[SOLD] Jazzmutant Lemur for SALE!!

[Tone Deft]

it is not a revolutionary new computing device, it's a toy.

It's a toy to you but people with enough imagination and creativity are already making amazing stuff with it.

absolutely, those electribe apps look really cool.

the amount of computing power in the amazingly slender iPhone still KILLS me. plus the camera, video, GPS, compass, phoneshit, multi-touch all from a fanless CPU, amazing. BUT I'm on the bleeding edge running Ableton Live with a 2GHz Centrino Duo with 2Gb of RAM.

[Z3NO]

with all the fanboy bullshit going on with this thing it's easy to overestimate it. it is not a revolutionary new computing device, it's a toy. funny how most reviews are giving two reviews, one for the Luddites, one for the techies. Apple taking advantage of their windowlicking user base.

Agree on this one!
I'll make another analogy, just to better illustrate my view on this... If you look at the photography market you have (let's say) 2 categories: professional SLR and consumer compact cameras. They both do the same thing: take pictures. They both have often similar resolutions and menu features are almost identical. Some compact cameras even have interchangeable lenses, and yet... are they a threat to each other on the market? Hardly!
The iPad is a great gadget packed with features and no doubt in many areas will even exceed the capabilities of the Lemur, but professional musicians (and I'm speaking of people actually making a decent living from their productions and touring) look at durability and reliability before anything else in a product. And however solid the iPad is and fulfils these requisites it's just not been around long enough for anyone to say if it will hold it's own in a taxing environment!
Which brings me to another topic (and since this thread has already been hijacked once, why not do it twice?): Stability of Ableton Live.
I have worked as a technician and a sound engineer for years on many large scale gigs for artists often using Live as part of their setup in clubs, indoor concerts and large outdoor festivals alike. Guess how many crashes, glitches or malfunctions (on Live's part) have I witnessed... that's right. NONE! Why? Because on all of those gigs Live was setup and run correctly (and tested at length) on machines which only had one application installed and a single task to perform: To play Live!
So when there are 3000 people coming to watch you perform and fork out £40-50 a head they don't give a rat's arse if you use Ableton or Garageband, a Lemur, iPad or your granny's coathangers to do what you do, but you better do it well and there better not be any silence in the middle of your gig. Can the iPad hold up to that? I know the Lemur can...
So as long as you use one hand to control Live with an iPad while holding your cock in the other to masturbate in the safety of your mum's bedroom, by all means, go buy it, but don't be coming in here making silly comparisons between a consumer product and a professional tool for working musicians.

No, I do not work for JazzMutant and do not own a Lemur.

[LoopStationZebra]

I'll make another analogy, just to better illustrate my view on this... If you look at the photography market you have (let's say) 2 categories: professional SLR and consumer compact cameras. They both do the same thing: take pictures. They both have often similar resolutions and menu features are almost identical. Some compact cameras even have interchangeable lenses, and yet... are they a threat to each other on the market? Hardly!
The iPad is a great gadget packed with features and no doubt in many areas will even exceed the capabilities of the Lemur, but professional musicians (and I'm speaking of people actually making a decent living from their productions and touring) look at durability and reliability before anything else in a product. And however solid the iPad is and fulfils these requisites it's just not been around long enough for anyone to say if it will hold it's own in a taxing environment!
Which brings me to another topic (and since this thread has already been hijacked once, why not do it twice?): Stability of Ableton Live.
I have worked as a technician and a sound engineer for years on many large scale gigs for artists often using Live as part of their setup in clubs, indoor concerts and large outdoor festivals alike. Guess how many crashes, glitches or malfunctions (on Live's part) have I witnessed... that's right. NONE! Why? Because on all of those gigs Live was setup and run correctly (and tested at length) on machines which only had one application installed and a single task to perform: To play Live!
So when there are 3000 people coming to watch you perform and fork out £40-50 a head they don't give a rat's arse if you use Ableton or Garageband, a Lemur, iPad or your granny's coathangers to do what you do, but you better do it well and there better not be any silence in the middle of your gig. Can the iPad hold up to that? I know the Lemur can...
So as long as you use one hand to control Live with an iPad while holding your cock in the other to masturbate in the safety of your mum's bedroom, by all means, go buy it, but don't be coming in here making silly comparisons between a consumer product and a professional tool for working musicians.

