Ableton Forum

It handles 128 steps, per "scene selection" buttons.

Thanks Juan - great to hear.

Oh also, can it be used to sequence battery or just uses the drum rack from ableton?

ryanpapa wrote:Oh also, can it be used to sequence battery or just uses the drum rack from ableton?

You could use Battery, but I am not sure why you'd want to after figuring out DrumRacks

@ ryanpapa:

Oh also, can it be used to sequence battery or just uses the drum rack from ableton?

You can use any kind of instrument with the APC Step Sequencer.

@ JuanSOLO: Sorry for my late replies!

OK so I have been thinking this one over for a bit before trying to take another stab at re-working Mark's sequencer patch to add velocity.

I have come to the conclusion that it would be fantastic to choose velocity per note using all the knobs on the APC40. Old school hardware sequencer style. Just like there is the "running light" on the matrix, if it could be patched where the ringed encoders "running light" were full rings and otherwise, the single line.

So as the matrix running light progresses, the encoder rings follow, and the encoder could dial in velocity as opposed to choosing velocity with buttons, and a bunch of pushing buttons on and off to get desired velocity values.

Including the encoders into the step-sequencer is a very nice idea and in my opinion one of the few viable solutions if you want to have more control over velocity. However, programming the encoders with MFL is currently not an easy task and requires a lot of workarounds. Me and Shane Hazelton from Akai were working on a patch that would make use of the encoders, but never made it release ready, because it used so many workarounds. However, we might post our alpha-version on maxforlive.com soon, so you could use it to dig into the encoder part of the APC40.

But what I plan to do in a next update of the APC Step Seq is the following: As soon as you select a sound via the Clip-Stop-Buttons/Sound-Selection-Buttons, the APC40 would focus automatically onto the device that is located in the corresponding drum-rack / instrument-rack-chain, so that the device-control encoders would automatically map on that device. This would allow you to tweak each sound individually via the APC40 as soon as you have it selected without having to touch the mouse.

Maybe I am confused on the path things are taking, or better yet WHEN things are taking place. In what order do things take place?

When the patch is active i.e the track it sits on is selected, what happens in what order with the velocity values?

There are several things happening at different points of time:

A. When the device loads / is activated / the clip-focus changes / the notes in the clip are changed
--> All notes are loaded from the clip, the velocity values are transformed into patch-internal values and everything is stored in a jit.cellblock which I call "clip_db". Each row of the "clip_db" represents one note-value, while each column represents one step out of 128.
After that, B gets triggered.

(see section of the patch: "Load notes from current selected clip into cellblock")

B. When you select a sound / change pages
--> The patch queries the "clip_db" for the 32-values that correspond to the selected sound(=note) & page (steps 1-32, 33-64, etc.) and then sends it to the APC. Since the internal values stored in the "clip_db" correspond to the LED-values of the APC, no transformation is needed.
(see section of the patch: "Query Cellblock for selected set of 32 notes" & "Translate values into grid LED information")

C. When you add / delete notes
--> Again, "clip_db" is queried for the note, that corresponds to the button pressed on the APC. If the value is NULL/"0", it turns it into "1" and writes it back into the "clip_db". if the value is not NULL/"0", it clears the corresponding value in the "clip_db". If you hold down the SHIFT-/Stop-all-Clips-Button, it will write a "3" (=Accent) into the "clip_db" no matter whether the queried value was NULL/"O" or not. (see "Translate button presses into notes").

After the clip_db got updated, a trigger is sent to "Update the Midi-Clip". Here, all notes inside the clip are first deleted. Then, the whole "clip_db" gets dumped, patch-internal velocity-values get translated back into Midi-velocity-values. Finally, the patch writes the dump into the, now empty, clip.
Since the notes in the clips changed now, A is triggered and the display of the APC updates automatically.


It's quite complicated, but hopefully my explanation helps you implementing your velocity feature.

Good luck,
Mark

Mark Egloff wrote: But what I plan to do in a next update of the APC Step Seq is the following: As soon as you select a sound via the Clip-Stop-Buttons/Sound-Selection-Buttons, the APC40 would focus automatically onto the device that is located in the corresponding drum-rack / instrument-rack-chain, so that the device-control encoders would automatically map on that device. This would allow you to tweak each sound individually via the APC40 as soon as you have it selected without having to touch the mouse.

I have implemented this^^^ into my customized version of your patch. I also made the clip stop buttons blink according to midi notes. I find it faster to recognize which clip stop button to push when it is flashing in response to the sound you hear. I have scene selection 5 toggling "prelisten"

After working with your patch quite a bit there are a few things I would change just to make the layout a bit better. For example the "Stop All Clips" should toggle prelisten, and the scene 5 button should be the shifted button. It makes more since in relation to the rest of the layout. HOWEVER there is also the idea of moving the clip stop button behavior to the 5th Matrix row, so the 5th row would be for hitting sounds having more LED colors for blinking according to midi notes playing. When working with drumRacks or drum beats in a sequencer fashion, I always want to SOLO sounds. The clip stop button could be used for that. Lastly, it would be cool to toggle a "Follow" feature for bar length, so if you make a 128 bar sequence the scene buttons follow through it automatically. Being able to toggle follow, and set velocity are 2 things the Hanz Script has over your patch, however I think your patch has a better layout when actually sequencing beats, especially if you have over 5 drum sounds. I used to like the sequencer layout of the Hanz Script where the sounds were stacked on the matrix rows, but when actually using it, it's almost too fast trying to keep up. Your patch is much more user friendly when you can follow the running light on 4 rows and focus on just one sound at a time. Anyways those are just a few thought I had, I really need to post a video of using you patch in my latest Live set.

