Ableton Forum

woops repost

Metaphreaq wrote:That may have came off as I am condoning it. really I enjoy pretty much doing everything live, I use either launchpad with some of monome emulator stuff, or maschine. however half the time people think I'm dj'ing anyways, I shrug.

hence at least a partial point of my view we are basically the only musical entity that lets itself get a way with no rules, it's kind of a 'were getting what we deserve' reaction going on out there.

people don't know if were djing or not
people don't know if what we made was a remix or not ( I mean when and in what other genre did keeping the vocals but totally replacing all of the original music become a remix if that's not some bullshit then I don't know what
else is, remember when a remix was someone taking a great or not great song and trying to make it better or create an alternative version of it by actually remixing it, but now I can nab your vocal and put an 808 4on the floor beat under it and that constipation constitutes a remix

anyway before i go blue in the face off that one I'll get back on track, so we want to be received like a regular music group whether it be a band, a duo , a group or whatever but we don't want to play by the same rules cause as soon as the macbook hits the stage I should be able to drink a cup of coffee while my oh so complex patch that I spent a week creating goes through it's modulations and you should be awestruck while watching me drink my coffee and listen to my
patch play out, as a matter of fact you should pay money to come and watch me watch my patch play out, and by golly don't make me go buckwild and start twisting that cutoff knob cause for that you might have to pay extra.

methinks we need to get over ourselves just a bit so that we can catch up to those other musicians that we assume we are so far beyond. how electronic musicians think tim exile is a god but that turntablist are beneath them is just beyond me and of course everyone doesn't think that but enough do.

I'm sick of dj mixes with no dj mixing
sick of remixes with no (re) cause you didn't re-do anything you just replaced the music with something else entirely
sick of written freestyle raps that were written before you freestyled them
sick of computer muscians claiming that the computer is an instrument but refusing to play it
sick of autotune
sick of glitches
sick of wobbles
sick of singles where's the damn album
remember when gangsters didn't dance and everybody else did, well now everybody else won't dance and the gangsters do...I'm sick of that shit!
sick of people saying the phrase stuck in the past
the past was way fucking better!!!!!!!

and do me one favor, stop raising the fuckin roof that damn roof has been raised enough it can't go any higher remember you didn't want any water along time ago so you let the damn thing burn.

and just for your information I've done everything on that list with the omission of fake freestyling and autotune but I'm still sick of all of it.

How long have you been doing this?

Anyways, these are just abstractions, I've seen people do grand things live just hunched over their laptop using a mouse. I know they are doing something , but consumers are consumers, people will always want 'a show' and how an artist interprets that is up to them. I myself have interpreted it many ways, and found fun ways of doing what I like that engages with people.

with your remix comment, wouldn't the process of taking that vocal and layering it constitute a mixing process... and then wouldn't someone need to mix it again?

just poking you.

starving student wrote:sick of singles where's the damn album

agreed

Metaphreaq wrote:How long have you been doing this?

Anyways, these are just abstractions, I've seen people do grand things live just hunched over their laptop using a mouse. I know they are doing something , but consumers are consumers, people will always want 'a show' and how an artist interprets that is up to them. I myself have interpreted it many ways, and found fun ways of doing what I like that engages with people.

with your remix comment, wouldn't the process of taking that vocal and layering it constitute a mixing process... and then wouldn't someone need to mix it again?

just poking you.

to each his own disclaimer and all that but to answer your question it really depends on who you are and how you see things. The thing that bothers me is not people do these things, it's that people do these things in the computer music realm but then expect artist to hold steadfast to the rules outside of the computer realm.

If you adhere to the definition of artist, and believe in such a thing as artforms and also believe that you are partaking in
one then you should follow the rules that you expect others to follow that define that artform. the thing that pisses me off about (not electronic musicians) but computer electronic musicians is that we say we want to be treated like the other music artist but in the same breathe we don't allow ourselves to be.
I know what it's like to drop an pella over some entirely unrelated music and I know what it's like to take a song and actually remix the song and they are not the same thing in the least, now if you believe you're an artist then you might also believe in artistic integrity and if one has integrity then just call it what it is. There's nothing wrong with dropping pellas and I'm not saying there is, I have and use a gang of them but stop calling it a remix, a remix already has a definition and just because a person wants to call something a remix that isn't a remix doesn't make it a remix.

why make a mixtape that doesn't have any mixing on it, really what is someone trying to do when they deliberately title their effort with another artforms title, is that the same as calling yourself a dj when you're not a dj , really what's going on there. if somebody called them-self a guitarist and you handed them a guitar and they couldn't play it you'd be like fuck outta here with that, or if they called themself a rapper but couldn't rap you'd laugh them off stage. where does using a computer give us the right to expect less integrity from ourselves in the musical artworld.
even the lowly hiphop djs that we love to look down on while we're raising the roof and trying to steal any of their antics
we can get our hands on have rules to their artform. we call them and their vinyl antiquated and dated but at least they have a language, they've got crabs, chirps, and flares, all manner of sophisticated growth and we have nothing, well we do have 'wobble' but we call them and their tools oldschool hahaha the joke is on whom ever doesn't want to pay attention to the joke.
I'm not saying we need to be like everyone else either I'm saying it would help if we didn't try to garner everyone elses shine by calling ourselves and what we do the same as everyone else when it's obviously not, the most important thing about any artform imho is to tell the truth about it or else how will anybody understand it and how will it be able to progress in a healthy fashion. so first tell the truth about it, and then put value in the mastery of it.

this guy seems as live as it gets for one man doing electronic music...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jEcXjS7V ... re=related

kev herb wrote:this guy seems as live as it gets for one man doing electronic music...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jEcXjS7V ... re=related

exactly, and he doesn't have to apologize for using a computer, it's not even an issue because he 1.tells the truth about what he does and 2. has mastered it. that's a far cry from lying about what you do and expecting accolades cause you turned a knob. and on top of that Jeremy gets paid for being true to the artform.

It's important to

1. Have a good margin of error and
2. it be noticeable that nothing is happening if you aren't doing anything
to be respectable
imo
ie Mr Ellis

standard rules as far as I'm concerned

like, don't be so dependent on quantization

I agree , also the Ellis videos are amazing. Hope to see more and more things like that.

The J. Ellis on the beach video...now that is a live remix!

Vresky, I agree completely. That's why when I went to see a drumpac / MPC show* recently, it was one of the most exciting electronic music events I've been to. All of it was truly live; every beat corresponding with the musician's fingers (some background looping too, but mostly live percussion/triggering).

Ableton Live is a great program because you can do things *LIVE*. I have all the respect in the world for people who spend weeks constructing a track and composing in a more traditional way. But if I'm going to a live performance, I want to see live musicianship, not someone with everything pre-recorded!

http://www.redbullusa.com/cs/Satellite/ ... 3108077182

there weren't much electronic dance performances in the 90s.
now it is changed cos there are too many artists so they had to come up with something new to being preferred to non-performing artists.
it's about make a living out of music.
these shows makes me boring or laugh. maybe because i find a "non-fake" pop or rock show (and music) wtf

d-track wrote:there weren't much electronic dance performances in the 90s.
now it is changed cos there are too many artists so they had to come up with something new to being preferred to non-performing artists.
it's about make a living out of music.
these shows makes me boring or laugh. maybe because i find a "non-fake" pop or rock show (and music) wtf

where were you in the 90's? chemical brothers, prodigy, underworld, crystal method, etc all performed live using truck load of gear and no computer in sight

i'm not talking about pop music but if i would i dont think 4 artist (plus an "etc"?) count as _much_

This is not fake :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4zN7Pjwj ... ata_player