Ableton Forum

dom wrote:

subfunk: no, please don't suggest things like that. you're referring to the solution to your problem (no crashes at all, but a slow system due to the graphics stuff) but this is not related to any crashes that others report and will most likely have another reason and solution.

oops sorry, forgot to mention about the no crashes just mainly slow, odd n' sluggish behavior

No biggie, we just should try to avoid confusion!
There are many potential reasons for problems, but there's not much that can't be solved if you work with the support team.

Best,
Dom

dom wrote: Regarding your files: As Live 7 does not know about the concept of transients at all, how should it offer forward compatibility for Live 8 files?
Or, keeping it with your sampler comparison: ever tried to load S1000 soundsets into a S900 back in the hardware days?

Best,
Dom

I am not talking about soundsets.. i am talking about loops..

a loop has a samplingrate info..a start point.. and an endpoint.. and the loop on/of flag...

why cant a rendred file without any stretches and so on ( therfore its rendered) not be just be compatible with the previous version in just this little things?

start, end, and loop on flag...

no fideling with transients necessary.. i am happy to set them again if necessary... but just a plain loop without gimmicks cant be loaded?

Again, i think thats poor... conceptional its poor...And seeing the unstability from live 8 its poor because beeing so overconfident with new versions to abandon the most basic backward compatibility...

I wonder where you at ableton get this confidence, seeing the problems any new version of live made since the beginning..except version 3 ...

You force the users to the new versions as you try to force them to buy your plugs with the flood of presets you auto install on any update without asking for permission...

How can i share loops with users that are still on live 7? analog recording into live 7 is the way that is fastest and gives the least trouble.. welcome to the 21 century..


And .. I never transfered a bank from my s1100 to the s900 because both machines never was crashing ...
ther was just no need to do that...

and we are not talking about the transfer of whole banks..just simple single loops...
And this would have been easily possible with the conversion routines of sample libarian programs...

Why do you dont offer a little conversion program to your customers when changing the fileformat so drastical?

Live 8 offers many improvements especially regarding stretching and preparing loops, but running a liveshow on it? wright now?
would you recomend that?
Is it so unlikely to want to work in live 8 but run the show for now on the trusty live 7?


Microsoft Office offers the option to safe in old file formats btw...

A rendered wav or aiff file is just that: a wav or aiff file.
They're not depending on any versions and will work in all applications that support those file types, not only Live.

The only difference is, that Live 7 can't read the additionally saved asd file of Live 8 and you have to set up your warp parameters again, if you wish to.

Question about stability and confidence: Is there any way you can crash Live on it's own without third party products involved or can you only do it with your midi pipe midi feedbacks?

Best,
Dom

P.S.: don't get me started on S900 crashes! ;)

Mine crashes for some bizarre reason when I turn my JP-8080 Knobs.
I save my sets more often with Live 8, always on the lookout for a crash.

Interesting, does it still happen after the reset of your osx audio/midi setup you've done this weekend to fix the BCR/BCF mess?
If so, please send us the details of your midi setup and what we have to do in order to force Live into this crash.

Thanks,
Dom

Hey Dom,

At the moment my whole setup is disconnected. I'm in the process of rewiring the audio but the midi setup will stay the same, so the crash should still occur.
Mostly it crashes when i mess with the delay level and feedback knob,
but I will try to recreate the crash when everything is setup again, probably somewhere next week.

Best regards.

Ps: Yea, it still happened after the BCF was a BCF again. Man, that drove me nuts.

Live is supposed to be played only with internal plug ins and no external ones or even hardware?
You cant be serious about that.. When it dont crashes on its own its just not enough.
You call your software a DAW..
One without timecode output and the ability to include or handling the midistreams of external gear? great..
But one that crashes when you try to get around that limitations otherwise?
Beeing not able to handle the midi but demanding excusiv access to the ports?


And regarding midipipe

There are no midipipe feedbacks as a standard.. but they might happen when doing a bad patch or going to the same thru channel on my atari..what can happen but is not standard operation.. The risk of midi fidbacks is allways there when you patch a devive output to its input..but if channel filters are on such a feedback cant happen...

But midi feedback is not supposed to crash a daw... at least not the ones i worked with yet...

Since live is not able to do latency free midi thru or handle external midisetups in any way there is no way for me to work with live without midipipe.. you actually should buy it and bundle it with your software...

only other option is to use live as rewire slave for a full featured DAW ...but i dont like to do that...


I cant really say if life is crashing when run allone, i never did that..
first it was crashing because of plug ins..so i removed all plugs except the ohmboys, because i need them on stage ... than i started to work with my old expanders like s-1100, dx 7 , Bit 01, pro one, aso instead of plug in synths..

and had even more crashes ... midipipe related?

Live 7 dont has any problems with midipipe or the plugs i own.. as the previos live versions ( exept with reaktor)..

Before life had midi it needed midi pipe as companion even more than now..
You really should have a tool aplications that handle the midi affairs that are not part of the main functions of life but so very important to get control over hardware setups ..
You dont need such a big thing as the Logic enviroment.. But something is needed to handle and direct the midistreams. just a plain chanel selection as in live is too rudimentry.


Midipipe really helps, supplys all kind of controler conversions and filterings live is not able to do...provides latency free midi thru to as many expanders as you want and independent from track selection and settings.

This tool is really indispensable when working with live and external midi gear..
and you dont want live beeing involved when using external sequencers sequencing external gear... you just record the audio result of the process into live.