I'm really looking forward to ANY updates you make to it. ALSO, the patch you mentioned about the encoders, should be shared on M4L.com in whatever state it is in. Regardless of how many workarounds it uses it sounds like a valuable patch to anyone with an APC40.


Thanks for the breakdown on the order of operations with your patch too!

I also made the clip stop buttons blink according to midi notes. I find it faster to recognize which clip stop button to push when it is flashing in response to the sound you hear.

Actually, the patch is supposed to do that (as you can see in the youtube-video), but with the 5.1.8 update, a bug was introduced to the jit.cellblock object, which messed up the feedback for incomming Midi-notes. It's easy to fix (with our beloved "deferlow"-object in front of jit.cellblock) and will work when I post an update on maxforlive.com.

AWESOME, totally looking forward to the update!

How about using the #5 scene launch button as a "Part Mute" and using the stop all clips button as "Solo". Of course shift would have to be relocated..... to the SHIFT button!!! sorry apc20 user's

The mute and solo led feedback could work similar to this device

JuanSOLO wrote:

Mark Egloff wrote: But what I plan to do in a next update of the APC Step Seq is the following: As soon as you select a sound via the Clip-Stop-Buttons/Sound-Selection-Buttons, the APC40 would focus automatically onto the device that is located in the corresponding drum-rack / instrument-rack-chain, so that the device-control encoders would automatically map on that device. This would allow you to tweak each sound individually via the APC40 as soon as you have it selected without having to touch the mouse.

I have implemented this^^^ into my customized version of your patch. I also made the clip stop buttons blink according to midi notes. I find it faster to recognize which clip stop button to push when it is flashing in response to the sound you hear. I have scene selection 5 toggling "prelisten"

After working with your patch quite a bit there are a few things I would change just to make the layout a bit better. For example the "Stop All Clips" should toggle prelisten, and the scene 5 button should be the shifted button. It makes more since in relation to the rest of the layout. HOWEVER there is also the idea of moving the clip stop button behavior to the 5th Matrix row, so the 5th row would be for hitting sounds having more LED colors for blinking according to midi notes playing. When working with drumRacks or drum beats in a sequencer fashion, I always want to SOLO sounds. The clip stop button could be used for that. Lastly, it would be cool to toggle a "Follow" feature for bar length, so if you make a 128 bar sequence the scene buttons follow through it automatically. Being able to toggle follow, and set velocity are 2 things the Hanz Script has over your patch, however I think your patch has a better layout when actually sequencing beats, especially if you have over 5 drum sounds. I used to like the sequencer layout of the Hanz Script where the sounds were stacked on the matrix rows, but when actually using it, it's almost too fast trying to keep up. Your patch is much more user friendly when you can follow the running light on 4 rows and focus on just one sound at a time. Anyways those are just a few thought I had, I really need to post a video of using you patch in my latest Live set.

I'm really looking forward to ANY updates you make to it. ALSO, the patch you mentioned about the encoders, should be shared on M4L.com in whatever state it is in. Regardless of how many workarounds it uses it sounds like a valuable patch to anyone with an APC40.


Thanks for the breakdown on the order of operations with your patch too!

Also check out this video, when he does the "Part Mute" you see the led feedback!

Happens at about 1:40
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4FszqoJ ... re=related

@Markemark:

I've planned to implement muting a sound in the next update (which will disable the corresponding midi-notes in the clip).

It would work like this: When you hold down the SHIFT-/Stop-all-Clips-Button, the Sound-Selection-/Clip-Stop-Buttons would light up if the corresponding sound is enabled. While holding down SHIFT, you could press the Sound-Selection-Button to disable the corresponding Sound and the LED light would be turned off.

This way, you could prepare your setup with clips that have different sounds muted at the beginning, without having to store any information in the patch.

Soloing would work in a similar way, but I'm not sure what kind of button-combination I should use for it (should for in the same way for APC20 and APC40).

Cheers,
Mark

It seems to me the best buttons to choose are the most obvious ones, Activator (mute), Solo (solo).

Since much of the APC40 gets disabled when activating sequence mode, why not just disable more of it.

The solo/cue buttons are very important if you want to use several Step-Seqs in a performance, since you can create your next beat with CUE enabled (given that you have a second Audio-out to prelisten) while the other patterns are playing.

Also, disabling the Activator/Solo/Recording buttons individually is currently not easy to implement (disabling is okay, but not reenabling)...

True. I'm not sure what Markemark means by "Part Mute." I've never played with an Electribe.

However, I disable my Activator and Solo buttons, and dont really re-enable them, I just assign a path to them that gives them default functionality, and toggle between the custom assignment (in my case send A and B) and default, Mute and SOLO.

One day I will just build my own 32 step hardware sequencer with all the bells and whistles. Until then the APC40 will do the trick.

Mark Egloff wrote:The solo/cue buttons are very important if you want to use several Step-Seqs in a performance, since you can create your next beat with CUE enabled (given that you have a second Audio-out to prelisten) while the other patterns are playing.

Also, disabling the Activator/Solo/Recording buttons individually is currently not easy to implement (disabling is okay, but not reenabling)...

I agree, if you watch the video, you will see he set the next pattern(clip) to be played but the current pattern is 4 bars long so the screen is blinking the next pattern(clip) coming up. Before the change of patterns he does a kind of breakdown by "Part muting" the first three sounds(his main drums). Once the next pattern starts the "Part muting" info is not retained, nor is it retained with the first pattern because when he triggers that pattern again there is no muting.