Ableton Forum

it's pretty ironic eh, it sounds like everyone on the forum should move round one place !
For every person finding a cool scene in a new town there are residents declaring it dead.
My girlfriend would move to NY in a heartbeat because of the great scene she finds there, while our NY friends want to move here (Liverpool!)

It's odd how even the hottest city can cool on you when you get there.
Last time I was in Barcelona with my resident friends we were out every night, I said - " it must be great here with the nightlife" , they replied "since you arrived is the most we have gone out in a year!" they said "normally we just work and go to the local bar". It's not unusual.

Anyone read the pop-philosophical "the Art of Travel" by Alain de Botton? In part of it he details how he is tormented through a London winter by the thought of Barbadian beaches, white sand, waving palms. That is what he needs. He goes to Barbados.

when there he lies on the white sand beneath waving palms and thinks of an essay he needs to finish, he worries about a contract, he argues with his girlfriend which sours a romantic meal. He realises that these things didn't feature in his vision of Barbados, in fact , he and his problems were absent from the dream. THAT was what he wanted really, his worries - absent!
but travelling to barbados only made them more visible by their incongruity in such a beautiful surrounding.

often we travel just to see where we came from more clearly.

personally I like the idea of oscillating between different places rather than moving permanently. I am a bit stupid and require a lot of perspective shifting to figure out what I really need. If I'm in any place too long it stops inspiring me.

djadonis206 wrote:My life sucks so i want to get out of Capitol Hill, Seattle, AMERICA

basically I'm thinking of moving abroad to Spain - but I need to like give up my citizenship and get citizenship correct - not to mention find a job, learn the language and find a place to live

I'd have to ship my computer, records and bed but other than that - what else

anyone ever make that move? From here to there but I mean waaaaaaay over there?

Is it a long process or easy?

Why does my life suck - well lets see, ahh fuck it I'm not goign ot go into details I just want to get out of America and start over

Actually I'd bring all my samples to tell the truth so not completely over

As an expat living abroad, my advice to you is to do the following:

1. Start saving up plenty of cash (I'd say be prepared to live from savings for at least 6-12 months)
2. Start learning the language of where you're going to go. Use netflix and rent every foreign film you can find in the language you're learning... works great.
3. Don't worry about your worldly possessions, especially things like records and books (and especially furniture). Just leave it all behind and have it mailed to you later if you need it. You'll find that you never even miss most of your shit.

As far as the job stuff goes, I'm self-employed, and the visa process for that is a huge bitch. From what I understand, the easiest way to work in another country is to either do so with the US gov't, or a US corporation with offices in that country. Other than that, it's just a matter of doing your homework and finding something that works for you.

Angstrom wrote:it's pretty ironic eh, it sounds like everyone on the forum should move round one place !
..........
Anyone read the pop-philosophical "the Art of Travel" by Alain de Botton? .....

nice post Angstrom - definitely alot of sense in that - you cant escape your problems by getting on a plane.

But then again, I'm not sure I'd want to live in Bush's USA, no more than I did Blair's Britain, but coming to Australia The government here is probably closer to Bush than Blair anyway, Government is another thing you cant escape,

at least in Australia you feel a bit more seperate from it. In the UK it felt like every sensational news story was thrust upon you and a matter of utmost urgency - everywhere you look the news is there, Billboards, TV, radio, word of mouth - everwhere - it just doesnt feel like that here - there's a real detached feeling that whatever's happening it doesnt really matter and is probably a long way away.

Not sure if that's a good thing or not.

I really notice it talking to my mum on the phone because she tells me what's going on in the world like it's part of her life.

In truth, I didnt really feel like I necessarily wanted to leave, it feels strange being so far from my family and I miss some friends too, And I really miss Real Ale on tap.
in England I always seemed to meet somebody into electronic music - I just dont get that feeling here, they still really like their guitars here, there just isnt the population to support a really varied scene - Melbourne sounds like it would be good, but we have no one at all there.

SO fuck knows where the bloody grass is greener, maybe we should all be content with yellow.

i'd just like to comment on the fact that someone said they thought nyc was boring. did you leave your apartment? do you hate everything? there's so much to do in nyc, you could do something new every day for the rest of your life.

Definetly the best way to experience any place is to travel there first and move around a bit.

Spain has plenty of areas where there's as many English as there are Spanish, especially on the coast. So language is not a huge problem.

Get saving, get a backpack and get over for the summer. Plenty of jobs in Summer, don't expect to earn much at first, but there's a lot of opportunities in some of the up and coming coastal areas. If you DJ, there's plenty of clubs and bars in the mainland where they need DJ's in Summer. Don't expect to earn a huge amount but you can survive and meet like minded people.

If you're a good salesman, selling rental properties can pay good money, although expect to work everyday of the week. Also this work tends to die back in the peak summer months as it gets hot!

I have many friends in Spain, they all do just fine.

Get a ticket and go would be my advice, but have some money in the bank first.

snowtires wrote:i'd just like to comment on the fact that someone said they thought nyc was boring. did you leave your apartment? do you hate everything? there's so much to do in nyc, you could do something new every day for the rest of your life.

This is true... every city can be dull if you just sit inside. However, my dad (who travels to NYC rather frequently for business) says that "everytime you turn around in that city, you spend 100$". Although, all things considered, I guess that london is the same way.

