Ableton Forum

andyb19844 wrote:
People keep talking like we need to change all this n that , All you would have to do is make a session view where you can se 2 or 3 waves forms horizontal and with the EQ's and filter on one screen., just the setup ,its not that drastic

cant you patch such a thing in max for live?.

3phase wrote:

andyb19844 wrote:
People keep talking like we need to change all this n that , All you would have to do is make a session view where you can se 2 or 3 waves forms horizontal and with the EQ's and filter on one screen., just the setup ,its not that drastic

cant you patch such a thing in max for live?.

The problem with multiple waveforms in Live is that you don´t have a track limit, if you have 10 tracks running, you will need some way to tell Live what tracks you will want to see the waveform, and it´s where things get complicated. Traktor have 4, Torq has 2, FIXED waveforms, much more simple...

And I don´t thing that is possible with M4L...

IMHO...

For me Live is first and foremost about experimentation. Like a kind of musical laboratory.

That is what makes it a distinctive product that stands out as different from other music software.

Any move away from that would be a step backwards in my opinion.

So if we worked all worked at Ableton, as I begining to think we should (Biscuit and Tea anyone !!)

The are we saying that the user base split between musicians, creative sound engineers, dj's, and everyone else in between.

Would be insulted if the company decided to add a product to the Ableton range aimed at Erghhh 'DJ' or 'Track Performers'.

I think not, we'd mostly likely support the idea, but turn away from it, if it's not needed.

Bring on the 'Track Performer' call it ..

Come on think of a name, I'm begining to see the light...

Erghhh Ableton 'Spin' 'Trax' 'Entract'

crumhorn wrote:For me Live is first and foremost about experimentation. Like a kind of musical laboratory.

That is what makes it a distinctive product that stands out as different from other music software.

Any move away from that would be a step backwards in my opinion.

i thought the program for that is called reaktor?

rsaulo wrote:

3phase wrote:

andyb19844 wrote:
People keep talking like we need to change all this n that , All you would have to do is make a session view where you can se 2 or 3 waves forms horizontal and with the EQ's and filter on one screen., just the setup ,its not that drastic

cant you patch such a thing in max for live?.

The problem with multiple waveforms in Live is that you don´t have a track limit, if you have 10 tracks running, you will need some way to tell Live what tracks you will want to see the waveform, and it´s where things get complicated. Traktor have 4, Torq has 2, FIXED waveforms, much more simple...

And I don´t thing that is possible with M4L...

IMHO...

why is it so important to see the waveforms? you cant see them on vinyl either and dj´s manged to mix with that just fine

ableton should optimize the accelerate/break buttons.. on synced materials a nudging is much more important than an rough accelerate/ break.. actualy booth functions could be combined easily... short click = 0,1 ms nudge longer click acc/break sets in


ok nudging without clicking is difficult.. maybe an automateted short accelleration that gives a defined step forward or backward on a short click and build up after a litlle grace period when held down longer.

As it is now its pretty hard to get 2 beats precisly on each other. Traktor is performing much better in this regard even without nudging

3phase wrote:

rsaulo wrote:

3phase wrote:
why is it so important to see the waveforms? you cant see them on vinyl either and dj´s manged to mix with that just fine

+1

The only reason you need to see multiple waveforms when djing is when you are trying to beatmatch visually (which you shouldn't really need if you actually know what you are doing), and since you don't need to beatmatch with live, this is completely unnecessary. I would recommend actually listening to your tracks to figure out where the breakdowns and such are, rather than relying on visual information. 3phase is on point as usual.

In this recent interview with Henke, he discusses why they will not make a DJ version, or are even thinking about DJs that much at all:

http://www.ravemagazine.com.au/content/view/25465/191/


CP: On the subject of Native Instruments, it seems to me that recently their Traktor product has eaten into Ableton’s market share in the DJing software niche – Traktor is now the de facto product, whereas a few years ago it was Live. How do you feel about this competition in the sector?

RH: As a matter of fact, we’re not very concerned about this specific niche, because Live has a very open structure that allows users to do vastly different things. And the one thing we learnt, looking at what our users are doing, is that they are doing totally different things than what we anticipated. The segment who are using live as a DJ tool is not the biggest segment, but at the same time it is a group of people who have very specific demands. We had a period in the development of Live, maybe four or five years ago, where we were considering moving more towards the DJ user. Then we figured out that if we want to do this we’d have to sacrifice usability for a lot of other users, so we decided against streamlining Live in that direction. We actually don’t see something like Traktor as competition because we believe that if you’re into a more classical approach to DJing, then something like Traktor is much more powerful anyway. But if you come more from a Live performance background, if you want to add a few tracks on top of that – if you come from a production background, then maybe Live is the better choice.

[/djs]

Tarekith wrote:In this recent interview with Henke, he discusses why they will not make a DJ version, or are even thinking about DJs that much at all:

http://www.ravemagazine.com.au/content/view/25465/191/


CP: On the subject of Native Instruments, it seems to me that recently their Traktor product has eaten into Ableton’s market share in the DJing software niche – Traktor is now the de facto product, whereas a few years ago it was Live. How do you feel about this competition in the sector?

RH: As a matter of fact, we’re not very concerned about this specific niche, because Live has a very open structure that allows users to do vastly different things. And the one thing we learnt, looking at what our users are doing, is that they are doing totally different things than what we anticipated. The segment who are using live as a DJ tool is not the biggest segment, but at the same time it is a group of people who have very specific demands. We had a period in the development of Live, maybe four or five years ago, where we were considering moving more towards the DJ user. Then we figured out that if we want to do this we’d have to sacrifice usability for a lot of other users, so we decided against streamlining Live in that direction. We actually don’t see something like Traktor as competition because we believe that if you’re into a more classical approach to DJing, then something like Traktor is much more powerful anyway. But if you come more from a Live performance background, if you want to add a few tracks on top of that – if you come from a production background, then maybe Live is the better choice.

funny how he doesn't even mention the bridge at all?

Tone Deft wrote:[/djs]

Nah, people have been DJing with live since it came out, it's not like it's something we can't do still Dual waveforms would be nice, but it's not essential or anything.

just my schtick.

after the countless hours I've spent on dancefloors and listening to the radio I can't be all that genuine.

i also find visualisation is absolutely not needed as all is synced and cue point PRE- set anyway.
then spillting screen in two or 4 you loose lot of def. better quick clic a midi button or key and get full rez imo,
and let ableton focus on much more important stuff.

I use the waveform view in live a lot. A lot of the downtempo I play doesn't follow the simpler song structure of dance music, so it's super useful for being able to really plan out transition points. I thought the dual (quad) wave view of Traktor were going to be a great thing, but yeah, they're so small that you really can't see precise measure markers anyway, so I rarely used them.

In Live, I just have a button mapped to quickly flip back and forth to the wave views on my "deck" tracks, so it's only a quick button press to see both waveforms.