Part II: A system that would replace money

[Grappadura]

No, you are not controlling everybody, you are only seeing where your work output goes. Isnt that fair?

[SubFunk]

you know, the existing system, has drawbacks because it is not or can't be a 100% controlled, thanks god!

yours would allow 100% control, to avoid what you think is bad. that makes you to a judge.

horror.

[Grappadura]

You cant control anything in this system, you simply see the chain, but you cant influence it. Unlike todays system, where banks control the market.

[SubFunk]

No, you are not controlling everybody, you are only controlling your work output. isnt that fair?

he? yeah that is fair, so no control except work output?

then i can or anybody else can corrupt it.

and you have the same as now.

i can make a 'dirty deal' with some partners and earn on transferring 'work values' from one to another, form my own little circles after my 'rules' etc.

don't you see that the cat is biting it's own tail?

you always forget the 'human factor' no control, you will have everything happening you consider being bad!
you establish control, then you are no better then what we got right now.

again it's not the money or the system, it's the people.

you want change them... the nazis tried, the commies tried, the americans still try, we still try, keep on trying, we are humans with all good and bad.

[SubFunk]

You cant control anything in this system, you simply see the chain, but you cant influence it. Unlike todays system, where banks control the market.

of course you can influence (and then control it) any system, unless you control and protect it with force before hand.

[Grappadura]

You cant control anything in this system, you simply see the chain, but you cant influence it. Unlike todays system, where banks control the market.

of course you can influence (and then control it) any system, unless you control and protect it with force before hand.

Ok, so we reached a point in the discussion where you are telling me that you can influence the system, but you won´t tell me how. I guess its a dead end.

[SubFunk]

You cant control anything in this system, you simply see the chain, but you cant influence it. Unlike todays system, where banks control the market.

of course you can influence (and then control it) any system, unless you control and protect it with force before hand.

Ok, so we reached a point in the discussion where you are telling me that you can influence the system, but you won´t tell me how. I guess its a dead end.

yes, sort of.

besides do i have to really tell you how to interfere with a system running between people?

it's a nice discussion, but i really guess we coming to a dead end, here... cause you always avoid the 'human factor'

the only way to get around the 'bad' about the human factor is via control and enforcement... and there we are at the starting point again.

or let's go for it, find someone supporting your application idea, i promise i will be part of the system, for certain 'work'
then let's see how long (maybe 2-4 years) it will run smoothly, before you need a control and enforcement 'institution'
and ending up having the same as now. let's do it.

i tell you it's a cat in it's own tail situation as long as you underestimate the nature of people.

[Grappadura]

or let's go for it, find someone supporting your application idea, i promise i will be part of the system, for certain 'work'
then let's see how long (maybe 2-4 years) it will run smoothly, before you need a control and enforcement 'institution'
and ending up having the same as now. let's do it.

Thats the spirit! Lets try out something new!

[SubFunk]

or let's go for it, find someone supporting your application idea, i promise i will be part of the system, for certain 'work'
then let's see how long (maybe 2-4 years) it will run smoothly, before you need a control and enforcement 'institution'
and ending up having the same as now. let's do it.

Thats the spirit! Lets try out something new!

only in this case i am 100% convinced that it's going to fail. unless we turn into robots!!!

bad start, i just do it to prove it's going to fail. people, human beings are involved, any system applied onto them will go pear shaped, ANY!

i mean, i will be certainly one that will undermine it at some point. so you have already one bad apple in it.*




* just joking, but even i am not intended, it will happen naturally! very, very naturally. or you need to kill nature, the nazis and commies already tried, i said so already!

[djsynchro]

I bet the person who sells you your weed only takes cash!

[SubFunk]

I bet the person who sells you your weed only takes cash!

[Grappadura]

or let's go for it, find someone supporting your application idea, i promise i will be part of the system, for certain 'work'
then let's see how long (maybe 2-4 years) it will run smoothly, before you need a control and enforcement 'institution'
and ending up having the same as now. let's do it.

Thats the spirit! Lets try out something new!

only in this case i am 100% convinced that it's going to fail. unless we turn into robots!!!

bad start, i just do it to prove it's going to fail. people, human beings are involved, any system applied onto them will go pear shaped, ANY!

i mean, i will be certainly one that will undermine it at some point. so you have already one bad apple in it.

Well fortunatly no one is forced to do business with you. Besides, I don´t think you would scam your friends, or the friends of your friends.

[SubFunk]

Well fortunatly no one is forced to do business with you. Besides, I don´t think you would scam your friends, or the friends of your friends.

exactly there you are in a cloud of to much weed. people do way, way more evil stuff then that.

EDIT: and they will do business in the first place, you can always appear nice and trustworthy enough, before the 'turn'

that is one of the many problems of humans. (problems in respect to a system upon humans)

[Grappadura]

Well fortunatly no one is forced to do business with you. Besides, I don´t think you would scam your friends, or the friends of your friends.

exactly there you are in a cloud of to much weed. people do way, way more evil stuff then that.

So, do you scam your friends?

Besides, its not like you would have much opportunity to drain the system. Remember that the money that is generated disappears as soon as a circle is closed. You can´t steal what has disappeared.

The only thing you could do is pretend that you do a service, wait for the money exchange and then deny the promissed service. You can do this in todays monetary system as well. Go for it, why wait for a different system if you can scam others today.

[SubFunk]

Well fortunatly no one is forced to do business with you. Besides, I don´t think you would scam your friends, or the friends of your friends.

exactly there you are in a cloud of to much weed. people do way, way more evil stuff then that.

So, do you scam your friends?

Besides, its not like you would have much opportunity to drain the system. Remember that the money that is generated disappears as soon as a circle is closed. You can´t steal what has disappeared.

The only thing you could do is pretend that you do a service, wait for the money exchange and then deny the promissed service. You can do this in todays monetary system as well. Go for it, why wait for a different system if you can scam others today.

i have not said i do.

i said people do, yes they do, millions of them worldwide do, people also kill for money, etc. etc.

or maybe i do? how do you know? i want to make business with you, you think i show my real face?

just giving an example of what is the human aspect of not being able to control. again cat in it's on tail...

and your system is doomed to failure, because it's a system, systems do not work ever like they are thought to work, the human factor will always change and undermine certain aspects of any system, both to the good and to the bad.

i really think that's all.

and i really like some of that dope now, that makes me think of all humans all in love and peace and niceness and trust, etc. etc.