No, I do not work for JazzMutant and do not own a Lemur.

Lets say that in 6months time the iPad has proven it's build quality as well (as if there's really any doubt, lol). Then what? Again I will ask: What does the Lemur have that the iPad and an excellent, killer app won't also offer - at a fraction of the bloody price?

The Lemur is no different than the Fairlight. Revolutionary. Ground Breaking. Expensive as fuck. And trodden underfoot by less expensive yet arguably more capable devices.

And let me say this: it's not just the iPad. The HP Slate - or any other low cost touchscreen device - has the exact same potential. This isn't necessarily Lemur vs the iPad. This is Lemur vs touchscreen slates in general.

[Maco]

mmmmm I think almost the 85% of live users use MBP and they trust in it and the ipad is from the same company I really think that the ipad is going to have apps as good as the lemur and the lemur is going to have competitive prices as the ipad

my 2c

[dum]

you read too much gizmodo style tech blogs loop.
that, or you're just naturally spasticated.

there's no other explaining your industrial soap opera hero/villain outlook on the iPad ( vs Lemur ....zomfg!!!!!!)

[Tone Deft]

Lets say that in 6months time the iPad has proven it's build quality as well (as if there's really any doubt, lol). Then what? Again I will ask: What does the Lemur have that the iPad and an excellent, killer app won't also offer - at a fraction of the bloody price?

The Lemur is no different than the Fairlight. Revolutionary. Ground Breaking. Expensive as fuck. And trodden underfoot by less expensive yet arguably more capable devices.

And let me say this: it's not just the iPad. The HP Slate - or any other low cost touchscreen device - has the exact same potential. This isn't necessarily Lemur vs the iPad. This is Lemur vs touchscreen slates in general.

the Lemur has MUCH more muscle behind it:
http://www.jazzmutant.com/lemur_features_hard.php
The Lemur also embeds an internal CPU, a powerful GPU (graphic processing unit) as well as a FPU (floating point arithmetic unit), which makes it a quite independent pet for your laptop. In other words, since it manages video rendering and other processor-consuming tasks by itself, it will not overload the processor of the computer.

the iPad has a single 1GHz proprietary microprocessor in it to handle all of the above.

time will tell how this will all shake down. everyone will think they have the one right answer but each should choose on their own. I love my Launch Pad but it's not right for everyone.

Lemur owners will probably get iPads because they clearly have more money than brain.

will iPad owners feel like their underperforming touch screens aren't up to snuff? a quick wank while watching pron on it will cure that.

there are sooooo many other things I'd rather spend $2k on. a guitar, pre-amps, a rhodes piano, a midi drum set, a virus... not something that doesn't even make noise. on its own its not musical. throw a Rhodes piano down the stairs, that's musical, throw a Lemur down the stairs and the only noise is the whine from the pasty skinned chin stroker cutting himself over blowing $2k.

back to pron...
Apple are Nazis about the iStore, if the HP stuff will allow pron, that's a good way to get people to battle with the iStore. pron drives technology, it got the interweb going, it made the decision between blue-ray and HD DVD. the penis rules the world.


I'll probably end up getting one or putting it on a b-day or Xmas list because it's a cool toy and people will definitely come out with some amazing apps for it.

[LoopStationZebra]

I'm saying it's not just the iPad. It's touch in general. The Fairlight comparison is very sound. Jazzmutant has had a device out that no one could compete with because....they practically invented the basic tech. Same with the guys at Fairlight. But within 5 years you had EM-U, Synclavier, etc come out to challenge Fairlight - offering lower cost synths that were just as capable. Not long after Fairlight bites the dust. Fairlight couldn't compete and they died a horrid death.

