the top end MOTU MTP/AV ($150 in perfect shape! craigslist is my god!).
With the MTP if MIDI Sync Out in Live's Preferences is ON, there is noticable doubling of notes, and terrible drift.
This is without any setting turned on in the MTP, the device simply monitors the Sync signal and sends it to the Evolver,
but obviously something is amok between Live and the MTP.
Get this? with Sync turned OFF in both Out and In in Live, Sync is OK, 1/8 second or so late compared to Digital Performer, but pretty steady??
The MTP seems to read sync signals from Live regardless of Live's settings and Live seems to mess things up if it tries to send sync messages?

You mentioned the Remote SL working, my guess is because the SL as far as I know (I have an SL too!), doesn't send MIDI clock, but the RME can.
So, as it stands, I can sync my Evolver with the MTP/AV and Live's sync options turned OFF, with a lag, but steady, and if I try to set up Live to sync, it turns to crap???
Sounds like you have similar issues, so if I hear any good news from tech support I'll let you know.

this conversation doesn't mean anything unless you post ALL your system specs.


why this thread FFS?

Tone Deft wrote:this conversation doesn't mean anything unless you post ALL your system specs.


why this thread FFS?

A: Why not? this thread sucks anyway. Why are you trying to direct the conversation your way? You have no issues with sync we do.

B: Both me and 3dot know each others systems specs, I'll post in relevant threads if new information comes out.

C: I don't owe you an explanation for anything, period. <-- not intended to start a debate with you, just a simple fact, the hall monitor routine is getting old.

A. people will read the thread title and start up with the original retarded discussion. think about it.

B. oh,that's so cute. but it won't help the people at Ableton.

C. you just gave me an explanation, fuckwit. you poor poor victim you.

Oh shit! Tone's off his meds again.

was never on them. you're the one on meds, literally.

Tone Deft wrote:was never on them. you're the one on meds, literally.

Literally? What does that mean?

Then, perhaps one too many RedBulls today?

Why haven't you jumped on Monty Breaks. That mother fucker just popped back on the boards and now he's speaking French.

????WTF???? This could be a real good flame war if you bring your A game. (I think you are primed ATM).