Also on stage i need midipipe to allow my G2 to sequenz the old nord in latency free realtimewhile.
From live i only use the clock and program change patches..only rarly a midi note sequenz.

So in case midipipe is involved in the problem it would be really nice if you see the problem as yours and dont let us wait to have the little shareware guy to change his program that never made any problems with any other daw on the market.


How do other people handle external midigear with live? you dont? either all plug ins or only hardware?

dom wrote:A rendered wav or aiff file is just that: a wav or aiff file.
They're not depending on any versions and will work in all applications that support those file types, not only Live.

The only difference is, that Live 7 can't read the additionally saved asd file of Live 8 and you have to set up your warp parameters again, if you wish to.

Question about stability and confidence: Is there any way you can crash Live on it's own without third party products involved or can you only do it with your midi pipe midi feedbacks?

Best,
Dom

P.S.: don't get me started on S900 crashes!

And one more regarding the file compatibility problem.

i realized that you´ve done 2 updates for live 7 because the fictionary apc controler...

why you havent included in the later live 7 versions a routine where it recognizes live 8 asd files and ignores or converts them instead making total nonsense out of them?

When i would have erased all asd files on the rendred loops i would have got a propper result?
hmm.. i might try that... It at least reduces the work because readjusting a naked file is defenetly less trouble then having to erase crazy warp markers first...

it would be however nice if live 7 just would ignore the live 8 asd files ..and would be able to write an own seperated one into the same lib...

maybe with the new file format you should have changend the name from .asd to .asd2

3phase wrote: And one more regarding the file compatibility problem.

i realized that you´ve done 2 updates for live 7 because the fictionary apc controler...

You mean the apc40? That's right! Or what exactly is a "fictionary controler"?
I already tried google and dictionaries already, so no jokes please, i'm not embarrassed to learn something new at all...

3phase wrote: why you havent included in the later live 7 versions a routine where it recognizes live 8 asd files and ignores or converts them instead making total nonsense out of them?

That's easy: we can't develop things for free, that's why ableton is a company and not an art project.
Obviously the Akai deal pays for including the controller but not for your personal feature request.

3phase wrote: When i would have erased all asd files on the rendred loops i would have got a propper result?

Then those loops are just normal wav or aiff files and should give you the same result as other wav or aiff files.

Thanks for the feature suggestions in your last mail and sorry for not commenting the post above, regarding your midi speculation and guesswork.
I won't take part in speculations and can only comment technical facts or check detailed use cases and we have still not received those from you yet in this forum or via email.

Cheers,
Dom

Can abes or anyone for that matter post any one single "basic" system w versions etc, that Live gets along with well?

If we have to debate about what "gets along with" or what "well" means,.... never mind.
Anyway, It had to rock on at least one system before it was blessed for release.

What are Live8 developers and programmers using in their personal setups? It's safe to say they have no problems, right?

Forget about what I have, I want to know what to use.

knotkranky wrote:Can abes or anyone for that matter post any one single "basic" system w versions etc, that Live gets along with well?

If we have to debate about what "gets along with" or what "well" means,.... never mind.
Anyway, It had to rock on at least one system before it was blessed for release.

What are Live8 developers and programmers using in their personal setups? It's safe to say they have no problems, right?

Forget about what I have, I want to know what to use.

OH... me likey very much this approach , please ableton tell us, maybe we can contribute to the weak economic situation and go shopping with a list in our hand

interpolate wrote:I'm crashing a lot on exit. There is about a 50% of crashing every time I close a project. Sometimes if I make a new project before closing ableton it will be fine. Reguardless of when I crash the problem is always a Kernel Memory Access Violation error on thread 0.

I'm kinda waiting for 8.0.5 because some of the updates look like things that could be causing me to crash. If 8.0.5 doesn't fix my problems, i'm going to start bugging the heck out of ableton.

OSX 10.4.11
Many crashes on exit! that was on 8.0.4....I'm back no 8.0.2 since I can't find 8.0.3 and haven't had the time to experiment with the betas since I needed to complete a project.

I had guaranteed crashes when using 3rd party plugs...in particular, I'm using NI's Massive, FM8, and Abysnth 4 with all current updates.

At one point, I couldn't work more than a couple of minutes without it crasheing especially not giving me the chance to save quick edits I was making =/

On 8.0.2, sometimes I get hungup on exiting still. I've had to often restart Live, all versions, except current beta (untested) because beat repeat would not work currectly after a few passes. Maybe after it passes with it on....I'd stop play and go back and play again, then there would be like an audio drop out, or like beat repeat in gate mode or insert mode or something when it would pass back thru the section where it was turned on and it is set in mix mode.

frequent crashes for me on osx 10.4.11 too... seems to struggle to close as well. often when I'm opening up a project it will freeze entirely

SubFunk wrote:

knotkranky wrote:Can abes or anyone for that matter post any one single "basic" system w versions etc, that Live gets along with well?

If we have to debate about what "gets along with" or what "well" means,.... never mind.
Anyway, It had to rock on at least one system before it was blessed for release.

What are Live8 developers and programmers using in their personal setups? It's safe to say they have no problems, right?

Forget about what I have, I want to know what to use.

OH... me likey very much this approach , please ableton tell us, maybe we can contribute to the weak economic situation and go shopping with a list in our hand

Good point.

And it's better for the planet too