The Lemur is in the same exact market position. It's still too fucking expensive, and unless they come out with a model that's $1000 or less it's dead in the water. Not that Stantum would or should care. That's the one difference.

[dum]

*yawn*

Jazzmutant is merely the media branch of a touchscreen company operating on the industrial level. Jazzmutant will be doing just fine as long as Stantum are.


talk about beating a horse to death.

[LoopStationZebra]

the Lemur has MUCH more muscle behind it:
http://www.jazzmutant.com/lemur_features_hard.php
The Lemur also embeds an internal CPU, a powerful GPU (graphic processing unit) as well as a FPU (floating point arithmetic unit), which makes it a quite independent pet for your laptop. In other words, since it manages video rendering and other processor-consuming tasks by itself, it will not overload the processor of the computer.

the iPad has a single 1GHz proprietary microprocessor in it to handle all of the above.

time will tell how this will all shake down. everyone will think they have the one right answer but each should choose on their own. I love my Launch Pad but it's not right for everyone.

Lemur owners will probably get iPads because they clearly have more money than brain.

will iPad owners feel like their underperforming touch screens aren't up to snuff? a quick wank while watching pron on it will cure that.

there are sooooo many other things I'd rather spend $2k on. a guitar, pre-amps, a rhodes piano, a midi drum set, a virus... not something that doesn't even make noise. on its own its not musical. throw a Rhodes piano down the stairs, that's musical, throw a Lemur down the stairs and the only noise is the whine from the pasty skinned chin stroker cutting himself over blowing $2k.

back to pron...
Apple are Nazis about the iStore, if the HP stuff will allow pron, that's a good way to get people to battle with the iStore. pron drives technology, it got the interweb going, it made the decision between blue-ray and HD DVD. the penis rules the world.

I'll probably end up getting one or putting it on a b-day or Xmas list because it's a cool toy and people will definitely come out with some amazing apps for it.

Hmm. I'm not sure about the processing power of the Lemur being more powerful. CPU or GPU. I mean, they say 'powerful'. What does that mean? lol. I can't find any real spec info. Does it exist?

And I hear you about the $$$$. I'd still LOVE a Lemur. I think they look excellent. I've never questioned that or their build quality. But at the end of the day it's still too much money in these heady early days of the iPad and *soon* HP Slate.

[LoopStationZebra]

*yawn*

Jazzmutant is merely the media branch of a touchscreen company operating on the industrial level. Jazzmutant will be doing just fine as long as Stantum are.


talk about beating a horse to death.

Pfft. That's what I meant about the difference. They could kill the Lemur right now and it wouldn't make a bit of difference to Stantum. But they sure as shit aren't going to keep it going for 'old times' sake', lol.

[dum]

if they're not losing money on Jazzmutant, why on earth would they dissolve it ?
if jazzmutant is merely a media outlet for a much bigger, more lucrative company - they won't ''die'' at the hands of the iPad. They might have to change things to compete on price point, but die ? ..... please.

is it that hard to grasp ?


Anyway, this is the last I have to say on the topic.... it's officially the second most trite discussion on the board next to Mac/Pc wankery. Hmmm, don't you contribute to those wankfests too ?

/out

[Tone Deft]

Hmm. I'm not sure about the processing power of the Lemur being more powerful. CPU or GPU. I mean, they say 'powerful'. What does that mean? lol. I can't find any real spec info. Does it exist?

I can't find an exact description. on the iPad you have ONE microprocessor doing graphics, math and control. on the Lemur you have three separate chips doing each AND they use specialized chips for each function. an FPU (basically a DSP) does math MUCH faster than a CPU. a GPU does graphics much faster than a CPU. where those tradeoffs come into play, I don't know how slow of a CPU/GPU/FPU combination would compare with a 1GHz CPU.