Nice toughts, guys. I share them.
I'm also planning to move to barcelona in one or two years - my girl has spanish citizenship, being grandaughter of a spanish. I just dunno if I also can get my EU citizenship trough that.
Being in Brazil, I can't complain about many things, except the work. As a producer-musician, making from games and movies soundtracks to band's records and club playing with Live, the conditions here are tuff and poorly payed. Few cultural atractions to see, less respect with "not essential" jobs, such as music and art in general.
I'd figured out that spain would be a nice choice for a restart. How difficult is to get places to play and work with music around (not just barcelona, but another places and countries nearby)?
best luck for the travellers,
Sub

nebulae wrote: The alternative is to go to a country that welcomes immigrants. Two good options are Canada and Australia. Both have easier ways to get in than Europe.

Why don'tcha come on up to Canada, eh? We're not as warm as Australia, but it's a good place!

Angstrom wrote:personally I like the idea of oscillating between different places rather than moving permanently. I am a bit stupid and require a lot of perspective shifting to figure out what I really need. If I'm in any place too long it stops inspiring me.

Word. Since 2001, I've lived in:

Winnipeg, Manitoba
Yellowknife, Northwest Territories
Montreal, Quebec
Ottawa, Ontario

That's 4 cities in 5 years. nuts!

Sure, it's all Canada, but in a place like Canada there's enough regional variance in culture, language, climate and atmosphere that it's really easy to get the "new experience", but not having to deal with immigration issues.

nebulae wrote:Moving to Europe is next to impossible.

YGBSM! ANYONE can waltz into the UK, not work, and live comfortably off the taxpayer. Just claim political asylum.

Visit London. English isn't the first language any more.

all this talk about moving abroad - I can't help but day dream about moving to London or Spain and writing a jam with one of you guys - the jams goes huge and we start gigging all over the world

then I get AIDS and die but the music lives on!

djadonis206 wrote:My life sucks so i want to get out of Capitol Hill, Seattle, AMERICA

basically I'm thinking of moving abroad to Spain - but I need to like give up my citizenship and get citizenship correct - not to mention find a job, learn the language and find a place to live

I'd have to ship my computer, records and bed but other than that - what else

anyone ever make that move? From here to there but I mean waaaaaaay over there?

Is it a long process or easy?

Why does my life suck - well lets see, ahh fuck it I'm not goign ot go into details I just want to get out of America and start over

Actually I'd bring all my samples to tell the truth so not completely over

Where ever you go, there you will be. You might as well face your problems here so that you can enjoy Spain when you get there, otherwise you'll just recreate the same problems.

Riley

Acervuli wrote:
Where ever you go, there you will be. You might as well face your problems here so that you can enjoy Spain when you get there, otherwise you'll just recreate the same problems.

Riley

True but at least I wont have these problems with new girls I meet and I just want to get as far away from this situation right here I've created...or I could face the problem and wade the storm out.

but I do want to move regardless...

snowtires wrote:i'd just like to comment on the fact that someone said they thought nyc was boring. did you leave your apartment? do you hate everything? there's so much to do in nyc, you could do something new every day for the rest of your life.

hehe, i wish that was the case. dude, i'm the wierd cat who always shows up with his gear, ready to play, or record or dj or whatever. ALWAYS. what was considered to be a "go getter" attitude in other countries has made people consider me arrogant here. i sleep 5 hours a night and the rest othat time is spent exploring the city to see if there is a hidden vibrant forward thinking electronic music scene, and although i've played all the big clubs in town at least once, and have done dozens of afterparties, i find a palpable lack of ability to truly let ones self go, here, on the part of...just about everyone. maybe people are scared of cops, and each other, maybe the coke comedown is starting to make them cranky, or maybe there is a deep need for the regurgitated familiarity that permeates the club scene...i don't know. i just know that i live this life and most, but definitely not all, of the people one meets in the night scene here, dont...they seem, IMO, to be half interested scenster tourists whose interests were peaked from a magazine article or a movie....not genuine love.

now dont get me wrong. NYC is very nice, in a "once was cool but sold out to disney" kind of way. i mean, i like sony playstation sponsored graffiti as much as the next person. i'd imagine that if i were one of the MILLIONS of mutated wallet sized dog-thingies that new yorkers tend to carry around, i'd probably think this was heaven, but i like dirty loud, never ending parties with big bouncy distorted basslines and speed freaks doing their...speed freak dance, and hearing something in the music that is rude, pornographic and completely unfamiliar yet inviting. the closest i'm seeing here is moldover and shakey's warper parties @ botanica bar [which was really good tuesday night!].

NYC is a beautiful city with loads of gorgeous women and the possiblity of little adventure excursions on a daily basis. the trains run 24 hours a day, and you can get pretty good sushi at 3am. that said, the club scene here sucks. it is big, bright, shiny, pretentious, dull, and lifeless.

all i have to do is sell 700 CDs on the street and in the subway to get the money i need to get back to europe, so for the 1-3 months that goal takes, i plan to avoid the club scene here, alt all costs [EXCEPT for the set that i'm doing at next months WARPER PARTY on may 23rd ], and spend alot more time in central park and the village, playing on the street, meeting and playing with other musicians and artists. NYC is beautiful in the spring and summer, but the dance/electronic music scene just doesnt do it for me.

onyx

djadonis206 wrote:

Acervuli wrote:
Where ever you go, there you will be. You might as well face your problems here so that you can enjoy Spain when you get there, otherwise you'll just recreate the same problems.

Riley

True but at least I wont have these problems with new girls I meet and I just want to get as far away from this situation right here I've created...or I could face the problem and wade the storm out.

but I do want to move regardless...

New Girls helps allot. I here they are beautiful in Spain!