And I hear you about the $$$$. I'd still LOVE a Lemur. I think they look excellent. I've never questioned that or their build quality. But at the end of the day it's still too much money in these heady early days of the iPad and *soon* HP Slate.

I hung out with a Lemur owner. he showed it to me, then showed me his Martin guitar. the Lemur was never even turned on but we played acoustics until 4am.


it'll be interesting. take the monome folks, they seem to have survived the APC and Launch Pad invasion.

[LoopStationZebra]

Hmmm, don't you contribute to those wankfests too ?

/out

Wait. King of All Wankfests is calling me out?

[Bagle]

http://www.jazzmutant.com/workshop_tuto ... ounddesign

something which wont be easy to do on a ipad. the fact the objects are self aware and interect is something i havent seen on ipod/iphone or ipad, maybe im looking in the wrong places but its those features that put the lemur above the ipad IMO

[tw1nstates]

Hmm. I'm not sure about the processing power of the Lemur being more powerful. CPU or GPU. I mean, they say 'powerful'. What does that mean? lol. I can't find any real spec info. Does it exist?

I can't find an exact description. on the iPad you have ONE microprocessor doing graphics, math and control. on the Lemur you have three separate chips doing each AND they use specialized chips for each function. an FPU (basically a DSP) does math MUCH faster than a CPU. a GPU does graphics much faster than a CPU. where those tradeoffs come into play, I don't know how slow of a CPU/GPU/FPU combination would compare with a 1GHz CPU.

And I hear you about the $$$$. I'd still LOVE a Lemur. I think they look excellent. I've never questioned that or their build quality. But at the end of the day it's still too much money in these heady early days of the iPad and *soon* HP Slate.

I hung out with a Lemur owner. he showed it to me, then showed me his Martin guitar. the Lemur was never even turned on but we played acoustics until 4am.


it'll be interesting. take the monome folks, they seem to have survived the APC and Launch Pad invasion.

Hmm, my thoughts -

Can you watch porn, browse the ableton forum, download a book an ableton and have it in your lap whilst learning some new tricks on the lemur?
how much does the lemur cost in comparison to the touch screen computing devices?

Can you do more on a touchscreen than a Lemur?

etc etc.

It's pretty obvious which is better. . . Price being an important factor as well.

Durablity, hmm, last time I looked most electronic musicians were using lappys just fine without ruggedizing (sp) them. So you aren't going to cart your iPad around with your gear in the back of a truck same as your lappy unless very well protected. So the argument about ruggedness is a bit invalid.

Besides I think that guy who keeps on posting about it being a professional product is a shill for Jazzmutant. .

I used to laugh at my mate using pro-tools le when i was knocking out tunes that got tonnes of airplay on Sonic Foundry's acid.

The whole toy's vs pro gear these days is prety much people justifying their expensive purchases.

I have got what is arguably the best filter unit on the market (schippmann ebbe und flut)_ plus some monster analogue oscliators - I end up using a few decent vintage au's sims (arturia and g force) most of the time cos it's as easy to get a decent sound (to within 10% quality difference) if you know what you are doing.

This whole debate about toys and whatknot is pretty stupid imo. they are all f*cking amazing machines. 5 years ago I would have cut off a small part of flesh to have the gear I have got now as digital - not just the plugs and whatknot but the raw power. Yeah the ipad is pretty underpowered but it's still way more powerful than my first 2 music computers. . .

PLus it's loads more powerful than an Akai sampler / Roland Jp8000 / all the emu modules etc.

If you reckon it's a toy and just for idios then I think that is a remarkable lack of foresight.

I am sure it's not going to be long before we start getting ones that run a decent os (or i'll get a windows 7 one) and not locked into shit like the apple store. they can suck my balls regarding that but no matter what, just for touch operation of my rig I want one. . .